I'm in San Francisco and I really want to shadow a physician assistant. Does anyone have any ideas/connections in getting started with this? If there are any physician assistants in this area, please message me as I would greatly appreciate the opportunity to shadow you. Thanks!
Shadowing Physician Assistants
- Thread starter Rang1234
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Why would you want to follow a PA...? If you want to learn anything, follow their SP! 
D
deleted6669
SP= supervising physician. some states = sponsoring physician. most practices are going to either "participating physician" or "collaborating physician" as this is a better rreflection of the roles they generally play in those practices in which they are involved in real time with both PAs and patients. . I have a "sponsoring physician" of record. my state and hospital do not require chart review, so he is available as a resource if I ever need to call him(never have). nice guy, but if I have a question I can't answer I'm going to end up talking to a specialist anyway, so I just call them.
I agree with almost all of the points you made, albeit with dialed down intensity. Those points you cited were the primary reasons I decided to make the switch from pursuing PA to becoming an NP. I personally didn't want to be in a dependent position with a physician for my ability to put food on the table, and I wasn't going to pay a premium to obtain rights to that role. I also didn't want to re certify many times over my career. There were a few more things, but overall, I think you hit close to the mark.
I'm not sure the PA field is in a death spiral, nor facing a crisis of quality instruction, nor are they a ponzi scheme. I think a lot of the push back you got at the PA forums (I recognize you from there) was due to a lot of your fellow PA's chaffing at some hard truth's hitting their pride at what you all had personally accomplished, and doing it all at once. I've seen most of the folks over there complaining regularly about the same things you presented them with. But those are folks that put a lot of time, effort, and money into becoming a dependent provider. They were rightly frustrated by the facts of the profession when compared to NP's. But when I spent time over there, there didn't seem to be any will to do anything about it. Folks were actually getting ticked that there were pre PA's that were wondering what was wrong with the system. Fast forward to now, and there seems to be some appetite for change, but its too late for that. I don't think the folks that felt like you were a troll were jabbing at you for financial reasons, I just think that after the effort they put into their PA degree, they aren't in the mood to hear that there is a way to do the same things as them without being taken to the cleaners. But them screaming "we should have more than NP's because we are better than them" doesn't get them out of all the work it took for NP's to get where they are. For a long time, NP's took hits for not being physician's helpers while PA's reaped rewards for their subservience.
I know its not a perfect comparison, but most professions out there run their own show... physical therapists, optometrists, dentist (with the exception of their own little helpers, hygienists), DO's, NP's, even chiropractors. It was disconcerting to me to imagine entering a profession that was a subset of a more dominant profession. That's a weakness that always gave me pause as I was hoping to become a PA.
In the comic book world, its a bit humiliating to be Robin, because you rely on Batman to give you a ride to where you are going, and you have to use the stuff he provides you. Batman is more than willing to make you wear an outfit that makes you look more like Ronald McDonald than someone to be feared. Whether or not you wear the circus outfit isn't your choice, if you want to work... its Batman's call.
I'm not sure the PA field is in a death spiral, nor facing a crisis of quality instruction, nor are they a ponzi scheme. I think a lot of the push back you got at the PA forums (I recognize you from there) was due to a lot of your fellow PA's chaffing at some hard truth's hitting their pride at what you all had personally accomplished, and doing it all at once. I've seen most of the folks over there complaining regularly about the same things you presented them with. But those are folks that put a lot of time, effort, and money into becoming a dependent provider. They were rightly frustrated by the facts of the profession when compared to NP's. But when I spent time over there, there didn't seem to be any will to do anything about it. Folks were actually getting ticked that there were pre PA's that were wondering what was wrong with the system. Fast forward to now, and there seems to be some appetite for change, but its too late for that. I don't think the folks that felt like you were a troll were jabbing at you for financial reasons, I just think that after the effort they put into their PA degree, they aren't in the mood to hear that there is a way to do the same things as them without being taken to the cleaners. But them screaming "we should have more than NP's because we are better than them" doesn't get them out of all the work it took for NP's to get where they are. For a long time, NP's took hits for not being physician's helpers while PA's reaped rewards for their subservience.
I know its not a perfect comparison, but most professions out there run their own show... physical therapists, optometrists, dentist (with the exception of their own little helpers, hygienists), DO's, NP's, even chiropractors. It was disconcerting to me to imagine entering a profession that was a subset of a more dominant profession. That's a weakness that always gave me pause as I was hoping to become a PA.
In the comic book world, its a bit humiliating to be Robin, because you rely on Batman to give you a ride to where you are going, and you have to use the stuff he provides you. Batman is more than willing to make you wear an outfit that makes you look more like Ronald McDonald than someone to be feared. Whether or not you wear the circus outfit isn't your choice, if you want to work... its Batman's call.
I feel like its been a long time since the change took place that brought their standards way up. We are 17 years into the 21st century, and most of the folks who had certificates and associates are waxing old and retiring. And if organic chemistry is the bar we use to measure competency, NP's are screwed. I'm one of the few folks in the nursing world with true heavy science to my name... ochem and biochem, along with a metric ton of biology coursework across the spectrum. Most of my nursing peers took survey classes in chemistry, which wouldn't even pass muster as an intro class for a biology major. I really don't put much fault in the training most PA's get, because its very decent. I don't buy what some PA's sell when they compare syllabuses to try to demonstrate they are more hard core than NP's, because there is a lot of credit inflation going on, but again, I took my share of nursing courses that were pretty much a waste of time. But then again, I sat through a lecture at a PA school where they were struggling through material that all of my nursing peers would have been able to teach them that day, so there is something to be said for prior experience with NP's.
I don't think the PA profession is going down, but I'm far less optimistic about it as a whole than I've ever been. The worst thing they've done is try to own the specialties and make it hard for themselves to jump around from specialty to specialty. That's when I knew they were screwed. The biggest strength PA's had was their mobility through their generalist training. Some PA folks are like "yeah, staying in a specialty and proving it by taking a certification exam will increase your cred". No, it will typecast you. Sure, NP's do plenty of boxing themselves in, but they are twice the population that PA's are, and they have a giant army of minions in the ranks of nursing to stand next to....and they look out for their own. If PA's start becoming niche figures, they will end up just like anesthesiologist's assistants... yes, the punctuation does correctly indicate a possessive, because they have none of the autonomy of CRNA's, and all the dependence upon physicians to draw a paycheck.
I don't think the PA profession is going down, but I'm far less optimistic about it as a whole than I've ever been. The worst thing they've done is try to own the specialties and make it hard for themselves to jump around from specialty to specialty. That's when I knew they were screwed. The biggest strength PA's had was their mobility through their generalist training. Some PA folks are like "yeah, staying in a specialty and proving it by taking a certification exam will increase your cred". No, it will typecast you. Sure, NP's do plenty of boxing themselves in, but they are twice the population that PA's are, and they have a giant army of minions in the ranks of nursing to stand next to....and they look out for their own. If PA's start becoming niche figures, they will end up just like anesthesiologist's assistants... yes, the punctuation does correctly indicate a possessive, because they have none of the autonomy of CRNA's, and all the dependence upon physicians to draw a paycheck.
- Joined
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What's with this unhealthy fixation and desire to apply to PA related posts if you despise them so much? By your account if you just ignored the PA profession they are "spiraling" down and go away. So, your negative banter/attack on the profession isn't needed. The ship is already going down right? You offer a lot of opinion about what is going on and no real supportive documentation. I'll be happy to assist you with fact finding and/or discussion to help expand your fund of knowledge.
