US doctor moving to Australia

[C.P.]

Hi,

That's correct. If you aren't finished with your training in a specialty, then you can apply through one of two pathways: the General (competent authority) pathway, or the specialist pathway.
The General pathway helps to certify all of your medical credentials and allows you the same standing as any other trainee doctor, thus being able to switch training pathways and specialties in the future (if you should want to). The Specialist pathway is stating that you only want to gain certification in the specialty of your training (whether completed or not) and when completed, can only work in that field.
Your process needs to involve the following steps:
1) get your medical credentials approved by the AMC.
2) Once you've obtain recognition by the AMC as a doctor (including your IELTS), then you can decide if you want to go down the competent authority path or the specialist pathway.
3) If you're gong down the specialist pathway, you'll then take your assessment by the AMC and then apply (in this case to RANZCOG) to have your training to date assessed against the Australian training system and ask to be placed somewhere on their training schedule.
4) Once you've been given your assessment (and essentially what level of training they'll consider you to be at, as well as any other requirements they may ask of you), you can then start applying for training positions.

The key thing is ensuring you've got the ability to actually work in Australia. If you are not a permanent resident or citizen, then the training programs can not consider your application till they have reasonably attempted to fill the spot with a local applicant. This will make your progress extremely hard (not impossible, but it'll take a good deal of networking and charisma to set something up).
I don't know anyone personally who's gone through the competent authority pathway, unfortunately. Sorry I can't help more specifically with that.

Does this help?

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[xresident]

Hi,

That's correct. If you aren't finished with your training in a specialty, then you can apply through one of two pathways: the General (competent authority) pathway, or the specialist pathway.
The General pathway helps to certify all of your medical credentials and allows you the same standing as any other trainee doctor, thus being able to switch training pathways and specialties in the future (if you should want to). The Specialist pathway is stating that you only want to gain certification in the specialty of your training (whether completed or not) and when completed, can only work in that field.
Your process needs to involve the following steps:
1) get your medical credentials approved by the AMC.
2) Once you've obtain recognition by the AMC as a doctor (including your IELTS), then you can decide if you want to go down the competent authority path or the specialist pathway.
3) If you're gong down the specialist pathway, you'll then take your assessment by the AMC and then apply (in this case to RANZCOG) to have your training to date assessed against the Australian training system and ask to be placed somewhere on their training schedule.
4) Once you've been given your assessment (and essentially what level of training they'll consider you to be at, as well as any other requirements they may ask of you), you can then start applying for training positions.

The key thing is ensuring you've got the ability to actually work in Australia. If you are not a permanent resident or citizen, then the training programs can not consider your application till they have reasonably attempted to fill the spot with a local applicant. This will make your progress extremely hard (not impossible, but it'll take a good deal of networking and charisma to set something up).
I don't know anyone personally who's gone through the competent authority pathway, unfortunately. Sorry I can't help more specifically with that.

Does this help?

Hi C.P, thank you very much for your thorough reply. I was thinking, if you as an anesthesiologist, who worked for 2 years after finishing your training, were classified as partially comparable by the anesthesia OZ board, then me, with only 2 years of obgyn training as a resident in the US would be most likely tagged as non comparable. To my understanding, you can only be partially comparable if no more than 2 years of Oz supervision/training are needed right? It's interesting, before seeing your post had no idea I could still apply directly to the college to get assessed. I read on the medical board web the process of assessment is supposed to be completed in around 4-6 months, but from why I understand your process took a year? any particular reason for that? what about your amc verification process? do you remember how long it took? I called the amc and they say its around 2 months if everything is ok. I hope one day I can be in your shoes living in my dream place and working in my dream job. Thanks for all mate.

 

[C.P.]

"partially comparable" is the general range that most people fall into. You'll rarely see anyone be classified as "significantly comparable."
There is a risk, depending on your training to this day, that you may be considered "non comparable," which would require you to start from the beginning, but even then, you'd already have some experience in the past which may help you.

I'd be very certain to spell out why you weren't allowed to continue with your training program before. You said you were "non-renewed". You'll want to clarify what that means to them, to ensure they don't misinterpret it as being due to performance issues. If it was due to issues other than just visa status, you'll really need to work on brining up your resume and establishing strong references to combat that and get them to look beyond it.

Regarding the time period to get assessed, my process was much slower, but only by choice. I was living in the US and just going through the steps in anticipation that I may move to Australia. You can definitely get it done a lot quicker if you want to.
I'd strongly recommend communicating with the AMC and RANZCOG to determine what kind of documentation they'll want, as it's easier to obtain while you're at the institutions that have that paperwork.

Just to clarify one point. You can apply directly to the college for assessment, but only after you've cleared the AMC and declared yourself to be on the specialist pathway.

 

[xresident]

"partially comparable" is the general range that most people fall into. You'll rarely see anyone be classified as "significantly comparable."
There is a risk, depending on your training to this day, that you may be considered "non comparable," which would require you to start from the beginning, but even then, you'd already have some experience in the past which may help you.

I'd be very certain to spell out why you weren't allowed to continue with your training program before. You said you were "non-renewed". You'll want to clarify what that means to them, to ensure they don't misinterpret it as being due to performance issues. If it was due to issues other than just visa status, you'll really need to work on brining up your resume and establishing strong references to combat that and get them to look beyond it.

Regarding the time period to get assessed, my process was much slower, but only by choice. I was living in the US and just going through the steps in anticipation that I may move to Australia. You can definitely get it done a lot quicker if you want to.
I'd strongly recommend communicating with the AMC and RANZCOG to determine what kind of documentation they'll want, as it's easier to obtain while you're at the institutions that have that paperwork.

Just to clarify one point. You can apply directly to the college for assessment, but only after you've cleared the AMC and declared yourself to be on the specialist pathway.

Thank you for all the clear advise that you give me man, I really appreciate it. Let me know if you ever come to Perth so I can give you a list of places to visit that mostly locals know about or if you ever go to Peru I can give you lot of info and secret gems. I'll keep in touch, thank you!

 

[C.P.]

Sounds good.
Next trip out and we'll meet up for dinner.

 

[DrElephant]

Hi,

Thanks for all the information provided in this thread, all of it is very useful.

My case is, I am completing my MD Pathology and after completing that I'm planning to move to Australia to my wife who is a Permanent Resident. AS I complete my MD and move to Australia, I have high hopes that I'll get my PR too.
From previous posts I got that I'll have to do:

1. AMC Verification
2. Apply to Royal College of Pathologists of Australasia

After they rate me as not compatible or partially compatible.
I apply for a job according to the requirements from RCPA and complete the 'Bridging years'.

How will the process be after that?
How will 'Moratorium period' affect me?
Having a Permanent Resident visa helpful?
How difficult is getting a job?

 

[C.P.]

Yeah, I'd work on getting your MD qualifications verified by the AMC now. It'll be easier to provide them the documentation you need before you leave.
You'll likely be applying to the specialist pathway, which means that you'll be applying to only get credentialed in Pathology, and not looking to transition into another specialty.
After that, you then apply for an assessment by the Royal College, who will then tell you what they feel you need to do to gain your Australian qualifications to work as a Pathologist.

Here's where it becomes tricky.
1) The College will be helpful, but don't assume their trying to give you the least amount of requirements as possible. Go into that assessment as if you're trying to prove a legal case. Understand what criteria they need to address, and make sure you've spelled in out to them , in your application and interview, exactly how you meet the criteria as much as possible.
2) Get PR ASAP. You'll likely be required to do a couple of years in a training system (which is a good idea to help you transition into a new medical system, anyway), but without citizenship or permanent residency, you will have to be considered after ALL OTHER applicants who have PR or citizenship.
The AMC and the college have no influence or interest as to IF you'll be able to get a job. Their focus is on what you'll need to meet the standards for their training and credentialing.

There is more advice I can give, surrounding the moratorium, etc, but part of it depends on where you're planning on living, where you're hoping to live, and what your wife does as a profession.
Feel free to DM me this info if you don't want it public knowledge.

 

[DrElephant]

Yeah, I'd work on getting your MD qualifications verified by the AMC now. It'll be easier to provide them the documentation you need before you leave.
You'll likely be applying to the specialist pathway, which means that you'll be applying to only get credentialed in Pathology, and not looking to transition into another specialty.
After that, you then apply for an assessment by the Royal College, who will then tell you what they feel you need to do to gain your Australian qualifications to work as a Pathologist.

Here's where it becomes tricky.
1) The College will be helpful, but don't assume their trying to give you the least amount of requirements as possible. Go into that assessment as if you're trying to prove a legal case. Understand what criteria they need to address, and make sure you've spelled in out to them , in your application and interview, exactly how you meet the criteria as much as possible.
2) Get PR ASAP. You'll likely be required to do a couple of years in a training system (which is a good idea to help you transition into a new medical system, anyway), but without citizenship or permanent residency, you will have to be considered after ALL OTHER applicants who have PR or citizenship.
The AMC and the college have no influence or interest as to IF you'll be able to get a job. Their focus is on what you'll need to meet the standards for their training and credentialing.

There is more advice I can give, surrounding the moratorium, etc, but part of it depends on where you're planning on living, where you're hoping to live, and what your wife does as a profession.
Feel free to DM me this info if you don't want it public knowledge.

Thanks C.P. for a prompt response.

I would really appreciate your advice on Moratorium.
My wife is a software engineer working in Sydney and I would like to be around Sydney too(if possible).

After a couple of years of training, will I be free to apply for pathologist jobs? Do you have any information on the number of jobs for a Pathologist and how difficult the process can be of finding a job?

 

[C.P.]

The moratorium is a ten year restriction from the time you first get registered as a medical practitioner.
So, from the day you start working as a doctor (as a trainee or otherwise), the clock starts ticking. It's not ten years of work, it's just ten years since you get registered.
The moratorium doesn't actually restrict you from being able to work. It restricts you from (essentially) being able to get paid.
The moratorium covers 2 key components, 19AA and 19AB. 19AA restricts where you can work based on your residency status. 19AB restricts where you can get reimbursed by insurance companies.
PR will get you an exemption from the 19AA component. 19AB is a bit trickier.
I have a feeling that Pathology is going to have some interesting nuances that'll likely make it a lot harder for you to work in Sydney.
Essentially, you can get normal position, but it will have to be in an area of need for your specialty, or you'll have to get an exemption.
An exemption comes from several paths:
1) you've done ten years
2) You're partner has an unrestricted provider number (is a medical practitioner of some sort).
3) You have an academic appointment at a university, through which they'll give you an exemption for the hospitals associated with that university
4) You are working in an area of need (it's not automatic, you still have to apply)
5) the minister of health decided to give you a waiver (this never happens)

As I mentioned, I've a feeling pathology has some nuances that'll make this not as straight-forward as other specialties though.

One path is, while you're undergoing your bridging years, take on a teaching role at a local university, then apply for an academic position, and that can open up some opportunities for you to stay and work in sydney.
Does that help?

 

[DrElephant]

The moratorium is a ten year restriction from the time you first get registered as a medical practitioner.
So, from the day you start working as a doctor (as a trainee or otherwise), the clock starts ticking. It's not ten years of work, it's just ten years since you get registered.
The moratorium doesn't actually restrict you from being able to work. It restricts you from (essentially) being able to get paid.
The moratorium covers 2 key components, 19AA and 19AB. 19AA restricts where you can work based on your residency status. 19AB restricts where you can get reimbursed by insurance companies.
PR will get you an exemption from the 19AA component. 19AB is a bit trickier.
I have a feeling that Pathology is going to have some interesting nuances that'll likely make it a lot harder for you to work in Sydney.
Essentially, you can get normal position, but it will have to be in an area of need for your specialty, or you'll have to get an exemption.
An exemption comes from several paths:
1) you've done ten years
2) You're partner has an unrestricted provider number (is a medical practitioner of some sort).
3) You have an academic appointment at a university, through which they'll give you an exemption for the hospitals associated with that university
4) You are working in an area of need (it's not automatic, you still have to apply)
5) the minister of health decided to give you a waiver (this never happens)

As I mentioned, I've a feeling pathology has some nuances that'll make this not as straight-forward as other specialties though.

One path is, while you're undergoing your bridging years, take on a teaching role at a local university, then apply for an academic position, and that can open up some opportunities for you to stay and work in sydney.
Does that help?

Yeah, this helps. Thanks.

Till now I've read many forums but haven't really come across much information about pathology in Australia. Do you know any good forums or websites where I can find more info on the nuances that'd make Pathology more difficult than other specialities?

 

[C.P.]

Sorry for the slow reply. Iv'e been asking around to see if I can get more information from someone with more experience in Pathology. I don't have many contacts in that field, so I've come up short.
Australia does get quite a few people in from the UK, so I'm sure there are a number that have gone through the process. Their path will be similar to yours, with some extra hurdles in overcoming where the US and Australian training systems don't overlap as much.
Here's the link to the Australian Pathologists Association, with tables that describe what you'll likely be required to do as part of your transition:
RCPA - Examination Exemptions

 

[SHR_AU]

Thanks C.P. for a prompt response.

I would really appreciate your advice on Moratorium.
My wife is a software engineer working in Sydney and I would like to be around Sydney too(if possible).

After a couple of years of training, will I be free to apply for pathologist jobs? Do you have any information on the number of jobs for a Pathologist and how difficult the process can be of finding a job?

I've read over your recent comments and though I'd give some of my input. C.P. has provided very accurate and valuable information throughout the forum.

Specialist pathway is fairly tricky unless your training is from a specialist college recognized by the specialist colleges in Australia. Straight to the point: New Zealand (most are the same college FANZCA, FACP, FRACGP etc.), UK, Ireland. You'll be able to gain specialist recognition that's substantially comparable. Partially or non-comparable will result in a set of hurdles you'll have to achieve as per college instructions to obtain your qualifications as a specialist in Australia.

Every specialty is different, and the job market for each specialty is also different. For example, DWS (District of Workforce Shortage) for Intensive Care at ABC Hospital, may not be DWS for Pathology at ABC Hospital. You'll have to check doctor's connect website on a regular basis. These DWS borders changes all the time; also, when you are submitting your application attached to a DWS, be sure to take screenshots / date stamp/ etc to have evidence you're submitting during the time of DWS

it is very expensive to obtain the initial specialist assessment. Some specialist colleges now will require a tentative job offer to be submitted along with your credentials for assessment. It's like the chicken and egg scenario. How do you know you'll be able to work at a particular hospital as a Specialist when you haven't been assessed by the college of your specialty?

C.P. is correct by stating that most will be deemed partially comparable. From a job perspective, this just means you'll need to work as as Registrar / senior registrar to tick the boxes set forth by your specialist college. It is this exact reason why I always encourage doctors to consider taking the Competent authority or standard pathway, get a job first, make your physically move, then apply to the specialist college. This is much faster and much cheaper initially. Being a trained US doctor, to find a job shouldn't be too difficult. Trying to find a job that meet the requirements put forth by the specialist college in an area your of preference can be very difficult.

The biggest challenge at any level is finding the job, finding the job, finding the job.

In some specialty it's easier to land a job as a mid level registrar, than a specialist or a Fellow. I'd encourage to reach out to potential employer and start a discussion. You can look for jobs on NSW health's website, usually there is a contact numbers or email at the bottom of the job description. Once you find the job, everything else is just paperwork and takes a bit of time. Specialist pathway can easily take over a year vs the other pathway is generally between 6 to 9 months.

Lastly, about the 19AB & 19AA. The idea of this is to get international doctors out to the rural areas for a few years. Your 10 year does get reduced when you work out in remote locations. However, this is not to worry at this stage. There are exemptions for these and if the employers are actively bringing in specialists from other parts fo the world, then they already have that part figured out.

Feel free to ask more questions, I'll do my best to answer in a timely fashion.

Disclosure: I own and operate a recruitment agency assisting doctors find work in Australia.

 

[hirachisauce]

Just to clarify- Other than the specialist pathway, the competent authority pathway is the only pathway American trained docs can apply for (i.e. not the standard pathway). This takes 12 months of full time work under supervision in any specialty to complete and you will get "general registration," which is the equivalent of our state license in America that we get post intern year.

I am not sure where you are getting 6-9 months??

 

[C.P.]

Just to clarify- Other than the specialist pathway, the competent authority pathway is the only pathway American trained docs can apply for (i.e. not the standard pathway). This takes 12 months of full time work under supervision in any specialty to complete and you will get "general registration," which is the equivalent of our state license in America that we get post intern year.

I am not sure where you are getting 6-9 months??

I'm going off my general understanding of the three pathways. I've only got personal experience with the specialist pathway.

Here's the link which goes into more detail about the general/competent authority pathway.
Medical Board of Australia - Competent Authority pathway

Understand that there are 3 pathways:
The competent authority pathway
The standard pathway
The specialist pathway

The standard pathway requires AMC exams to be taken. This is usually for international medical graduates without much/any other specialist training.
The competent authority pathway is for IMGs seeking certification into a general registration, but the info sheets I've read through only talk about the UK, which I'm not sure how it translates into US training.

The Specialist pathway only works if you have some specialist training, and limits you to only being able to work within that specialty.
That's the path I took.

 

[Say]

Hey C.P. thanks for your continued devotion to this thread. One question- if you are a dual citizen of the US and Australia and are completing MD and residency in the US, is the transition to practicing in Australia easier? Is there anything I can do as a resident (I.e. exams or paperwork) to help the process along?

 

[C.P.]

The main advantage(s) you'll have are:
1) you don't need to worry about having permission to work, as you are a citizen. i.e. you don't need a work visa.
2) . . . and this is the main benefit. . . you are immediately able to apply for jobs and be competitively considered for them. If you aren't a citizen or have permanent residency, training or attending positions are meant to be offered to citizens/PRs first, and only after no suitable candidate has been found, then offered to other internationals.

The hurdles to just through regarding getting board certification here are no different, and you still have to deal with issues of being able to bill insurance companies, but these are obstacles which can be worked with or around if you have patience, persistence, and some flexibility.

Does that help?

 

[Say]

Yes, thank you!

 

[valeo]

Hello C. P.,

Thank you for being persistent with helping other people overcome problems you and many others had. You are doing a great work here! I read a lot of threads throughout the internet and the forum and I thought that I should I ask you directly a few questions which bother me a lot. My situation is quite different than yours but you were also an IMG and I am also hoping that you may know someone with the same issue. On the other hand, I saw that Domperidone and pitman provided a lot of information on similar topics. I would like to thank you too for being extremely helpful. I learned a lot by reading your posts. If you have something to say concerning my position, please do, I would much appreciate it.

So, I am a final year medical student from Serbia, so a potential IMG. Last year, I did a rotation in Australia and I loved it! People, the lifestyle, the nature, everything! Since then, I have been persistent in trying to figure out the way to move down under for good. I am aware of the fact that I will be required to pass the AMC MCQ and the Clinical Exam. As far as I know I should also obtain 457 working visa. But, this is the part which became and will become even more tricky starting from March 2018 due to recently proposed visa changes. If I understood well, the main problem will represent me a requirement of at least 2-years working experience which, having in mind that I am still a student, is very bad for my situation. Please, correct me if I am wrong. I also read about some problems that people will have even after obtaining the visa, later when they try to apply for PR. But I didn't get it straight. There are also some other details that are blurry in my head so I would appreciate any thought on the topics:

1. Is there a possibility to apply for any other visa other than 457? I have close relatives in Australia, I am not sure if it would be of any help concerning visa issue. Would it be possible to secure some kind of visa if one would be ready to work in rural/Area of Need?

2. When is it possible to apply for AMC exam concerning that I am still a student? Do I have to wait to graduate first? Does AMC ask me to submit the MBBS degree first in order to apply for the exam? I am asking because I am aware that one can do the USMLE Step 1 and Step 2 CK before graduation so I am not sure if it is the same thing with AMC exam.

3. I am in a process of securing a rotation for my final year. I was thinking about doing it in Australia, New Zealand or USA. I would prefer doing it in the country where I want to work afterwards in order to get a better insight into the healthcare system and life there. But now, I have the problem that I don't know whether I will be having a chance to work in Oz due to the visa problem. It is hard to plan a distant future and it doesn't always go as you planned but I would at least like to have a knowledge of the facts so I can make I rational decision on where to look for a possible rotation. Do you have any advice on the topic?

4. If any of the previous question is possible, I would like to ask how does an IMG apply for internship positions in Australia or New Zealand? I know about the Match in the States but I haven't read anything about how it goes in Australia/New Zealand. Does it go by directly contacting the hospitals? I suppose everyone is obliged to do it even if they did it in their country of origin.

I would hugely appreciate any answers, suggestions, advice that you may provide. Of course, if anyone else had similar experience or know someone who had it, I would be glad to hear it.

Thank you for your time!

 

[Catatoni]

Hello C.P.,

like so many before me, thank you for your effort and patience answering all these questions. I would really appreciate it, if you could help me out I have looked at countless webpages and feel like I am more confused the more I read.

I obtained my medical degree in Germany and finally managed to get my specialist exam in Dermatology in Germany last year (btw happy new year). I would like to relocate permanently to Australia.
My soon to be husband is british and has a PhD in Immunology. I hold general registration with the General Medical Council in the UK (though I never worked there). I made the effort to keep all options open before the Brexit happens. I don't know having the U.K. Registration might help?

Because my partner would also like to work, we need to live in a rather big city (the need for scientists is not very high in rural areas). From all I have read I thought that if specialist recognition is granted one is not limited to area of needs (that might be totally off).
I thought that dermatology was sought after, but now I don't know where to start:

1) Get the AMC registration
2) Start specialist pathway
3) Get PR?

I assume I will work below my qualification for a while, which is totally understandable because I need to get to know the system.

Do you know anyone actually successful in coming to AUS working in a biggish city, even though they didn't study/ work in the U.K., Ireland, NZ or the US?

Any advice would be really appreciated

 

[polka.dot]

I have a similar question to Catatoni. I am a staff psychiatrist who is board certified in Canada and the U.S. I am planning a move to Australia in a year or two with my partner who is an Australian citizen. I have a cash based private practice in the U.S. with 2 days of hospital practice (ECT/partial hospitalization). I am hoping for some advice on what I can realistically expect in terms of setting up a practice when we move.

The thing I am having trouble fully understanding is how the moratorium will affect me. My husband's job requires us to be in an urban centre (likely Brisbane or Sydney) and I am not sure if I can even work at all in those areas during the period of the moratorium given that even at a public hospital there will be public and private insurance patients. My goal is to continue working in a public hospital 2-3 days a week and have a private therapy practise on other days. I know in Canada psychiatrists cannot work as private therapists because it is a government covered service and wasn't sure if it could be done without a Medicaid number in the city.

I am having trouble figuring out exactly what to expect in terms of applying for jobs and credentialing.

 

[C.P.]

You may have a few interesting options.
The first thing you need to do is apply for permanent residency in Australia.
Without this, it'll be (not impossible) but a lot harder for you to be as flexible as you will want to be.
The second thing is go through the process of getting your medical credentials certified by the Australian Medical Council (AMC). Definitely do this before you leave Canada, as it will be a lot harder once you're in a different hemisphere.
Then you need to apply to the Royal Australia New Zealand College of Psychiatrists to get your local board certification: Overseas specialists | RANZCP

They actually have an Overseas Trained Psychiatrists Representative Committee, but you need to join the college to access it. Maybe look into that too.

To directly answer your question, your moratorium (unless you're a GP) is a ten year restriction on getting reimbursed (which is essentially getting paid), and limits where you can work. There are a number of exemptions you can apply for, one of which is that you're working in an Area of Need. Working in an area of need (which is designated by post-code) isn't automatic, you still need to apply, but it usually goes through.
To find out if a spot is an area of need, goto this link: DoctorConnect - Specialist DWS Locator
and select "psychiatry".

What you'll see is a lot of areas around the major cities that look like "areas of need" . The key is that the ones that don't are likely the ones with large hospitals. If you're looking at establishing an office-based practice, you'll likely have flexibility as to where you can go.

The ten-years is not ten years of service, but simply ten years from the first time you're registered.

My advice is this.
You'll likely be required to do some bridging training time.
During this time you'll have medical registration and the clock will start ticking.
If your husband's job is unique enough and you can argue that you need to be in a specific area, you can apply for an exemption to get provider numbers in that region, arguing that to not allow it would disadvantage your husband (an australian citizen) by forcing him out of his unique position.
The 19AB government document is here: Health Insurance (Section 19AB Exemptions) Guidelines 2017
I'm attaching the file too (the section about spouses is on page 7).
Part of it depends on what your husband does, but I believe it's limited to if he's considered a skilled migrant and already is employed in Australia (in other-words, you're proving he's already here, has a valuable job, and it would be jeopardised if you two can't work and live near each other).

All of this though, is only if you want to work in a hospital or get insurance rebates. If you're doing cash-based work, with no insurance rebates, then it doesn't matter.

Does this help?

 

[polka.dot]

Wow C.P.! Thank you so much. This is the most detailed and clear answer I have gotten after months of working on clarification. My husband is a professor and has a very specialized area of research. We were able to qualify for an extraordinary ability visa (EB-1) when we moved from Canada to the U.S. for his work so I am hopeful we might be able to qualify for an exemption. I was wondering about the bridging time, what exactly does it entail? I know Canada and Australia have more reciprocity between their medical boards than the U.S. but I was hoping having board certifications and independent practise in the U.S. and Canada would help me avoid having to do any more exams or direct supervision time. Finally, another question no one seems to be able to answer is- are cash based practises a viable thing in Australia? They are not legal in Canada and it was a unique thing for me to set up when I moved to the U.S. Thanks again, your clarification has really helped us move forward with planning.

 

[C.P.]

The bridging time is a phrase I use, but it means the time the Australian College has said they want you to complete to become board certified. I have no idea what it may be for your college, but I'd imagine it would be on the lower end of the spectrum, considering your qualifications.
An important thing to understand though is that, when you go through that process, they're not looking to determine how well you meet their criteria, they're just looking to ensure they've covered their bases to make your training comparable to Australian standards. It's in your best interest to find out exactly what they need to know and spell it out for them, step by step, how you meet whatever it is they're looking for.
Regarding Cash-based practices. . .I'm not certain, but I know some people come to hospitals with no insurance and simply pay cash. I'm not certain if this is something you can elect to do for your patients though, or if it's just an accommodation you can make for those without insurance.
I'm not the best person to comment on this though as it's outside of my knowledge base.
The last thing is to check into your malpractice insurance and find out about how much a tail coverage will cost (it's not cheap), and you'll need it when you leave for Australia.

I hope this helps.

 

[Liquid8]

Wow C.P.! Thank you so much. This is the most detailed and clear answer I have gotten after months of working on clarification. My husband is a professor and has a very specialized area of research. We were able to qualify for an extraordinary ability visa (EB-1) when we moved from Canada to the U.S. for his work so I am hopeful we might be able to qualify for an exemption. I was wondering about the bridging time, what exactly does it entail? I know Canada and Australia have more reciprocity between their medical boards than the U.S. but I was hoping having board certifications and independent practise in the U.S. and Canada would help me avoid having to do any more exams or direct supervision time. Finally, another question no one seems to be able to answer is- are cash based practises a viable thing in Australia? They are not legal in Canada and it was a unique thing for me to set up when I moved to the U.S. Thanks again, your clarification has really helped us move forward with planning.

Last year I wrote something on the Psych forum about how outpatient billing works in Australia (Psychiatry Abroad) – it’s probably not something you need to worry about at this stage, except to know that running a private outpatient practice in Australia is definitely viable. It’s what the majority of qualified psychiatrists (both local and overseas trained) end up doing, but getting to that point is the tricky part.

I’m not sure you can consider it to be truly “cash only.” Once you set your price patients are expected to pay in full, but patients will receive a rebate from the Medicare, the national insurer only if a doctor has an unrestricted provider number. The moratorium restricts access to unrestricted provider numbers outside of designated districts of workforce shortages, putting one at a competitive disadvantage if they were to offer private services elsewhere.

In order to be eligible for an assessment of your specialist qualifications, you actually need to have a job offer first (Applying for specialist assessment | RANZCP). Working in an urban public hospital counts towards moratorium time (these positions are salaried and not reliant on medicare item number billings). While public jobs are usually hard to come by, psychiatrists have an advantage compared to other specialities from overseas in that public jobs aren't particularly attractive to local graduates. Public hospitals often have have a contingent of overseas trained psychiatrists who started employed as senior registrars or staff specialists while preparing for exams or having supervision, and have stayed on to complete their moratorium requirements.

Unfortunately I don't think you can get away from requiring a period of supervised practice. The highest category of recognition for overseas trained psychiatrists is "Substantially Comparable," and this looks to be one of the requirements: Substantial Comparability Placement | RANZCP. While arduous, it is still a better deal than having to sit the old Observed Clinical Interview exam which was removed a few years ago. This had a shockingly low pass rate for overseas trained candidates - as low as 2/55 one year.

 

[Nazia hassan]

Hello people,
I have a few questions.. my husband is an mbbs doctor from pakistan but working as a resident in a major govt hospital in saudi arabia for more than ten years. In different departments.. internal medicine,nephro,sickle and currently in ER .. now we are thinking of moving to australia. The procedure is quite long.with ielts/pte. Amc mcq..then going there finding job .then passing clinical exam.
My question is with more than ten years of experience will he be able to get job easily in australia? Since we have kids we would like a job where there is good schooling too .And how much is the SALARY SCALE there for gps and residents? As of in 2018. Is moving to Australia worth all the hassle? Please someone guide me . Right now in saudi arabia we are earning around 3500 australian dollars a month with housing and medical free . Google is not helping in this. Since i want words from a real person.
Need a little light on the situation there for imgs from asian countries .cause we are confused if it will be a good idea or not.
Thanks in advance

 

[harlesmd]

Hi CP,
Thanks for your continuous contribution to this thread. I find it very helpful ! I am in the process of transitioning my career from US to Australia due to family reason. I am board certified in pediatrics and board eligible in clinical genetics (did combined residency for 5 years). I still have yet to sit for my clinical genetics exam in 2019. I am currently a first year clinical fellow in pediatrics Hematology and oncology and will complete my first year fellowship in June 2018. Due to unexpected changes in family situation, I have to move to Australia to be close to my family. Based on my credentials and my preference to practice as specialist, I should probably apply through the specialist pathway. If after interim assessment, I am deemed to be partially comparable and required to do 1-2 years of specialty training, do you know what type of registration I need to obtain to fulfill this requirement ? I read about limited registration but it seems like getting this type of registration is not an option for applicants who are eligible for competent authority pathway (which I am as US trained physician). At the end I still need to apply for Provisional Registration first. So I was debating if I should just start my application through Competent Authority Pathway first, get my provisional registration, work for 12 months and then complete the process of obtaining specialist registration ?

I understand that you applied for specialist pathways several years ago and policies might have changed since then but I am curious what type of medical registration you were on when you did your bridging years.

Thanks !

 

[KKBR]

Hello,
I am new in this forum. Have some queries. If I complete 1 year supervised training in Australia , under provisional registration, through competent authority pathway, after getting general registration , can I move back to canada as a GP and able to work there?

Thanks!

 

[C.P.]

hmmmmmmm. . . I'm not sure, but for the most part, I think you'll need to enquire on the Canadian side of things. There's little to no direct reciprocity in medical qualifications, although Australia and Canada do seem to be more readily open to acknowledging the work done in each system.
In the end, it will be a combination of the training you have prior to coming to Australia and then having your registration and qualifications obtained here(in Australia) assessed by Canada to determine what they want from you to achieve similar standing.
I've got no experience in the Canadian system though, so this probably isn't the best thread to get advice on your particular query.

Sorry

 

[pitman]

Hello,
I am new in this forum. Have some queries. If I complete 1 year supervised training in Australia , under provisional registration, through competent authority pathway, after getting general registration , can I move back to canada as a GP and able to work there?

Canada recognizes both Australian GP fellowships (FRACGP and FACRRM). However, you'd have to sit the MCCQE and MCCEE (though I'd think coming from Canada, you will already have taken those). To make things a little more complicated, even though the GP fellowships are recognized, each province can still play games and put up their own protectionist hurdles (I think only wrt residency requirements though, which from the sounds of it also wouldn't affect you).

 

[BigPikachu]

G'day, CP. Awesome to hear you're making to move to Australia. I'm Australian born and educated, and can't imagine practicing medicine anywhere else. I come from an General Practice and Emergency Medicine background and currently work as a Hospitalist.

To answer your complex question(s) briefly: it's a lot of paperwork and bureaucracy, plus patience and time. This is assuming you're already a fully qualified specialist physician (not resident or intern) so you'll be going through the 'Specialist Pathway' (as opposed to the Competency Authority Pathway or Standard Pathway for other non-specialist overseas graduates).

To summarise the "hurdles" or steps to go through:
- Get your immigration paperwork sorted; that is, your Visa to come here and eligibility to work in Australia
- Apply for a position in an 'Area-of-Need'; that is, in a rural township where there is a shortage of physicians; your future employer will be a 'sponsor' or 'referee' for your application for Medical Board registration; unfortunately, it's very hard to find a metropolitan job as an overseas specialist just starting out; that said, I found my rural practice to be very fulfilling in terms of medicine and if you're family is willing to come with you, rural life is beautifully relaxed and calm in its own weigh; plus Medicare has a memorandum that forces non-Aussie physicians to spend at least 10 years in an 'Area-of-Need' (there are some special exemptions and ways round it) by restricting your Provider Number.
- Ensure your medical school is recognised by the AMC - no doubt it is
- Ensure your specialty qualification is recognised by the relevant Specialty Medical College - in your case in sounds like the RACGP or ACRRM for General Practice / Family Medicine - essentially you will find out from them if you need to: a) can directly covert your American / Canadian specialty qualification to the Aussie equivalent, and/or b) need to do a period of supervised practice, and/or c) sit exams-assessments.
- Once you've done all of the above, you either get issued Specialist (or Limited/Provisional if you still need to do supervised practice or sit exams) Board Registration, and you can start working.
- Applying for Medicare for a Provider and Prescriber number is separate. So don't forget to do that. But most HR or Practice Managers will remind you to do this. And as I said above, if you're an overseas person, and haven't fufilled your area of need memorandum, Medicare won't issue you a Provider number in a metropolitain area - and sadly since most Australians use government Medicare - you won't get paid.

good luck!

 

[Domperidone]

Um. I think this getting muddled.

KKBR - If you finish that pathway and get general registration it only allows you to be a resident in Australia and work as a supervised hospitalist. You wouldn't be automatically a fully qualified GP in any western country until you finish formal GP training. No one goes from intern to GP anymore but that was a thing 20 years ago. Not anymore. It just makes you more eligible to apply for registrar training like GP.

If you then do GP reg training in Australia and finish it, then you can apply to Canada as a GP. The MCCEE or QE is to apply for residency. So for attendings or consultants it a different set of exams - I dont know what they are. LCMEs or something - try the Canadian forum like CP suggested.

 

[pitman]

Domperidone, I realize you're trying to clarify things (and I certainly overlooked the fact that the OP seemed to be assuming he could work as a GP after internship), but some of what you've stated is incorrect.

Assuming GP fellowship were attained in Australia, if the OP hadn't sat them already, he would STILL have to sit both MCCQE exams to return to Canada as a fellowed GP (doesn't matter if he's a resident or not; American-trained family physicians are a special case where Canada recognizes them having taken the 'equivalent' USMLE exams I-III instead). Last I looked a few years ago, many provinces also required the MCCEE for any foreign-trained doc to work there.

Nonetheless, since both Australian GP fellowships are now recognized, he would not have to sit the GP exam. But as said, provinces can and do create their own hurdles.

For example, here is info for Ontario (OP would take the third option):
http://www.healthforceontario.ca/UserFiles/file/PRG/Module01-PRG-Licensing-EN.pdf

Note that in Ontario's case, both MCCQE exams are required, but it appears the MCCEE *may* no longer be required (it still is for specialist physicians however):
http://www.professionssanteontario.ca/UserFiles/file/PRG/Module04-PRG-FAQs-EN.pdf

However, note that the MCCEE has been a prerequisite for IMGs to take the MCCQE itself, but from 2019 that will also no longer be the case:
IEHP News
It's unclear to me whether IMG family physicians in the 'non-examination' route (that is, not needing to sit the *GP* exam) now need to sit the MCCEE as a prerequisite to the MCCQE, or whether from 2019 they might still need to take the MCCEE at some point (following the MCCQE), but certainly anyone wishing to go this route into Canadian family practice should look into the changes themselves, and be aware of any quirks in the particular province where they wish to practice.

 

[misspoopie]

Hi! I'm doing a research paper on this but couldn't find any definitive answer anywhere.

Can you apply for registration to APHRA even if you're not physically in Australia? How about RACGP and applying for a Medicare Provider Number as well?

Thank you!

 

[C.P.]

Interesting question, but relatively easy answer.
Where you physically are doesn't matter, but what does matter in the process is your residency status and standing with the relevant medical college.
AHPRA just registers you based on your standing within Australia (ad a trainee, consultant, etc).
RACGP also depends less on your physical address and more on if you've met their requirements for registration. Mostly, you'll likely be in the country to have accomplished their requirements anyway. Getting a provider number is the same. You can do it from anywhere, but to meet the requirements, you'll likely have been here a while anyway. It's like getting my driver's license from the US renewed. I can do it from overseas, but only because I've been there ling enough to set up all the details possible to make it happen.

Does that help?

 

[shak29]

Hi. I am an Indian citizen, who completed my 2 year Dch (diploma in child health) and currently pursuingy DNB (diplomate national board ) in pediatrics from India. I understand that specialist pathway will be the easier one for me that will enable me to practice in Australia. I would like to know whether I will be able to apply through the specialist pathway for registration in Australia. How much time does it generally takes for the same.

Awaiting your kind response.
Thank you

 

[C.P.]

I may not be the best person to answer this question, as there are a lot of nuances within each specialty that may not reflect my experience.
What I can tell you is just reiterated from the medical board's website:
Medical Board of Australia - Specialist pathway

The first thing to look at is if the institution you've received your training at is recognised by BOTH the Australian Medical Council and the world directory of medical schools (this is on the website I linked above).

The next step is to have completed your specialist training and then applying to the AMC for recognition of your medical qualifications.
After that, you can then apply to the specialist pathway and then to your specialist college, in this case the RACP.

If you go to their website, they actually have a fairly detailed description of the exact process, and the timeline to expect too:
Overseas trained physicians and paediatricians in Australia
This goes over the process, the forms to fill out, the expected costs, and contact information too.

Does this help?

 

[ccrose]

wow. . . that's a tough question.
I'll try and simplify it down to some key points. My perspective is as someone who's gone through training systems in both countries, and has also worked as an academic/trainer in both systems too.
1) both systems are going to be difficult to get into as a foreign grad. I'd apply to both and see what happens. If you only get one, reasonable, option, then that's pretty much decided the debate for you.
. . . but, if you're lucky enough to get both options open, then the complexity starts.

2) where do you want to live, long term. If it's back in Taiwan (or wherever it may be) find out how they accept the US and Australian medical degrees. If one of them is poorly accepted or has limited reciprocity, then that should also be a big factor to consider. Again, this is if you have the option of being accepted by both programs.

3) DO vs MD. You can do well as a DO, but being an international (in terms of visa status), and having a DO, will make your options for getting into a good residency program a lot harder unless you're a rockstar and/or have some good connections. This isn't a reason not to go this route, but these are the hurdles you'll face, and you should, likewise, see how a DO would be accept where you're planning on living long-term. Additionally, if you're just looking at your medical training in the US, but not residency training, then you need to see how a US med degree transfers to where you're planning on doing advanced training.
Med school/DO school is a lot easier to get into as a foreign grad than getting into a residency program. Part of this is because you're going to be paying for the med school, but residency, they're hiring and paying you. If you need to be sponsored for a visa, you'll need an institution who's willing to do the sponsoring.

4) Australian PR. I married an Australian, and had PR before I started working here. I also completed my medical school and all my training in the US before I came over, which made the transition a lot easier than if I was planning on doing my training here and then trying to get a job too. I'm not the best one to guide you through that process, but here's the link to the Australian website regarding getting a visa to study:
Welcome to the Department of Home Affairs
You don't need PR to go to medical school, but if you want to stay afterwards and do your training, you'll be at a large disadvantage if you don't have it.
My understanding is that you should be able to qualify for a visa if you can document you've been accepted into an Australian medical school.
I'd look at just going this route first and then trying to figure out PR once you're actually here.

I've a lot more I can tell you, but why don't we start with this and see what you think.

Hi wow, this thread has really been an eye-opener. I am also a foreign national who studied in the US and am considering Australia not as a back up but definitely an equally good place to study. It seems like even foreign national graduates of AUS medical schools are considered IMG's. Where do you think they stand in the totem pole compared to Internationals who didn't go to Australian med schools? I would assume favorably, but not sure how much so. This looks so bleak.

In terms of the US, I know that Internationals who entered med school are considered US med graduates for residency (because they were trained here and if not on par with their US citizen peers are at least way higher than IMG's in terms of being considered by residency PD's). But your post seems to indicate otherwise? Just want to make sure i'm not misinterpreting your responses.

 

[ccrose]

Thanks for answer my questions again. So I guess the magical question is, how did you get your PR? Did you also marry an Australian or is there some other alternative around this?

Hi been reading through your posts, and a lot of your concerns seem very similar to mine! I'm going to apply to the 2020 cycle and would love to know where you ended up for medical school, and how that's working out for you? Also if you have any words of advice or secrets to share, please do let me know!

 

[C.P.]

Hi wow, this thread has really been an eye-opener. I am also a foreign national who studied in the US and am considering Australia not as a back up but definitely an equally good place to study. It seems like even foreign national graduates of AUS medical schools are considered IMG's. Where do you think they stand in the totem pole compared to Internationals who didn't go to Australian med schools? I would assume favorably, but not sure how much so. This looks so bleak.

In terms of the US, I know that Internationals who entered med school are considered US med graduates for residency (because they were trained here and if not on par with their US citizen peers are at least way higher than IMG's in terms of being considered by residency PD's). But your post seems to indicate otherwise? Just want to make sure i'm not misinterpreting your responses.

Every country has different ways of trying to protect their local graduates. Some countries simply do it at different points in the training system.
For the US, it's getting into medical school. Once you're a US grad, then going through the US system is much easier.
In Australia, the limiting factor is your residency and where you trained.
Residency status doesn't limit where you can train and work, but it means locals (permanent residents and citizens, get first preference for training positions). Afterwards, as a consultant/attending, you're then given a hurdle of having restrictions on where you can work for up to 10 years.
(this is an issue, but not a deal breaker, so focus on this later).
If you studied in the US, then you simply need to go through the AMC pathway to get your medial credentials accepted, and then insert into the broader training program here.

The harder step is getting a work visa. There are a number of ways of getting around this, and the training programs, if they'll accept you into a spot, will usually work with you to get a skilled working visa.
The key is this, when applying to a residency/training spot, if you're not a permanent resident or citizen, you can apply with no hassles, but they have to consider local applicants first. How this works is; you apply at the same time and in the same way as everyone else, but when they come to making selections for the program, they need to reasonably show that there were no other, equally qualified and capable local applicants who could have taken the position.

Here's your first port of call for getting your medical credentials certified:
Medical Board of Australia - The role of the Australian Medical Council

After that, it varies slightly depending on what state you'd like to train in.
International Medical Graduates

The link to New South Wales (my state) is broken. Here's a functional link:
International Medical Graduate Information

Be prepared to have to take an english test.
I was able to get out of it, but just barely.

The short moral of all this is simple: moving to another country to continue medical training or practice is never easy or straightforward, but it can be really worthwhile. You just have to have a reasonable motivation to do it.
Without that, it's just hassle without a big upside.

For me, I wouldn't go back. I really enjoy where I am and what I do. That being said, I think I'm a bit of an optimist too and try to find the upside to most situations.

Maybe that's good advice too.
Does this help?

 

[BigPikachu]

My advice is:

1) Ask yourself if you and your family are prepared to uproot from your home country and relocate to Australia (and potentially to a rural country town). Australia is a lovely country but you and your family have to be in a frame in mind to do this, because relocating is a big life decision more than a professional one. The rest is really just how motivated and committed you are to having your qualifications recognised and if you're willing to endure having to redo some examinations, some training time under supervised practice, and/or potentially practice in rural area-of-need for a decade.

2) Complete your training in your home country -- and hopefully it's a country where your degree and specialist training is recognised in Australia. That is, if you're in what I call the "limbo training years" -- student, internship, residency, registrarship -- complete it where you currently are and then migrate and apply for equivalent specialist recognition. It's already a tedious process even if you're fully qualified specialist; it's even more messy and complicated if you're do it whilst in the middle of traineeship; you end-up having to repeat a good proportion of your training and/or examinations if you decide to come over midway through your traineeship.

Good luck, mate!

 

[ccrose]

Every country has different ways of trying to protect their local graduates. Some countries simply do it at different points in the training system.
For the US, it's getting into medical school. Once you're a US grad, then going through the US system is much easier.
In Australia, the limiting factor is your residency and where you trained.
Residency status doesn't limit where you can train and work, but it means locals (permanent residents and citizens, get first preference for training positions). Afterwards, as a consultant/attending, you're then given a hurdle of having restrictions on where you can work for up to 10 years.
(this is an issue, but not a deal breaker, so focus on this later).
If you studied in the US, then you simply need to go through the AMC pathway to get your medial credentials accepted, and then insert into the broader training program here.

The harder step is getting a work visa. There are a number of ways of getting around this, and the training programs, if they'll accept you into a spot, will usually work with you to get a skilled working visa.
The key is this, when applying to a residency/training spot, if you're not a permanent resident or citizen, you can apply with no hassles, but they have to consider local applicants first. How this works is; you apply at the same time and in the same way as everyone else, but when they come to making selections for the program, they need to reasonably show that there were no other, equally qualified and capable local applicants who could have taken the position.

Here's your first port of call for getting your medical credentials certified:
Medical Board of Australia - The role of the Australian Medical Council

After that, it varies slightly depending on what state you'd like to train in.
International Medical Graduates

The link to New South Wales (my state) is broken. Here's a functional link:
International Medical Graduate Information

Be prepared to have to take an english test.
I was able to get out of it, but just barely.

The short moral of all this is simple: moving to another country to continue medical training or practice is never easy or straightforward, but it can be really worthwhile. You just have to have a reasonable motivation to do it.
Without that, it's just hassle without a big upside.

For me, I wouldn't go back. I really enjoy where I am and what I do. That being said, I think I'm a bit of an optimist too and try to find the upside to most situations.

Maybe that's good advice too.
Does this help?

Thanks! I appreciate this. I might have some more specific questions as I apply, and if you are able/have the time for it would love any inputs you have. Will be watching this thread

 

[xresident]

Hello C.P, hope everything is going well! I have tried to get a position through the competent authority pathway without success for over 6 months. Got a couple of interviews and was selected into a suitable pool of applicants after the interview in one of them but then that was it. I remember you saying you can apply for specialist recognition even without having finishing the speciliaty officially? I have 2 years of accredited obgyn training in the USA and a year of non accredited obyn training in Peru, before coming to Australia last year. I have been doing research in a lab and had a couple of papers published but I really miss getting into the medical field again. I have almost 300 c-sections and 300 vaginal deliveries which a local australian gets by the end of their obgyn training, and that motivates me to apply, I have good recommendation letters too, however, when I read the RANZCOG this is what they wrote
Eligibility Criteria


To be eligible to apply for assessment with RANZCOG applicants must:

• hold a primary degree in medicine and surgery issued by a medical school listed in the WHO publication World Dictionary of Medical Schools, and recognised by the Australian Medical Council (AMC)
• have completed formal post-graduate training in obstetrics and gynaecology
• have obtained specialist recognition from a recognised college or equivalent body and provide evidence of specialist recognition
• have participated in a continuing professional development program since obtaining the specialist qualification
• have recency of practice in the relevant scope of practice
• demonstrate they have the necessary English language skills for the purpose of registration with the Australian Health Practitioner Registration Agency (AHPRA).

Have you heard or know anyone that apply for evaluation of the college without finishing the specialty? Thank you for helping!!!

 

[C.P.]

It's true, to a degree.
For the US, we have our official training (residency) and then board certification. During that interim period, we're considered "board eligible". Applying to Australia, this would have counted for finishing our training (even though we hadn't obtained board certification yet).
In your case, I've got a feeling they'll need to have some recognition of a specialist-level certification.
Don't be discouraged though.
I know 6 months seems like a long time, but I tried applying, initially, for about a year, till I finally got a better feel for how the system works and the application process progresses.
One thing that can help is if you're flexible with start times.

Keeping in touch with a place you interviewed at but didn't get a spot (if you feel like they may be interested) and letting them intermittently know you'd happily come in mid-year, can make you an ideal choice to fill an unexpected opening.

That flexibility is something most local applicants can't offer.

Does this help?

 

[sean80439]

Hello C.P, hope everything is going well! I have tried to get a position through the competent authority pathway without success for over 6 months. Got a couple of interviews and was selected into a suitable pool of applicants after the interview in one of them but then that was it. I remember you saying you can apply for specialist recognition even without having finishing the speciliaty officially? I have 2 years of accredited obgyn training in the USA and a year of non accredited obyn training in Peru, before coming to Australia last year. I have been doing research in a lab and had a couple of papers published but I really miss getting into the medical field again. I have almost 300 c-sections and 300 vaginal deliveries which a local australian gets by the end of their obgyn training, and that motivates me to apply, I have good recommendation letters too, however, when I read the RANZCOG this is what they wrote
Eligibility Criteria


To be eligible to apply for assessment with RANZCOG applicants must:

• hold a primary degree in medicine and surgery issued by a medical school listed in the WHO publication World Dictionary of Medical Schools, and recognised by the Australian Medical Council (AMC)
• have completed formal post-graduate training in obstetrics and gynaecology
• have obtained specialist recognition from a recognised college or equivalent body and provide evidence of specialist recognition
• have participated in a continuing professional development program since obtaining the specialist qualification
• have recency of practice in the relevant scope of practice
• demonstrate they have the necessary English language skills for the purpose of registration with the Australian Health Practitioner Registration Agency (AHPRA).

Have you heard or know anyone that apply for evaluation of the college without finishing the specialty? Thank you for helping!!!

You are planning on doing the entire specialist training in Australia or are you trying to skip it and gain consultant status?

 

[Liquid8]

Have you heard or know anyone that apply for evaluation of the college without finishing the specialty? Thank you for helping!!!

Via: https://www.medicalboard.gov.au/doc...14120&dbid=AP&chksum=UwTVUB0ErD5lugUQLSf3FA==

If you have not obtained a specialist qualification, you would only be eligible for standard, competent or the short term training pathway, with the latter being an option only if you have been offered the relevant position.

 

[xresident]

Thank you very much for your reply C.P and Liquid. It helped a lot indeed. Sean I think I wont be able to do the shortcut as I have been out of clinical practice for over a year, just lab research since then. Still applying through the competent authority pathway, lets see what happens. Cheers.

 

[braineddetermined]

Sorry to bump an old thread but I’m interested in the following and haven’t found a clear answer yet:

For someone who wants to work as a GP in Australia and obtained their medical degree + finished their GP/family medicine 3 year long training in an EU country could there be a remote possibility to be categorised as “non comparable” (instead of partially) when undergoing the assessment process?

I understand that they have to go with the Specialist pathway, but then what happens if they’re classified as not comparable? Do they have to work for 2 years under supervision or more?

 

[C.P.]

That's a tough question, but mainly because we're talking about General Practice.
Being in a specialty/sub-specialty means getting your general medical credentials certified, and then assessed by your specialist medical college.
I'm not sure how it works with the RACGPs, but they're website seems pretty detailed:

RACGP - General Practice Experience Pathway

The General Practice Experience Pathway recognises the skills and knowledge acquired via work experience in Australia and overseas

www.racgp.org.au

I believe the assessment pathway follows these steps:

RACGP - Commencing on the pathway

See an overview of the experience assessment process

www.racgp.org.au

Afterwhich, if you're deemed eligible to proceed, you're then given the go ahead to sit their final exams:

If you have your GP fellowship from an EU body, you may be eligible to go through the PEP pathway:

RACGP - A guide to completing the PEP Specialist Stream Comparability Assessment

Specialist international medical graduates (SIMGs) seeking to enter the PEP Specialist Stream must complete the Comparability Assessment

www.racgp.org.au

It's only for those with qualifications from the following:

• Membership of the Royal College of General Practitioners
• Membership of the Irish College of General Practitioners
• Fellowship of the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners
• Certification in The College of Family Physicians of Canada
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Sweden
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Netherlands
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Spain
• Specialist in Family Medicine Malta

I'm not certain, but I'm guessing the PEP pathway (practice experience program), is a faster/easier way to progress through the hoops.

This is all well outside my experience though, so I can't really offer much more assistance than that though.

Does this help?

 

[braineddetermined]

That's a tough question, but mainly because we're talking about General Practice.
Being in a specialty/sub-specialty means getting your general medical credentials certified, and then assessed by your specialist medical college.
I'm not sure how it works with the RACGPs, but they're website seems pretty detailed:

RACGP - General Practice Experience Pathway

The General Practice Experience Pathway recognises the skills and knowledge acquired via work experience in Australia and overseas

www.racgp.org.au

I believe the assessment pathway follows these steps:

RACGP - Commencing on the pathway

See an overview of the experience assessment process

www.racgp.org.au

Afterwhich, if you're deemed eligible to proceed, you're then given the go ahead to sit their final exams:

If you have your GP fellowship from an EU body, you may be eligible to go through the PEP pathway:

RACGP - A guide to completing the PEP Specialist Stream Comparability Assessment

Specialist international medical graduates (SIMGs) seeking to enter the PEP Specialist Stream must complete the Comparability Assessment

www.racgp.org.au

It's only for those with qualifications from the following:

• Membership of the Royal College of General Practitioners
• Membership of the Irish College of General Practitioners
• Fellowship of the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners
• Certification in The College of Family Physicians of Canada
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Sweden
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Netherlands
• Certificate of Specific Training for General Practice Spain
• Specialist in Family Medicine Malta

I'm not certain, but I'm guessing the PEP pathway (practice experience program), is a faster/easier way to progress through the hoops.

This is all well outside my experience though, so I can't really offer much more assistance than that though.

Does this help?

It helps a lot!! Thank you!

In their case ( it’s a relative of mine not me) they did their GP training in Italy so I guess they couldn’t go with the PEP Specialist pathway, but the PEP Standard stream route. Let’s hope that they could at least be 50% comparable.

 

[BigPikachu]

Sorry to bump an old thread but I’m interested in the following and haven’t found a clear answer yet:

For someone who wants to work as a GP in Australia and obtained their medical degree + finished their GP/family medicine (3 year long training) in an EU country could there be a remote possibility to be categorised as “non comparable” (instead of partially) when undergoing the assessment process?

I understand that they have to go with the Specialist pathway, but then what happens if they’re classified as not comparable? Do they have to work for 2 years under supervision or more?

It helps a lot!! Thank you!

In their case ( it’s a relative of mine not me) they did their GP training in Italy so I guess they couldn’t go with the PEP Specialist pathway, but the PEP Standard stream route. Let’s hope that they could at least be 50% comparable.

Unforunately the RACGP or ACRRM does not recognise the Italian GP training.

1) AHPRA / AMC has to verify the University's medical school degree. If so, you can have Provisional Registrarion.
2) You need to practice at least one year at a state public hospital under supervision AND you need to sit an exam to gain the AMC Certificate to gain General Registration.
3) Choose either the Standard Pathway (takes about 3+ years) or Practice Experience Pathway (takes about 5+ years) or Rural Vocational Training Scheme (RVTS) to gain GP Fellowship and thus Specialist Registrarion to practice in General Practice / Family Medicine.
4) Find a job atan accredited General Practice / Medical Centre. Regardless, given you're an International Medical Graduate, the Government will require you to work in an area-of-need (i.e. rural township) for at least 10 years before you can have access to an unrestricted Medicare Provider Number to access private billings.

Good luck!