The SDN advantage

[neurodjent]

Its indisputable that SDN is a haven for neurotic, fear-mongering skepticism conceived by anal Type-A personalities or trolls. However, its also filled with invaluable information from applying to medical school to succeeding in a career as a physician. I personally started visiting SDN when I first decided that I wanted to attend medical school and had to take the MCAT and I fully recognize that my success in garnering an acceptance/doing well on the MCAT was due to the guidance of many SDN users (even the crazy ones). When I spoke with others regarding medical school or the MCAT, they had no clue what they were talking about, aiming for Harvard with a 2.5 GPA or thinking that 2 weeks of light MCAT studying will land them a 528/45. I felt significantly advantaged throughout this process and have become more knowledgeable about the intricacies of the field in general, from policies to clinical practice. With that being said, it seems that the indispensable knowledge left to obtain on this site throughout medical school is ever present, especially regarding step 1 studying and applying to residency programs. I would imagine that this information will also give me a certain advantage over my peers.

Essentially I am curious. Do most medical students know about/visit SDN? Do you think that the knowledge contained on this site gives individuals an advantage (the SDN advantage)?

An even bigger leap. Do you think those that do better on step 1/2 and match into top tier residencies use this site?

I'm just generally curious how this site seems to be a best kept secret and if those who use it and don't achieve similar outcomes.

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[Azete]

SDN gives a pretty sizable advantage to pre-meds, because the vast majority of pre-meds are utterly clueless so any semblance of good guidance is going give them an edge over their peers.

Beyond that, not so much. The people that score well on step 1/2 are the people that work the hardest, and there's really not much else to it than that. The folks walking around with 250+ Step 1 scores aren't necessarily the smartest, but rather the people that can study 9-10 hours in a day for classes and still find another 2-3 hours for board studying. MS2 has been a real challenge for me, because as much as we all love to say we're going to study 15 hours a day, it's hard to put in a full day of class work and then choose to use your free time for boards rather than relaxing.

 

[neurodjent]

I definitely understand that, in order to be at the top, one must push themselves very hard and study like they've never studied before. However, perusing some of these forums, I see many medical students asking what resources are available or even how to study for Step 1. This sounds as if, even in medical school, people still have no clue how to go about succeeding on Step 1. Being on this site provides a plethora of study resources, methods, and secrets. From the UFAP method to hidden gems like Bro's Anki deck and even the knowledge that more qbank questions answered correlates strongly with a higher score, these are all things that I have learned from this site. And since it was news to many medical students in the forums, I am assuming it would definitely be news to medical students who don't use this site. While there is amazing advice regarding Step 1, that's not even the only thing that I see stumping current medical students. Some seem to have no clue where they stand in competition for a certain residency they want, how many residencies to apply to, or how to go about setting up audition rotations. If there are a few medical students who don't know this information on these forums, I am assuming there are many more who don't know it either. Many people on these forums even discuss that individuals were ill-informed coming into certain parts of their training and it's why they didn't get what they want. I know that I am not in medical school yet but it's hard to believe that many medical students already know the abundance of information this site contains on how to succeed in one's medical career. Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Winged Scapula]

I definitely understand that, in order to be at the top, one must push themselves very hard and study like they've never studied before. However, perusing some of these forums, I see many medical students asking what resources are available or even how to study for Step 1. This sounds as if, even in medical school, people still have no clue how to go about succeeding on Step 1. Being on this site provides a plethora of study resources, methods, and secrets. From the UFAP method to hidden gems like Bro's Anki deck and even the knowledge that more qbank questions answered correlates strongly with a higher score, these are all things that I have learned from this site. And since it was news to many medical students in the forums, I am assuming it would definitely be news to medical students who don't use this site. While there is amazing advice regarding Step 1, that's not even the only thing that I see stumping current medical students. Some seem to have no clue where they stand in competition for a certain residency they want, how many residencies to apply to, or how to go about setting up audition rotations. If there are a few medical students who don't know this information on these forums, I am assuming there are many more who don't know it either. Many people on these forums even discuss that individuals were ill-informed coming into certain parts of their training and it's why they didn't get what they want. I know that I am not in medical school yet but it's hard to believe that many medical students already know the abundance of information this site contains on how to succeed in one's medical career. Please correct me if I am wrong.

You're not wrong.

While the pre-med forums are the busiest, it is clear from reading the threads that med students don't know what resources to use to study, how to apply to the match, how the match works (a perennial source of confusion). The attending forum has people asking about job offers, and advice from colleagues. I see its usefulness extending a great deal beyond the pre-med students.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

All depends. Great students can afford to screw things up with the match, but some students don't have the luxury. Having a good advisor in the field of interest that can help navigate things like the match process is imperitive in my opinion, especially for students that want to match in competitive fields but who aren't top students from top schools. At least that's what I tell myself, it motivates me to keep coming back to answer questions!

 

[neurodjent]

All depends. Great students can afford to screw things up with the match, but some students don't have the luxury. Having a good advisor in the field of interest that can help navigate things like the match process is imperitive in my opinion, especially for students that want to match in competitive fields but who aren't top students from top schools. At least that's what I tell myself, it motivates me to keep coming back to answer questions!

You are doing the EM hopefuls on this site a great service by providing such valuable information regarding the match process and EM specific information. Since educating medical students on this website is something that you took upon yourself to educate medical students, does this mean that medical schools are not providing this information to their students or at least providing them the avenues to obtain such information?

Individuals such as yourself being mentors on this site is exactly why I see the use of SDN as providing an advantage over students who do not use SDN.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

You are doing the EM hopefuls on this site a great service by providing such valuable information regarding the match process and EM specific information. Since educating medical students on this website is something that you took upon yourself to educate medical students, does this mean that medical schools are not providing this information to their students or at least providing them the avenues to obtain such information?

Individuals such as yourself being mentors on this site is exactly why I see the use of SDN as providing an advantage over students who do not use SDN.

Some schools definitely do. I had great advisers where I went to medical school. But I went to a university-based allopathic school with an EM residency and numerous faculty. I could walk down the hall into the ED and easily choose an advisor.

The reason I post mainly on the osteopathic forurms is that I've come to realize they don't have that luxury. When I started working at a former AOA program (now ACGME), I was really surprised how little the medical students interested in EM had in terms of guidance. Something as simple as the importance of the sloe in terms of match competitveness was completely foreign to some. But since the AOA match was a viable option with 60 some programs back then, it was less of an issue because that match was less competitive and there was a lot of opportunity there. Once programs started falling out of the AOA match, I foresaw this lack of advice being a problem as more and more students we're going to have to enter the ACGME match, and eventually it all being combined anyway and they'd have to compete on the same level no matter what eventually.

I had lurked on SDN back when I was a medical student briefly and occasionally when I was a resident, but I made an account a year ago for this reason, to try to reach out to students that felt like they couldn't find an advisor on the other side of the aisle, especially DO students because of the way their schools/roations are structured. It really snowballed into way more interest in the topic than I thought I had and honestly I didnt expect to come in contact with nearly the # of students I have.

Its always a blast to me during interview season when someone tells me they've read something I wrote or took some piece of advice. Obviously, with the forums being anonymous I have no clue who anyone is, but I met tons of people on the interview trail who thanked me at the end of the interview about SDN who I had no idea I had talked too before since I didnt know their name. Always a cool moment to realize that and it really does make it worth it.

EM has been great to me, but I just love medicine in general. I love the mystery, the game of figuring out undifferentiated cases. I always knew I wanted to work in medical education because to me, I like being surrounded by people who are still excited and passionate about medicine and learning. When you're out on your own, just working in an ER, things get monotonous and boring after you see the same thing over and over. But working with residents and students keeps things fresh, and is always fun. I cant imagine ever wanting to work outside of academics for me. So SDN is a natural extension of that, just a great place to connect with people who want to talk about medicine and med education.

Just my reasoning for why I post here as much as I do, if anyone wondered.

 

[Redpancreas]

Its indisputable that SDN is a haven for neurotic, fear-mongering skepticism conceived by anal Type-A personalities or trolls. However, its also filled with invaluable information from applying to medical school to succeeding in a career as a physician. I personally started visiting SDN when I first decided that I wanted to attend medical school and had to take the MCAT and I fully recognize that my success in garnering an acceptance/doing well on the MCAT was due to the guidance of many SDN users (even the crazy ones). When I spoke with others regarding medical school or the MCAT, they had no clue what they were talking about, aiming for Harvard with a 2.5 GPA or thinking that 2 weeks of light MCAT studying will land them a 528/45. I felt significantly advantaged throughout this process and have become more knowledgeable about the intricacies of the field in general, from policies to clinical practice. With that being said, it seems that the indispensable knowledge left to obtain on this site throughout medical school is ever present, especially regarding step 1 studying and applying to residency programs. I would imagine that this information will also give me a certain advantage over my peers.

Essentially I am curious. Do most medical students know about/visit SDN? Do you think that the knowledge contained on this site gives individuals an advantage (the SDN advantage)?

An even bigger leap. Do you think those that do better on step 1/2 and match into top tier residencies use this site?

I'm just generally curious how this site seems to be a best kept secret and if those who use it and don't achieve similar outcomes.

No, most of what you need you can get from searching "insert question" SDN. You don't even need to be a member.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[NecrotizingFasciitis]

This post resonates so strongly with me. I came from a smaller school, where the advisers would have had me applying to medical schools with an abysmal GPA and would have had me taking the MCAT 2 years earlier than I did.. 100% would have bombed the exam. After failures like that, I probably would have given up. My advisers saw me as another pre-med they wanted to graduate and get out of their institution so they didn't have to deal with me anymore. I am so incredibly happy I started using SDN.

I started advising a few students at my undergrad on applying to medical school/studying for the MCAT in the free time I have now in the hope that I can help a few others that I think will make incredible docs make it to medical school, despite their lack of support from the school.

I completely agree that, at least to those students in undergrad that don't have quality undergraduate advisers, SDN gives you a large advantage and exposes you to issues/study materials/tricks of the trade that other pre-meds will unfortunately never be exposed to.

This issue begs the question, how often does poor advising (or lack thereof) result in a potentially incredible future physician not acquiring a seat in medical school? How many students are now stuck in unfulfilling careers, despite their potential to make it to medical school, simply due poor application strategy?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[SunnyDO]

This post resonates so strongly with me. I came from a smaller school, where the advisers would have had me applying to medical schools with an abysmal GPA and would have had me taking the MCAT 2 years earlier than I did.. 100% would have bombed the exam. After failures like that, I probably would have given up. My advisers saw me as another pre-med they wanted to graduate and get out of their institution so they didn't have to deal with me anymore. I am so incredibly happy I started using SDN.

I started advising a few students at my undergrad on applying to medical school/studying for the MCAT in the free time I have now in the hope that I can help a few others that I think will make incredible docs make it to medical school, despite their lack of support from the school.

I completely agree that, at least to those students in undergrad that don't have quality undergraduate advisers, SDN gives you a large advantage and exposes you to issues/study materials/tricks of the trade that other pre-meds will unfortunately never be exposed to.

This issue begs the question, how often does poor advising (or lack thereof) result in a potentially incredible future physician not acquiring a seat in medical school? How many students are now stuck in unfulfilling careers, despite their potential to make it to medical school, simply due poor application strategy?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

Shout out to passing down knowledge to the next gen .

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Shout out to passing down knowledge to the next gen .

Medicine is a brotherhood/sisterhood, its an exclusive group that makes up only 0.3% of society. All of us got to where we are and know what we know based on the success and failures of those that came before us.

After all its part of the modern Hippocratic Oath:
"I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk, and gladly share such knowledge as is mine with those who are to follow."

As well as the original:
"...and to teach them this art, if they want to learn it, without fee or indenture; to impart precept, oral instruction, and all other instruction to my own sons, the sons of my teacher, and to indentured pupils who have taken the physician’s oath"

So... it's kind of what we are supposed to do, right?!

 

[Xavieous]

This post resonates so strongly with me. I came from a smaller school, where the advisers would have had me applying to medical schools with an abysmal GPA and would have had me taking the MCAT 2 years earlier than I did.. 100% would have bombed the exam. After failures like that, I probably would have given up. My advisers saw me as another pre-med they wanted to graduate and get out of their institution so they didn't have to deal with me anymore. I am so incredibly happy I started using SDN.

I started advising a few students at my undergrad on applying to medical school/studying for the MCAT in the free time I have now in the hope that I can help a few others that I think will make incredible docs make it to medical school, despite their lack of support from the school.

I completely agree that, at least to those students in undergrad that don't have quality undergraduate advisers, SDN gives you a large advantage and exposes you to issues/study materials/tricks of the trade that other pre-meds will unfortunately never be exposed to.

This issue begs the question, how often does poor advising (or lack thereof) result in a potentially incredible future physician not acquiring a seat in medical school? How many students are now stuck in unfulfilling careers, despite their potential to make it to medical school, simply due poor application strategy?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

I went to a large university for my undergrad (25k+ students) and shuffled through three sets of "pre-medical" advisors before finding one that told me anything except 'give-up, your gpa sucks, you'll never be able to handle it'. SDN was/is a god send for me as it showed me others who had my similar struggles and how to push through them. I find learning of how others succeeded is the fastest way to finding your own path to success, and it is hard to find another place than here where you can get so much advice and guidance.

 

[Xavieous]

...and sure there is some trolling, but it is the internet, right? We should all be able to identify use common sense and a 20 second google search to oust them. Then just consume what the other 90% of people say here and use it to gain wisdom, avoid mistakes, and accelerate ourselves to our goals.

 

[DrWBD]

Just wanted to say I found SDN to be an invaluable resource as a student and resident.

 

[D4C]

Nothing super meaningful to contribute, but does anyone else think of this every time they scroll by this thread? Is it just me?!

 

[SurgDoc95]

Nothing super meaningful to contribute, but does anyone else think of this every time they scroll by this thread? Is it just me?!

Got a feeling that dates most of us

 

[IslandStyle808]

Got a feeling that dates most of us

Not me anyway, it was my first system.

 

[abolt18]

I definitely think it has been invaluable since I was getting ready to take the MCAT. The boards (step 1 and 2) forums were excellent when preparing for the respective tests. The specialty specific forums are full of mentors (attendings and residents) who have provided excellent guidance. SDN has helped me more than any advisor ever has at school.

 

[tiedyeddog]

SDN was really useful as a premed and a medical student for me. I haven't found it very useful as a resident.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Nothing super meaningful to contribute, but does anyone else think of this every time they scroll by this thread? Is it just me?!

I never found that controller to give me an advantage.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Not me anyway, it was my first system.

I had an atari 2060, but the Christmas my brothers and I got the original nintendo still to this day is the most memorable christmas of my childhood.

 

[Spectreman]

I had an atari 2060, but the Christmas my brothers and I got the original nintendo still to this day is the most memorable christmas of my childhood.

I've come to learn that you have to be really thick-skinned if you want to comment or seek direct advice on SDN. I'd say the vast majority of beneficiaries are lurking in the background, and that there are many more than most of us realize. Really grateful to people like OP and Goro and such for chiming in with meaningful advice. As I get ready to start med school I'm trying to use SDN to look ahead and honestly I feel kind of lost. Going from accepted med student to ending up where I want to be seems like a confusing road. Years 1&2 seem pretty straight-forward, but I would love to have a better game plan for after that. Anyway, thanks again!!

 

[MSTP18]

I've come to learn that you have to be really thick-skinned if you want to comment or seek direct advice on SDN. I'd say the vast majority of beneficiaries are lurking in the background, and that there are many more than most of us realize. Really grateful to people like OP and Goro and such for chiming in with meaningful advice. As I get ready to start med school I'm trying to use SDN to look ahead and honestly I feel kind of lost. Going from accepted med student to ending up where I want to be seems like a confusing road. Years 1&2 seem pretty straight-forward, but I would love to have a better game plan for after that. Anyway, thanks again!!

1% rule (Internet culture) - Wikipedia

 

[germanborn]

Its indisputable that SDN is a haven for neurotic, fear-mongering skepticism conceived by anal Type-A personalities or trolls. However...

I feel I have to dispute the "However". Perhaps it is because I am younger than most here (entering undergrad next fall), but I definitely think the trolls and skeptics are a vital part of the SDN resource to some extent. I have been following this forum all throughout high school and the underbelly types offer something other than the "ideal SDNer" - reality. It helps you better judge where you stand.Those around you IRL will shape you throughout the entire process, so getting to the kernel of truth in (most of) the bs on SDN is, for lack of better explanation, the easier way to learn than falling flat at every pothole in the actual entire med education process, as so many others seem to do.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

I never found that controller to give me an advantage.

Use turbo mode on punchout when you get knocked down. It really gives you an advantage.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Use turbo mode on punchout when you get knocked down. It really gives you an advantage.

I never beat Tyson in punchout. To this day, I still regret it. I hate not completing games.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

"...and to teach them this art, if they want to learn it, without fee or indenture; to impart precept, oral instruction, and all other instruction to my own sons, the sons of my teacher, and to indentured pupils who have taken the physician’s oath"

So... it's kind of what we are supposed to do, right?!

So much for that.

 

[surfguy84]

Its indisputable that SDN is a haven for neurotic, fear-mongering skepticism conceived by anal Type-A personalities or trolls. However, its also filled with invaluable information from applying to medical school to succeeding in a career as a physician. I personally started visiting SDN when I first decided that I wanted to attend medical school and had to take the MCAT and I fully recognize that my success in garnering an acceptance/doing well on the MCAT was due to the guidance of many SDN users (even the crazy ones). When I spoke with others regarding medical school or the MCAT, they had no clue what they were talking about, aiming for Harvard with a 2.5 GPA or thinking that 2 weeks of light MCAT studying will land them a 528/45. I felt significantly advantaged throughout this process and have become more knowledgeable about the intricacies of the field in general, from policies to clinical practice. With that being said, it seems that the indispensable knowledge left to obtain on this site throughout medical school is ever present, especially regarding step 1 studying and applying to residency programs. I would imagine that this information will also give me a certain advantage over my peers.

Essentially I am curious. Do most medical students know about/visit SDN? Do you think that the knowledge contained on this site gives individuals an advantage (the SDN advantage)?

An even bigger leap. Do you think those that do better on step 1/2 and match into top tier residencies use this site?

I'm just generally curious how this site seems to be a best kept secret and if those who use it and don't achieve similar outcomes.

reddit med school sub > this site.