What are my chances?

[TrashPanda]

Call you local veterinarian, ask them if they know any colleagues who were accepted to vet school who were below the cut off.
Alternatively, we can start a thread asking if anyone was accepted to vet school below the cut offs.
I believe there were quite a few "violations" in the thread I posted.
Lastly, I pose the question back to you, have you read my posts at all?

Old anecdotes and schools' previous policies (and their previous interpretation of them) are generally not helpful to anyone currently applying.

Yes, I've read all your posts and the thread you linked to. There is no evidence of anyone being admitted below cut-offs. (In fact in that thread, there are a few instances of people being immediately rejected for being below a cut-off, including for being below a necessary GPA by only 0.02!) Many schools post the GPA range of accepted students, and I've never seen one with a GPA below a cut-off. Additionally, there are yearly threads (the "Successful Applicants" threads) where people post their GPAs/GRE scores/experience hours/etc. Many point out that they had lower than average stats, but there is absolutely no evidence of anyone being admitted when they are below a cut-off. This is despite literally hundreds of applicants posting their stats over the years. Again, please feel free to prove me wrong.

Some schools do not have cut-offs at all, and you'll certainly see applicants admitted with low GPAs. There is a difference between schools that post average or recommended stats and ones that have actual cut-offs. I'm not sure you understand that several schools have cut-offs and literally will not read your application if you are below them. At least one school does not read anyone's application and only makes interview invite decisions based on GPA/GRE.

We would be doing members a disservice if we did not point this out to those who post with low grades and scores. Applying is expensive and time-consuming. If someone really, really wants to apply despite not meeting eligibility requirements, that's up to them, but it would be foolish for us to not discourage it. But I think if you actually take the time to read through this thread, you'll see a lot more encouragement than discouragement. Yes, we point out where it might be best to not apply, but we also make recommendations based on the applicants' strengths. There are many posts and threads here with success stories and words of encouragement for people with lower stats (you've already found one!).

I understand that you simply want to encourage applicants and remind them that (at least for most schools) there's more to your application than your GPA. Absolutely feel free to continue doing that here- underdog success stories and cheerleading are always welcome. However, please make sure that your information is current and accurate, and that you're not needlessly criticizing people who donate their time to help others on here.

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Members don't see this ad.

 

[finnickthedog]

"In general" "They" "unless you DO" "cut offs" "Doesn't matter what the rest of your application looks like...."

Facts remain: Plenty of veterinarians missed plenty of "hard cut offs" in one category or another yet still were accepted.
Using lets say 100's of examples of actual veterinarians that I have personally dealt with over my career, your standards and averages listed as "realistic", are unfortunately opinion. In addition, what about those that exceed ALL your cut offs by great margins yet take two or even three attempts to be accepted. What if those high flying individuals were never accepted. Then lets take the opposite example that failed to meet one cut off yet was accepted on their first go around.
All of which has happened many of times over.

How low can you go? GPA, that is!

My motivation for posting here is quite simple, rather than lecturing about "cut offs" and what "they say", I rather focus on what someone CAN do despite what "they say."
I also don't need to refer to "they" or a cut off printed online, as I have been around long enough to know the real "they" in the flesh.

"when an expert tells you cant' do something, find an expert who tells you can." A quote that motivated a colleague and friend of mine to get into vet school when "they" (two advisors) told him he couldn't because his GPA was well below the "cut off" for the school that accepted him. He found one advisor who believed he could do it, and that advisor helped him get in.

At Michigan State, nearly 40% of the applicants for the class of 2020 didn't not even make it to the review phase because they did not make the cut off. Likely many of these students were not aware that they didn't make the cut off even though the information was available online. Maybe some of them, like you, were just hoping that a miracle would happen. In the end they threw away money applying to a school that didn't even look at the rest of their application let alone accept them.

If you want to give someone the advice to apply anyways with the hope that maybe the school will throw out their own policy then be my guest. But at least be honest with them that the website and the faculty and the admissions office all say that if you don't meet the requirement you will be eliminated. If they still want to apply knowing that, well then it's their money not mine. I'm certainly not stopping them. But I think you do them a great disservice to tell them that they might be some sort of exception. As someone else said, if you have evidence of people making into a school despite not making the cut off for that school (I don't care if they were below the cut off for some other school nor am I talking about averages nor am I talking about the cut offs that may change depending on the pool of applicants--but the hard cut offs that are posted on websites with the disclaimer of "meet this requirement or we don't even consider you") then I would love to see it.

I say this as a student who had GPAs below average (all three of them, no matter how you calculated them) and was accepted in spite of that. I was below the cut offs for several schools. I'm not here to discourage anyone or tell them they can't get in at all because a part of their application doesn't shine. I'm here to help. Telling people stories that schools might ignore their own requirements... that's not helping.

 

[TrashPanda]

I am a recent grad and was wondering the best way to get into vet school. I graduated with a gpa was

Grade Point Average:
From Enrollment: 3.6
Cumulative Total: 3.251

because i was worried about classes such as physics and took them my last couple of semesters my gpa kind of suffered because of it. I went from a physics 1 grade of a C and brought it up to an A in physics 2. Im interested in going to either A&M, UF, or abroad. I font have much experience but am taking a gap year just so i can study for the GRE and get veterinary experience. My question is how can i improve my application and if i go abroad what do i need to do/best schools to apply to and their requirements. Also what is the best way to study for the GRE ANY TIPS? PLEASE AND THANK YOU

I'm not sure what the difference is between your GPAs. I'm guessing that your overall GPA is 3.251 and your GPA where you got your degree is a 3.6. Most schools don't differentiate between the two (they would just look at the 3.3). However, some schools focus primarily (or only) on the GPA of your last 45 credits or so. If that GPA is higher or you can get your GPA up, those schools would be good choices. Michigan, Minnesota, and Kansas come to mind and if you search this forum for "last 45," you might find more. Illinois is another one to look at- they don't look at your last 45, but if you make it past the first academic review round, they don't look at GPA after that- final decisions are made based on interviews, essays, LORs, and experience.

A&M and UF are both very competitive OOS but of course your chances would be a bit higher if you're in-state. UF strongly considers GRE so if you do well on it, that would improve your chances. I'm one of the many people on here who really liked Magoosh for GRE, and I also found the Manhattan GRE books helpful.

Since your GPA is below average, the rest of your application will be really important. Make sure to get lots of experience in multiple areas of veterinary medicine (small animal, large animal, lab animal, zoo, wildlife, etc.) as well as non-veterinary animal experience. Involvement in something outside vet med can also help you stand out.

As for requirements, here's a helpful PDF, but make sure to check with schools' websites as things do change. Going to a school that's AVMA accredited will make it easiest to practice in the US afterward; AVMA schools both in the US and abroad are listed in that PDF.

Best of luck!

 

[battie]

There's also the fact there are a finite number of seats for these applicants to apply for. When push comes to shove, there's only ~3200 seats with ~7000 applicants. Schools have to draw the line somewhere when they have 2000 people applying for 120 spots. The schools are going to take care of themselves and their reputation. Unfortunately for some, including myself, that means skimming the bottom of the file from the beginning.

I applied to 13 schools over 3 cycles. One school thought me good enough to wait list for two cycles; another school thought I was worth the risk and accepted me. The other 11 did not as I had lower end GPAs. Had I not been accepted this cycle, I was done. I had spent ~5000 it so dollars between all the applications and the few interviews. I had taken extra classes to boost my GPAs after I was rejected the first time, I got more vet experience, I got more "life" experience, I did everything I could to improve my chances. Wanting it enough and working hard only gets you so far when there are specific standards you have to meet.

There's a point where people need to realize not everyone gets in. There are people who shouldn't apply because it's a waste of time and money. If you go over to the pre-allo forum, an admissions committee member for a med school estimates as many as 50% of med school applicants have no business applying to med school. I don't think it's that high for vet med. But telling someone with a 2.75 GPA, a 65% GRE, and 200 hours of experience that they have a shot right now is a disservice to them and is setting them up for failure.

 

[TrashPanda]

Hi everyone, I would love your feedback on my application stats, thoughts on where I should apply or whether or not I should wait to apply in the next cycle, and, if I should wait, what I should do to improve my application. Thanks in advance!

21 years old, female, Texas resident

Degrees:
B.S. in Biology, Baylor University
Minor in Biochemistry
Will graduate from Baylor in December 2017

Cum GPA: 3.47
BCPM GPA: 3.28


Veterinary Experience:
- 750 hours equine
- Current internship w/ small animal vet

Animal Experience:
- 1200 hours employed working in the barn of a summer camp
- 500 hours as a member of Baylor's D1 equestrian team, riding/working with horses that I don't own
- 50 hours volunteering at a therapeutic riding center
- 100 hours of dog ownership
- 100 hours of horse ownership

Letters of Recommendation
-Baylor O-Chem Professor
-Equine Veterinarian I worked for
-Current SA Veternarian I work for

GRE: Registered to take for the first time on 5/27

Leadership/extracurriculars:
-I'm one of the VPs of my sorority
-NCAA D1 equestrian team
-have held lower level leadership positions in one other student organization
-member of a couple honors societies

My concerns:
-Low GPA, and lowest GPA of all of college just happened this past semester
-I want to apply this year, but I'm not sure if having a weak first time application would hurt my second-time application if I don't get in.
-Baylor only allows course re-takes for courses with a grade of B- or lower, which I only have 4 hours of, so re-taking courses may not be a good solution to raising my GPA

Current plan is to apply for TAMU for 2018 entry and do some research to find a few other out of state schools who admit a good number of non-residents. After finishing vet school I want to practice equine sports med.

Thank you!

I've never heard of your chances being harmed by applying more than once. A lot of schools encourage it as long as you make sure to improve your application between cycles. I know some people have been told that they don't look at previous applications when you apply again. I wouldn't worry about that at all.

You didn't post your last 45 GPA, but see what I wrote above to jzthecoolest about that.

Good luck!

I'm 20 and in my junior year of undergrad, planning on applying this year to University of Illinois and Louisiana State University.

Undergrad overall GPA: 3.2
Science GPA: 3.0
Major: Zoology
Minor: Equine Science

Experience:
~300 hours- small animal practice
~500 hours- zoo med (~300 were spent working as a tech)
~300 hours- reptile house
~50 hours- dog kennel
2 semesters working in research

Extracurriculars:
3 years in wildlife society (officer for 2)

Awards:
Have made Dean's List 4 times.

I haven't taken the GRE yet, but I'm taking it this weekend (feeling pretty confident about it). I know my GPA is pretty bad. I had two rough semesters, one where I got very sick and was basically high on Vicodin for a month straight, and this past one where I got diagnosed with major depression and was seeing a therapist. I ended up getting a D in organic chemistry 2 but the schools I want to apply to don't require it, will this pose an issue? What are my chances?

If orgo 2 isn't a requirement, it's unlikely schools will care. The only issue is that it will impact your GPA and science GPA for schools that look at that.


Make sure to use the explanation statement to explain your rough semesters. Schools do read and consider them, especially if you've had good grades since then.

Again, for at least some schools, your last 45 GPA is important. U of I doesn't look at it and you'll have to check about LSU but if you're looking at other schools, it's something to think about.

It looks like you have about 600 vet hours and about 550 animal hours. Your diversity looks great, but you'll probably want more hours for both. Your research experience should help. If you can get large animal or equine experience, that would be especially good. (Though if you're an equine science major I'm guessing you have some equine experience that's not listed?)

Good luck!

 

[MRCVS1999]

"I took "veterinary medicine in society" here at Michigan State which was a 100 level survey of the profession with about 250 students in it. It taught by one of the doctors from the vet school (it was a great class!) They had the director of admissions come in and speak and she told us that one student had been accepted with a 2.8 GPA. I'm sure they made up for it with lots of real world experience which varied greatly. I was just accepted here this year, first try with a 3.15 -"
The first post from the thread I quoted.

I am also not getting paid to post here. Despite what you may believe my posts aren't for the benefit of veterinary students. You already got accepted. My posts are for the those trying to get in. Last I checked this forum is also for veterinarians. You don't have to agree with my advice or opinion, and its up to the pre-vets reading this forum if they want to use my posts as motivation or not. I would like a run down of the qualifications of the veterinary "students" posting advice
that puts their knowledge of the admission process above mine. Whether you want to admit it or not the entire thread is the "opinions" of veterinary students helping pre vet students get to what they believe the "average" and "realistic" standard is based on those who were accepted.
My posts merely state the fact remains, you can get accepted outside of those norms. You can get rejected just as easily above them.
I am not going to go through all 91 pages of this thread to call out individual posters, but despite what you may think the negativity I was refereeing to is apparent in a few posts. NOT ALL. I already stated the thread can be beneficial, in my previous post. I applaud those trying to help others. Maybe for those reading this forum they encounter negatively outside of this forum similar to what I mentioned. Interestingly no one here humbly agreed, only decided to attack posts that they felt intruded on their expert opinion.
Privately, I have already been thanked via pm by several pre-vet students for my posts. In my position, one thank you would have made it worth my time.

For the record, I am not a vet student, I am veterinarian. I have been in private practice for 18 years. I have been around more veterinarians than you, have heard more "stories" than you have. I have worked with specialists, in veterinary university hospitals and in two different countries. I have worked with veterinarians that served on the admission boards that you are talking about. So yeah, I got the street cred to post here.

 

[TrashPanda]

"I took "veterinary medicine in society" here at Michigan State which was a 100 level survey of the profession with about 250 students in it. It taught by one of the doctors from the vet school (it was a great class!) They had the director of admissions come in and speak and she told us that one student had been accepted with a 2.8 GPA. I'm sure they made up for it with lots of real world experience which varied greatly. I was just accepted here this year, first try with a 3.15 -"
The first post from the thread I quoted.

I am also not getting paid to post here. Despite what you may believe my posts aren't for the benefit of veterinary students. You already got accepted. My posts are for the those trying to get in. Last I checked this forum is also for veterinarians. You don't have to agree with my advice or opinion, and its up to the pre-vets reading this forum if they want to use my posts as motivation or not. I would like a run down of the qualifications of the veterinary "students" posting advice
that puts their knowledge of the admission process above mine. Whether you want to admit it or not the entire thread is the "opinions" of veterinary students helping pre vet students get to what they believe the "average" and "realistic" standard is based on those who were accepted.
My posts merely state the fact remains, you can get accepted outside of those norms. You can get rejected just as easily above them.
I am not going to go through all 91 pages of this thread to call out individual posters, but despite what you may think the negativity I was refereeing to is apparent in a few posts. NOT ALL. I already stated the thread can be beneficial, in my previous post. I applaud those trying to help others. Maybe for those reading this forum they encounter negatively outside of this forum similar to what I mentioned. Interestingly no one here humbly agreed, only decided to attack posts that they felt intruded on their expert opinion.
Privately, I have already been thanked via pm by several pre-vet students for my posts. In my position, one thank you would have made it worth my time.

For the record, I am not a vet student, I am veterinarian. I have been in private practice for 18 years. I have been around more veterinarians than you, have heard more "stories" than you have. I have worked with specialists, in veterinary university hospitals and in two different countries. I have worked with veterinarians that served on the admission boards that you are talking about. So yeah, I got the street cred to post here.

MSU's cut-off is 2.75.

But anyway, please do stick around and be positive and encouraging if you'd like. The funny thing here is that we're not arguing with what you're saying because you're being too supportive- it's because you're being so negative and critical! Just try to be constructive and make sure you get your facts straight.

And don't hesitate to call out posts that you think are unrealistically negative! I think that attitude is very, very rare here but it should still be stopped.

EDIT: MSU doesn't have a cut-off for cumulative GPA. Oops.

 

[battie]

They had the director of admissions come in and speak and she told us that one student had been accepted with a 2.8 GPA. I'm sure they made up for it with lots of real world experience which varied greatly. I was just accepted here this year, first try with a 3.15

Those numbers are both above "hard cut off" of cumulative GPA. Many schools have 2.75 have that as the cGPA cut off. With that being said, we would tell anyone posting here that we need more information before giving them any solid advice. We would tell that to someone with a 4.0 as well.

I am also not getting paid to post here.

Lol. If we got paid to pay here, we wouldn't be worried about student debt. I don't think anyone here had that even cross our minds.

My posts are for the those trying to get in

So are our posts.

I would like a run down of the qualifications of the veterinary "students" posting advice
that puts their knowledge of the admission process above mine.

We went through the application process within the last several years and got our information directly from the schools.

what they believe the "average" and "realistic" standard is based on those who were accepted.

What we know to be the average and realistic standard as released by the schools.

you can get accepted outside of those norms

We've said that multiple times.

Interestingly no one here humbly agreed, only decided to attack posts that they felt intruded on their expert opinion.

We agree on several points, just not your main point that anyone can get in with hard work and perseverance. Again someone can give it all they got, but a 2.75 is an uphill battle and is the exception, not the rule.

So yeah, I got the street cred to post here.

No one ever said you didn't. They said that you are not giving us enough credit to know what we're talking about. Students who have just successfully gone through the application process are probably some of the best equipped to give advice besides the schools themselves.

 

[finnickthedog]

MSU's cut-off is 2.75.

But anyway, please do stick around and be positive and encouraging if you'd like. The funny thing here is that we're not arguing with what you're saying because you're being too supportive- it's because you're being so negative and critical! Just try to be constructive and make sure you get your facts straight.

And don't hesitate to call out posts that you think are unrealistically negative! I think that attitude is very, very rare here but it should still be stopped.

Actually for the past several years at least Michigan State did not have a GPA cut off--they still don't have one for cumulative although they now have one for sci and last 36 (and the require a minimum of a C in prereqs). At the time of the post they likely still had a scholastic indicator score cut off which is what they just stopped using this cycle. But yes, this is not an example of someone making it in below the cut off and it should not be touted as such.

 

[Lupin21]

This thread has helped many people. Yes, numbers are only part of the equation, and everyone here knows that. Those other aspects are intangible though, and this thread is meant to help sift through what is obvious and orient people on where they might stand, especially regarding which schools look at what. I would appreciate the conversation moving back to the intended purpose of the thread. We value the input from seasoned veterinarians, but it is also a very different environment in the process of applying than it once was, and the veterinary students here are well equipped to offer helpful admissions advice. It will always be up to the individual to chose what they can/want to do with the advice given.

 

[MRCVS1999]

You all are correct I misquoted the cut off, from the previous thread.

I appreciate the spirited debate, but still disagree on your interpretation of my posts. I also disagree on the communities evaluation of what it takes to be accepted.
Anyone can quote norms and pontificate when the get accepted or what got them there.
I do not have the time or interest in pointing out specific inaccuracies or fallibility of advice given in this forum.
I will point to one(below). I DO BELIEVE SOME OF IT CAN BE OF BENIFIT, AND MOST OF YOU SERVE AS REPUTIBLE SOURCE
You did get in didn't you?
Make no mistake, as a community you all have collective differing opinions based solely on the latest applicants success or failures.
Though those individual reports are accurate, obviously, they do not represent the entire application pool over the last several years.
You only get information on those willing to post, or that are members here.
What about those that lurk in the shadows to only read, and are embarrassed to post GPA's or other short comings for fear of your public opinions?
What about that those who after they get accepted ditch this forum and fail to give you an update?
Speaking of percentage, what percent of vet school applicants are represented in these forums anyway?
What percent of vet students in the US, and abroad are represented here?

Example
Frequently Asked Questions | DVM Admissions and Student Resources stated average GPA 3.6-3.7

Low (<3.0 GPA) to vet school?
"Whatup I had a 3.12 cumulative and a 2.99 required courses GPA when I got in. It caaan be done!"
Currently a veterinarian

Lets be frank, had this person posted that GPA here asking about UC Davis could you all collectively agree, with no one focus on the 3.6 average in comparison to the grades this now vet got.

I appreciate the flock that follows the advice here, and is ready to support the gospel from vet students. But the secret is very simple.

1. Improve to the best of your abilities all facets of your application
2. Sometimes its who you know, and can they write you a recommendation?
3. How determined are you? ie Gut check, Where there is a will there is a way (despite what the experts here claim) I have seen it happen.
As far as being current I work with vets who all graduated at different times, including vet students that shadow in my practice.

4. Veterinary School Admission 101

What if you don't get in?
You're not alone, and it doesn't mean you don't have what it takes. Contact the admissions staff and request feedback on your application, then address the deficiencies and reapply next year.

Good luck! Whether you want to admit or not, all this advice is recycled. Didn't catch one post on anyone talking about connections getting them either, and
yeah out on the street that really does happen!

BELEIVE IT OUR NOT....
I joined this forum not to argue with vet students, but to advise you on the future of this profession.
Spoiler alert I'm on the streets now and it ain't looking too good for you. Don't believe me pick up a journal. On that one I'm afraid you can't argue.
So don't you think it be better to start asking some questions and start a thread? What's going on after you get out of vet school?
Rather than arguing with me on what it takes to get in, and on what advice I chose to give, you should be starting a dialogue.
I am here to help you, that is if you want it. That why I joined.
I'm good either way.

 

[dyachei]

You also used a thread from 10 years ago to make your initial point. A lot of things change in a decade, which I'm sure you can attest to with being a vet for 18 years.

Regardless, the question is why you felt the need to post this in a thread where many of the members are already doing what you propose?

There will always be outliers in every direction. But you shouldn't tailor advice to only the outliers, as it won't be useful to the majority of pre-vet students.

As inspirational as "if you try real hard and believe you'll succeed" is, it isn't always the truth. and there's a difference between saying you won't get in and it may be a challenge. I have rarely heard the former on this forum

 

[MRCVS1999]

I'm glad Papa Bear SDN administrator came to the rescue. Wow 23,150 posts you've been busy in here.
How much motivation does one need with a 3.96 GPA and standout in every category? Of course I'm here for the outliers and the under dogs.
Maybe I'll start a thread all those who were told in these forums you had little chance post here.
I'm glad you set me straight, on motivation and how to dispense it. Good news you picked up two likes to add to your 14,867.
Awesome.

 

[dyachei]

I'm female.

And you can do whatever you want within the terms of service. I was just pointing out why you're preaching to the choir.

By all means, keep being snarky

 

[dyachei]

I prefer to try hard and expect the worst. I think false hope is pretty painful and therefore harmful. That still doesn't mean I tell people anything is impossible

 

[supershorty]

Not fully understanding the attitude here.

Also, @MRCVS1999 , I think you're missing the point - there are SOME schools that people with lower stats are discouraged from applying to. I've never seen a single post that said "don't apply to vet school, take up underwater basket weaving," despite that option in the poll. But it's pointless to tell someone with a GPA of 3.0 or 2.9 to go ahead and apply to somewhere like NCSU as an out-of-state applicant - I'm pretty sure they have a hard cutoff at 3.4 and applications below that are not read.

This thread is great for helping pre-vet students figure out where their strengths and weaknesses are, and tailoring their school list accordingly. Don't have a super stellar cGPA but have a strong sGPA and last 45 credits? There's a list of schools that look favorably on that. Have a rockstar GRE score and cGPA? There are schools that weight those more heavily. Helping people to apply where they'll be most competitive is guiding them toward being successful, not crushing their dreams by saying "no, you might not want to apply to this school, at least not without doing [x, y, z] to strengthen your application."

I wish I had posted on this thread before I applied to school the first time - I would have held off for a year and strengthened my application instead of being out almost $1000 in application fees (although ultimately not getting in at first worked out ideally for me). Sure, most schools don't have a hard cutoff and you can try throwing your app that way knowing you're below the averages for previous years - I did with a few schools the second time I applied, and wasn't surprised when I was rejected from a couple and waitlisted at 1. But that's not the same as having a hard cutoff, and I think you're confusing the two.

 

[SummerTheLynx]

I'm glad Papa Bear SDN administrator came to the rescue. Wow 23,150 posts you've been busy in here.
How much motivation does one need with a 3.96 GPA and standout in every category? Of course I'm here for the outliers and the under dogs.
Maybe I'll start a thread all those who were told in these forums you had little chance post here.
I'm glad you set me straight, on motivation and how to dispense it. Good news you picked up two likes to add to your 14,867.
Awesome.

Oh I am sorry, I forgot that dyachei's opinions are completely not valued because she is an administrator. But the new person who has just entered the community who is attacking everyone and their mother should have their opinion valued over all others.

What you are doing is attacking a resource for pre-vet students for no salient reason that you can prove. And that is not productive by any means.

 

[SkiOtter]

I'm glad Papa Bear SDN administrator came to the rescue. Wow 23,150 posts you've been busy in here.
How much motivation does one need with a 3.96 GPA and standout in every category? Of course I'm here for the outliers and the under dogs.
Maybe I'll start a thread all those who were told in these forums you had little chance post here.
I'm glad you set me straight, on motivation and how to dispense it. Good news you picked up two likes to add to your 14,867.
Awesome.

 

[vetmedhead]

I appreciate having someone come on and make as much effort as humanly possible to be condescending while telling us that they're here to tell us that people don't like being condescended to. Especially when we aren't being condescending in the first place.

 

[Lupin21]

I'm glad Papa Bear SDN administrator came to the rescue. Wow 23,150 posts you've been busy in here.
How much motivation does one need with a 3.96 GPA and standout in every category? Of course I'm here for the outliers and the under dogs.
Maybe I'll start a thread all those who were told in these forums you had little chance post here.
I'm glad you set me straight, on motivation and how to dispense it. Good news you picked up two likes to add to your 14,867.
Awesome.

This again proves that you have not been reading this thread. We receive people with all ranges of stats and experience levels seeking advice. There are plenty of posters that were average or low stats that stick around to cheer on those like themselves after they were accepted.

I will once again ask that we please return to the intended dialogue of this thread, and remember to keep replies in a manner you use with professional colleagues.

 

[dyachei]

This again proves that you have not been reading this thread. We receive people with all ranges of stats and experience levels seeking advice. There are plenty of posters that were average or low stats that stick around to cheer on those like themselves after they were accepted.

I will once again ask that we please return to the intended dialogue of this thread, and remember to keep replies in a manner you use with professional colleagues.

I'm one of the people that tells pre vets not to worry when they get a c, so this is all pretty amusing.

I've been here ten plus years. Yes I have a lot of posts. No it doesn't mean I give bad advice

 

[jzthecoolest]

Since I've got a little bit of extra time at the moment...


In terms of academics, I think you're definitely set for UF especially since it is your IS school. The cumulative GPA is a smidge low but I think it's okay for UF, especially with your high last 45 hours. Good job on the upward trend! I don't know that I would apply to UGA and CSU as, from what I have seen, they are very competitive OOS. Your GRE is fantastic, which will help you out with UF! They seem to weigh it heavier in the admissions process than many other schools.

Your vet, animal, and research experiences all look good! I think, given your posted eventual career goals, that you could play up your behavior related research experience in your personal statement/supplementals/interviews and link that back to the niche that you are hoping to fill.

Overall, I think you've got a fair chance! It looks like you've done a great job making up for the somewhat below average cumulative GPA. Best of luck!


GPAs are quite solid, IMO, although I know that UC Davis has been very numbers-heavy the past few cycles... I definitely think that a GRE retake is in order, as you mentioned, to see if you can meet or surpass the average quant score for UC Davis.

NCSU and CSU, as I mentioned above, are extremely competitive for OOS admissions---this cycle I saw quite a few posters with applications about as perfect as could be get waitlisted or rejected---so I don't know how you'd stack up there but I think that your stats are strong enough that if you have your heart set on them, then I would have no qualms aiming high and trying for them. Especially NCSU since they are one of the cheaper vet schools and also allow you to switch residency to pay IS tuition rates after your first year.

The rest of your application honestly looks pretty good, too. Obviously, I can't predict how things will work out for you, but I think you've definitely got a good shot of getting in somewhere---good luck!


I'm a bit confused about the two different GPAs you listed. Your cumulative GPA, so the 3.3, is going to be what most schools will look at.

A 3.3 is definitely a little below average but it's by no means impossible to be accepted with! I had a 3.2 when I was accepted, so trust me when I say that it can be done. That said, you may have to be a bit more selective about where you apply as a result. Some vet schools either do not weigh the cumulative GPA as highly or do not weigh it at all. Some schools off of the top of my head are KSU, ISU, UMN, and MSU.

The international schools may be fair choices as in my experience they take a slightly more holistic approach to applications.

Are you in state for UF or TAMU? If not, I don't know that I would apply to them. TAMU especially seems to be fairly heavy on cumulative GPA for OOS applicants and AFAIK they don't accept very many. If you are a resident of either of those states, then, yes, certainly apply for the chance at IS tuition.

In terms of the GRE, if you have the money, I personally used Magoosh and found it extremely helpful, especially for the quant section. I know that there are multiple other members here who have also seen good gains in their scores with the program. If you can't quite afford that, you could always look into seeing if your local bookstore or library has a prep book! The format of the test was changed a few years ago (2011, I think?), so I would definitely try to find a semi-current one.

Other than that... you say that you are planning to take a gap year in order to obtain some experience, which is great! If you can hit at least 1000 hours or so, you'd be in a pretty safe place, I'd bet, especially if you can get a fair amount of diversity in there, too. Because your GPA is on the lower end, this is going to be a very, very important piece to your application so do the best that you can to get great experiences, make connections, and hopefully manage to find evaluators who will write exemplary recommendations for you.

Yes I am Texas born resident. If i have to i will take 2 years off for experience as i want to make sure i do everything i can to try and get in the first time such as studying for the gre enough to get good scores the first time. im currently applying for an emergency vet office and at a vet office in cy fair thats popular on tv. Also does anyone have any advice about where to take the math courses and animal science courses online perhaps. My school UNT did not have animal courses and the math courses at my school were mainly for math majors so you had to take like 6 courses just to get the class needed. I know about the list on A&Ms website but as most of these locations are far from me, wanted to know if there were any online options for the animal science/ agricultural classes, and the math courses. I am very good at math so i think i will be fine with doing it online.

 

[cdo96]

Yes I am Texas born resident. If i have to i will take 2 years off for experience as i want to make sure i do everything i can to try and get in the first time such as studying for the gre enough to get good scores the first time. im currently applying for an emergency vet office and at a vet office in cy fair thats popular on tv. Also does anyone have any advice about where to take the math courses and animal science courses online perhaps. My school UNT did not have animal courses and the math courses at my school were mainly for math majors so you had to take like 6 courses just to get the class needed. I know about the list on A&Ms website but as most of these locations are far from me, wanted to know if there were any online options for the animal science/ agricultural classes, and the math courses. I am very good at math so i think i will be fine with doing it online.

I'm not sure about where to go for online math courses, but for animal science, I know for sure that Oklahoma State has an online one! Also, maybe... Purdue? Kansas State? Maybe...

 

[MDB74]

....
I have been a veterinarian in private practice for eighteen years now.
...

So it's been almost a quarter century since you went through the application process for vet school? Quite frankly, that makes you significantly less qualified than any random 2nd year student to give advice on what the current process entails. It's the equivalent of me walking into your suite and telling you how to do a surgery. Also, you clearly haven't been reading this thread because everyone here tends to very positive and encouraging (maybe even overly so) in their advice. In the close to 100 pages of posts I bet you can't find more than one or two people who were told that they might want to give up.

 

[dyachei]

So it's been almost a quarter century since you went through the application process for vet school? Quite frankly, that makes you significantly less qualified than any random 2nd year student to give advice on what the current process entails. It's the equivalent of me walking into your suite and telling you how to do a surgery. Also, you clearly haven't been reading this thread because everyone here tends to very positive and encouraging (maybe even overly so) in their advice. In the close to 100 pages of posts I bet you can't find more than one or two people who were told that they might want to give up.

there's a reason I don't comment on chances for UTK anymore. I have no idea what has changed in the 10 years since I started there

 

[SkiOtter]

I bet you can't find more than one or two people who were told that they might want to give up.

As long as we're not counting the poll at the top

 

[WizardOfPaws]

Yes I am Texas born resident. If i have to i will take 2 years off for experience as i want to make sure i do everything i can to try and get in the first time such as studying for the gre enough to get good scores the first time. im currently applying for an emergency vet office and at a vet office in cy fair thats popular on tv. Also does anyone have any advice about where to take the math courses and animal science courses online perhaps. My school UNT did not have animal courses and the math courses at my school were mainly for math majors so you had to take like 6 courses just to get the class needed. I know about the list on A&Ms website but as most of these locations are far from me, wanted to know if there were any online options for the animal science/ agricultural classes, and the math courses. I am very good at math so i think i will be fine with doing it online.

Tarleton State offers quite a few online courses AND if need be has a Fort Worth location. The main campus is in the middle of nowhere (Stephenville) but I regularly made the commute back and forth from Dallas.

If you live in the UNT area, taking classes there would be an excellent option.

 

[cohen2000]

I have no idea about NCState except that I know someone with basically perfect GPA's that got waitlisted and I don't know if anyone was accepted OOS last year on SDN.

Hmm I wonder who that could be ... I ended up being accepted off their waitlist, but I couldn't pass up the opportunity to go to school with you and the rest of the Davis crew

 

[Coopah]

Hmm I wonder who that could be ... I ended up being accepted off their waitlist, but I couldn't pass up the opportunity to go to school with you and the rest of the Davis crew

We're so lucky to have you! And yes I did mean you

 

[twelvetigers]

What on earth...

I just spent 20 minutes confusedly reading back in this thread to try and see what the hell happened. I missed a significant portion of RuPaul's Drag Race before I finally gave up and paused it.

This thread is not and was never intended to be some sort of measure of one's worth. It's not like we are the gatekeepers or something. We are other people - real, live people - that have gone through this whole application thing a time or two (or three) and can offer some insight based on our experiences as to what an admissions committee is, in general, looking for in an applicant.

Let me tell you the real reason this thread exists and is stuck up here at the top like this. It's because we have multiple posts a week, every week, where pre-vets are coming in here and telling us their information wanting to know if they have a chance. If we didn't have a thread, the posts would fill the forum. These kids want feedback from SOMEone, and maybe they don't have a great adviser at school. Maybe they don't have a vet school they feel comfortable reaching out to yet. Maybe the only vet they know graduated in 1974 and just doesn't have a good idea of what the current admissions process is like. So they come here wanting guidance.

And we offer guidance. We offer support. We are honest about the things that require honesty - about cold, hard GPA cutoffs and limited OOS seats. We are honest about the debt, and the pay, and the stress. But we are kind, and we offer advice and support right along with that honesty. And you are here trying to tell us that we are doing a bad job?

No. Just no. Everyone that comes here understands that we are just other people going through the same ****, and they take the advice and they either choose to listen to it or they don't. They're adults.

You are a new member to our community. Don't come in here stepping on toes.






(However, I will be calling dy Papa Bear from now on, because it's kinda naughty and I like it.)

 

[hk98]

Very random question here.. but is it possible to apply for vet school this cycle and begin shadowing vets this summer? Currently I have zero shadowing hours. Also, do you have to put in a contact number for each experience?

 

[PrincessButterCup]

Very random question here.. but is it possible to apply for vet school this cycle and begin shadowing vets this summer? Currently I have zero shadowing hours. Also, do you have to put in a contact number for each experience?

1.) Yes, it's possible . . . But there are a bunch of questions I would have for you. What exposure to vet med do you currently have, if you haven't done any shadowing? How do you know that vet school is the right option for you? What are your career goals, and why? Also - how many hours will you be able to get? Depending on your gpa, GRE, etc., you could definitely stand a chance with lower hours, but be aware that many people will have been working and shadowing in vet med for years by the time they apply. Your application will need to be very strong in other sections to compensate. Do you realize that you need an LOR from a vet? Are you hoping to ask a vet you're shadowing this summer, or do you have someone else in mind?

2.) Nope.

 

[hk98]

1.) Yes, it's possible . . . But there are a bunch of questions I would have for you. What exposure to vet med do you currently have, if you haven't done any shadowing? How do you know that vet school is the right option for you? What are your career goals, and why? Also - how many hours will you be able to get? Depending on your gpa, GRE, etc., you could definitely stand a chance with lower hours, but be aware that many people will have been working and shadowing in vet med for years by the time they apply. Your application will need to be very strong in other sections to compensate. Do you realize that you need an LOR from a vet? Are you hoping to ask a vet you're shadowing this summer, or do you have someone else in mind?

2.) Nope.

My current GPA is a 3.53 and the only exposure to vet med I've had is visiting a small animal clinic for a field trip and I really enjoyed it

 

[PrincessButterCup]

My current GPA is a 3.53 and the only exposure to vet med I've had is visiting a small animal clinic for a field trip and I really enjoyed it

There's no reason not to apply, except that it takes money and time & and the entire cycle is a stress fest, and it would suck to go through everything and realize it's not actually what you want to do.

Are you going into your senior year this fall? My advice would be to take a gap year. Shadow and build a relationship with some veterinarians. See if you *really* like vet med or if you just think you do. (I worked in a clinic for 6 months before I realized that I never wanted to be a SA vet. Going in, I thought that I would love it and that it would be my dream job. I didn't, it wasn't, and I don't miss it.) Research current topics in vet med. Do you know about the debt:income ratio for the profession? It's awful, and it's not something to take lightly. If you have other interests, or there are other fields you're curious about - go explore those, too! You have time. Getting into vet school is not a race, and you can take it step by step. You don't have to cram an entire application worth of things into one summer.

 

[supershorty]

My current GPA is a 3.53 and the only exposure to vet med I've had is visiting a small animal clinic for a field trip and I really enjoyed it

I would suggest you spend a substantial amount of time shadowing and getting as much exposure to the field as possible before you think about applying. Vet med on a day-to-day basis is pretty different from seeing it on a field trip, and you should know what you're getting into.

 

[Ashgirl]

Very random question here.. but is it possible to apply for vet school this cycle and begin shadowing vets this summer? Currently I have zero shadowing hours. Also, do you have to put in a contact number for each experience?

Is it possible? Sure. (Only if you have at least one letter of rec already from a vet. This is not an option, it is required to apply). Will you be more likely to get accepted and know more about if this career is for you if you take a year to shadow and build up lots of good experience? Absolutely!

 

[TrashPanda]

Very random question here.. but is it possible to apply for vet school this cycle and begin shadowing vets this summer? Currently I have zero shadowing hours. Also, do you have to put in a contact number for each experience?

Agree with the other advice you've gotten. Technically possible but a very bad idea for multiple reasons.

You don't have to put a contact number for everything, but you're supposed to. Why wouldn't you?

At least some schools make sure that your hours are accurate, and it would probably be a red flag for any school if most contact info is missing. I had a few things with little or no contact info, but they were all extracurriculars from a long time ago- all vet and animal experiences had complete info.

 

[roxieashes]

I am applying this year, but I'm seriously thinking that I might not be able to make it. I still have one more year left of undergrad.
21 yo Female, First Time Applicant
CUM GPA: 3.15 (Double Major: Biology and Psychology)
GRE: TBD
Vet:
~ 100 SA
~ 4 Lab Animals
~ 80 Marine Animals
Animal:
~ 1000 Equine
~ 500 Farm and Food Animals
~ 2000+ SA
~ 80 Marine Animals
~ 160 Wildlife
~ 30 Exotics/Avian
Research:
~ 190 (Development and Personality Research Lab)
Other:
~ Girl Scout Gold Award (with Wildlife Rehabber) [High School]
~ Science Fair Winner (Lateralized Functioning in Felines) [High School]
~ PR and Secretary of Pre-Vet club at university

Thanks guys!!

 

[finnickthedog]

I am applying this year, but I'm seriously thinking that I might not be able to make it. I still have one more year left of undergrad.
21 yo Female, First Time Applicant
CUM GPA: 3.15 (Double Major: Biology and Psychology)
GRE: TBD
Vet:
~ 100 SA
~ 4 Lab Animals
~ 80 Marine Animals
Animal:
~ 1000 Equine
~ 500 Farm and Food Animals
~ 2000+ SA
~ 80 Marine Animals
~ 160 Wildlife
~ 30 Exotics/Avian
Research:
~ 190 (Development and Personality Research Lab)
Other:
~ Girl Scout Gold Award (with Wildlife Rehabber) [High School]
~ Science Fair Winner (Lateralized Functioning in Felines) [High School]
~ PR and Secretary of Pre-Vet club at university

Thanks guys!!

What are your science/last 45 GPAs and where are you planning on applying?

 

[roxieashes]

What are your science/last 45 GPAs and where are you planning on applying?

I still have 37 credits to take before I graduate, so I'm not sure my actual science or last 45 GPAs since most of those 37 credits are science courses.

 

[finnickthedog]

I still have 37 credits to take before I graduate, so I'm not sure my actual science or last 45 GPAs since most of those 37 credits are science courses.

But you said you were applying this year? If you're referring the current cycle where you'd be submitting an application this September then you should have the GPAs you'll be applying with. They're only going to include classes you've already taken at the time you submit your application.

 

[roxieashes]

But you said you were applying this year? If you're referring the current cycle where you'd be submitting an application this September then you should have the GPAs you'll be applying with. They're only going to include classes you've already taken at the time you submit your application.

OH OK! Thanks for clarifying!
Last 45 GPA: 3.3
Science GPA: 2.5 (with Math: 2.87)
Ya, my GPAs are REALLY low and pitiful

 

[roxieashes]

Also, something else that I neglected to mention in my prior post: was the D that you earned in one of your vet school pre-reqs? If so, did you retake that course?

Most (all?) vet schools require a C or higher in all pre-reqs. If it was not a vet school pre-req, you don't necessarily need to repeat it, although doing so may help your GPAs out a little bit, especially if you apply to schools with grade replacement instead of averaging.

Thank you! I had miscalculated my science GPA, but it's still rather low (2.5). I was thinking of maybe applying just to one school to go through the process of everything.

 

[roxieashes]

Sorry to hear about your health issues.

Unfortunately, I think that you will have a rough time this cycle. I would definitely recommend taking advantage of the Explanation Statement to alert schools as to the health concern and medical withdrawal---it won't excuse the grades, of course, but it will give some context and schools may take it into account when evaluating your GPA.

It's not impossible to be accepted with a low GPA. Your cumulative GPA is below average, but still within range. The part that REALLY concerns me more than that, though, is that the science GPA is as low as it is. I applied and was accepted with a 3.2 cumulative GPA but I had a 3.7ish for both last 45 hours and science GPAs. A 2.2 science GPA is very, very low. Low enough that it will preclude you from applying to certain schools. Many schools have hard cutoffs for GPA, including science GPA, and your application will not even be considered at such schools. Where were you wanting to apply?

Your experiences sound good but I don't know if it will be enough to compensate. You're going to really have to knock your experiences, evaluations, and GRE out of the park.

If I were you, since you say that you still have classes to complete, I would personally skip this cycle and bust my butt to get as darn near close to a 4.0 as I possibly can for the next year. It will improve your last 45 hours GPA significantly and while all schools like to see upward trends, some schools' admissions formulae are VERY big on last 45 hours GPA (KSU, ISU, UMN, MSU, among a few others). I would then reevaluate for next year's cycle.

Best of luck with whatever you choose to do!

Oh, and my evaluators are 2 SA vets, upper-level Shakespeare professor, an occupational therapist who utilizes horses, NASA engineer, and a wildlife rehabber.

 

[Skimble]

I am applying this year, but I'm seriously thinking that I might not be able to make it. I still have one more year left of undergrad.
21 yo Female, First Time Applicant
CUM GPA: 3.15 (Double Major: Biology and Psychology)
GRE: TBD
Vet:
~ 100 SA
~ 4 Lab Animals
~ 80 Marine Animals
Animal:
~ 1000 Equine
~ 500 Farm and Food Animals
~ 2000+ SA
~ 80 Marine Animals
~ 160 Wildlife
~ 30 Exotics/Avian
Research:
~ 190 (Development and Personality Research Lab)
Other:
~ Girl Scout Gold Award (with Wildlife Rehabber) [High School]
~ Science Fair Winner (Lateralized Functioning in Felines) [High School]
~ PR and Secretary of Pre-Vet club at university

Thanks guys!!

I know others have mentioned your GPA is going to be a big hurdle, but are you planning on racking up more vet experience this summer too? Your experience hours are quite low, and that along with a low GPA won't make you a very competitive applicant at most schools. I'd highly recommend skipping this cycle and focusing on improving your GPA and gaining more vet experience.

 

[finnickthedog]

Thank you! I had miscalculated my science GPA, but it's still rather low (2.5). I was thinking of maybe applying just to one school to go through the process of everything.

You can go through the process of filling out the application and just not submit it. You may miss out on some supplementals and/or interviews but there's no guarantee of you getting to that point even if you do apply. As someone who applied twice I think having been through the process was helpful, but not worth cost of applying just for the experience. Some things may change anyways.

So, if you think you have a shot at a specific school then maybe apply, but if not then I would advise you to just wait until next cycle. The problem is that for a number schools your science GPA will be below the cut off.

The other thing to ask yourself if you do find a school to apply to (do you have one in mind?) and they did accept you, are you going to want to accept that offer? Or are you going to look at how much you application has improved over the year and maybe see that your options have increased and want to decline so you can apply to more schools? If you have 37 credits left then you may make substantial improvement to your application--especially if a number of those are prerequisites--and you might have more options in a year.

I think your science GPA is your biggest hurdle right now and should be a priority but as Jilary mentioned, I would also advise you to gain more veterinary experience.

 

[roxieashes]

Thanks guys! Ya, I decided to wait to apply next cycle and study my ass off this next year


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[twelvetigers]

Thanks guys! Ya, I decided to wait to apply next cycle and study my ass off this next year


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Feel free to sign up for a VMCAS account just to look around - I think that's fine to do.

 

[coffeelauren]

Any advicie on how to rack up such high numbers of vet experience hours? I'm working at a research lab through the vet school right now, but im not sure it counts as animal experience, let alone veterinary experience (I am learning a lot though, it's a cool position for sure). But between that, school, and my other research project, I'm a little short on time.... Also I wold need to find somewhere to shadow (That's probably the hard part aha)

 

[roxieashes]

It would be under research experience, not animal or vet.


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