Army Why are we getting out these days?

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Why are you getting out of the Army?

  • AHLTA

    Votes: 2 25.0%

  • Pay

    Votes: 1 12.5%

  • Deployments

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Brigade surgeon/"broadening" tours

    Votes: 4 50.0%

  • F-F games (last minute mandatory training or no leave, etc)

    Votes: 7 87.5%

  • Other

    Votes: 4 50.0%
  • Total voters
    8
T

turkish

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Used to be mainly deployment burden and the destruction of clinical skills, then AHLTA, and much lower down was the comparatively low pay. What is it now?

I am not an AMEDD muckity muck or a recruiter. Just a fellow field grade doc wondering what's driving my classmates out.
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Is deployment not as much of a thing anymore? How often are physicians being deployed, and for how long? Is it equal amongst all specialties?
 
boneboulderer said:
Is deployment not as much of a thing anymore? How often are physicians being deployed, and for how long? Is it equal amongst all specialties?
Click to expand...

not sure where you may have heard this, but in the army deployments are very much still a "thing." army deployments are 9 months, potentially shorter if you are a surgical specialty and need to switch due to skill atrophy. the most deployed specialties as of a few years ago were FP, peds, gen surg. in my personal experience this has held true-- primary care fill the PROFIS slots with combat units. currently at my MEDCEN "every deployable provider is currently on a tasker" per my OIC. whether this is true or not I have no idea.

deployments will soon be getting worse. trump has handed the keys to the chicken coop to the foxes-- ie, the generals are getting to decide troop levels. no general has ever said they wanted fewer troops or equipment. there is a lot going on the press is not reporting, and we are going to have a significant presence in the middle east for the foreseeable future. korea has also switched to a combat brigade rotation instead of a PCS, which also requires a complement of PROFIS docs.

navy wise-- no idea. but with the "pacific pivot" I see more navy medical involvement as well-- but probably not to the degree of the army.

--your friendly neighborhood where's that fibromyalgia profile when you need it caveman
 
personally, even though I'm not 100% getting out, it's a combination of all of the above. F-F games if it includes constantly moving goalposts and poor leadership and personnel management would cover the remainders of my issues. the thing is, any one or two things I could manage, but it seems like "big army" fights us every f-ing step of the way. absolutely nothing is simple or straightforward- -and when it is it is so startling and surprising I legitimately don't believe it. for that to be the "culture" we work in is a sad commentary on just how dysfunctional the system is.

--your friendly neighborhood only one visit to finance to get this fixed-- inconceivable! caveman
 
Games for sure. The brigade surgery sword of Damocles was a big factor. The truth is, it was always a haystack of small things that broke that camel's back. I would absolutely have to add: "a massive inertia with regards to efficient care." The fact that I always felt like if i ever wanted to do more than the bare minimum, I had to constantly fight to make it happen, and any time I stopped pushing that rock - even for a minute - it would just roll back down the hill of motivation. Exhausting.

AHLTA sucks, but not even close to enough to have made me leave if it weren't for the laundry list of other reasons. I've never understood how that could be the primary reason someone would get out. It's sucks. It's just small fries, relatively. If the Army put a nickel's investment into morale and productivity, AHLTA wouldn't even cross my mind.

Pay is a big deal, but never a deal breaker.

I always felt like deployment was part of the gig, so while it might not be great it is something I knew I was signing up for - so long as you deploy within your specialty. That is, of course, screening out the skill rot associated with most deployments.
 
I got out bc the Air Force said no too many times to MY career goals. Had to take back control... I guess others are either cool with significant delays in the career or are permitted to train in their specialty of choice. Once I complete my anesthesia subspecialty training, I may consider reserves in the future. I do miss being a flight doc and think I did a lot of good in my time in... Still, it feels good to have control over where I live and not have to have approved leave to travel on weekends!
 
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Getting out because I don't trust the Army with my medical career. I also don't want any pit stops in the gulags of Ft Polk, Irwin, et al. Also my spouse is a doc and it's not fair to ask her to alter her career because the Army wants to send me to Korea to be a brigade surgeon. Also I don't like it when my character or intelligence is insulted. Or when I'm pulled out of clinic for a piss test or a class on how to ground guide vehicles. Or to have cronyism trump my skills or merits. Or get paid a fraction of what a civilian would make. Take your pick but reason #1 is the real deal breaker.
 
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WernickeDO said:
Getting out because I don't trust the Army with my medical career. I also don't want any pit stops in the gulags of Ft Polk, Irwin, et al. Also my spouse is a doc and it's not fair to ask her to alter her career because the Army wants to send me to Korea to be a brigade surgeon. Also I don't like it when my character or intelligence is insulted. Or when I'm pulled out of clinic for a piss test or a class on how to ground guide vehicles. Or to have cronyism trump my skills or merits. Or get paid a fraction of what a civilian would make. Take your pick but reason #1 is the real deal breaker.
Click to expand...
Spot on.
 
WernickeDO said:
Getting out because I don't trust the Army with my medical career. I also don't want any pit stops in the gulags of Ft Polk, Irwin, et al. Also my spouse is a doc and it's not fair to ask her to alter her career because the Army wants to send me to Korea to be a brigade surgeon. Also I don't like it when my character or intelligence is insulted. Or when I'm pulled out of clinic for a piss test or a class on how to ground guide vehicles. Or to have cronyism trump my skills or merits. Or get paid a fraction of what a civilian would make. Take your pick but reason #1 is the real deal breaker.
Click to expand...

These are all very accurate, but I would argue that the pay disparity is a bigger factor than suggested. But, that's probably because of all the other crap you deal with on top of it.

It doesn't seem like a big issue until you get to a clinic where your civilian counterpart, who is a significantly worse clinician than you, in the office next door is working fewer overall hours, has significantly fewer taskings, doesn't have to put up with the command nonsense you must, and is getting paid -- in my case -- about $150,000 more per year than I.
 
Interesting thing is that we joined and leave military for money.
 
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