Relationship advice??

[SXMMD]

Hello!

I'm an FM resident (well, intern this coming July), my significant other is an M4 who really, really wants to pursue residency in OBGYN. She is very passionate about the field. The program I am at is an unopposed FM program and for her to pursue any residency she and I will have to spend some time away from each other.

We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about her specialty choice. My (limited) experience with OB has shown me that having a stable family life can be tough. We would like to settle down one day and start our own family, and the idea of living this rushed family life (constantly struggling to coordinate work schedules, involving a nanny in the upbringing of the kids, not getting alone time with the spouse, etc) bothers me a little.

I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice, but wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her. Before I do that I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges. Can you help a brother out with some advice and things to consider going forward?

Just a heads up, we are not yet married (or engaged), though that discussion has been on the table.

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[Dr G Oogle]

Hello!

I'm an FM resident (well, intern this coming July), my significant other is an M4 who really, really wants to pursue residency in OBGYN. She is very passionate about the field. The program I am at is an unopposed FM program and for her to pursue any residency she and I will have to spend some time away from each other.

We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about her specialty choice. My (limited) experience with OB has shown me that having a stable family life can be tough. We would like to settle down one day and start our own family, and the idea of living this rushed family life (constantly struggling to coordinate work schedules, involving a nanny in the upbringing of the kids, not getting alone time with the spouse, etc) bothers me a little.

I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice, but wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her. Before I do that I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges. Can you help a brother out with some advice and things to consider going forward?

Just a heads up, we are not yet married (or engaged), though that discussion has been on the table.

Obgyn residency is tough but any surgical residency will tough and really any residency will be stressful and put strain on a relationship. That strain may be lessened by the fact that your partner is doing something they love or worsened if they are in a field they don't enjoy even if the schedule is better. Obgyn as an attending is not bad especially if you're not in a solo practice, fellowship is also not particularly taxing. The reality is in any household with 2 professionals, not even doctors , you will need to compromise and adjust schedules wtx

 

[dabeags]

Hello!

I'm an FM resident (well, intern this coming July), my significant other is an M4 who really, really wants to pursue residency in OBGYN. She is very passionate about the field. The program I am at is an unopposed FM program and for her to pursue any residency she and I will have to spend some time away from each other.

We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about her specialty choice. My (limited) experience with OB has shown me that having a stable family life can be tough. We would like to settle down one day and start our own family, and the idea of living this rushed family life (constantly struggling to coordinate work schedules, involving a nanny in the upbringing of the kids, not getting alone time with the spouse, etc) bothers me a little.

I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice, but wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her. Before I do that I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges. Can you help a brother out with some advice and things to consider going forward?

Just a heads up, we are not yet married (or engaged), though that discussion has been on the table.

A few thoughts as a non medical person married to a current OB resident (PGY2) at a busy hospital and who now has a 3 month old.

One, regardless of medical specialty, I don't see anyway around involving others in your childcare unless one of you is going to be a stay at home. Just be happy that as two high paid professionals you will have the option to comfortably afford an in home nanny if you so choose that route.

Two, if she is all in on OB and you pressure her to pick a different field because you want a better lifestyle she is either going to dump you or just resent you for life for stopping her from pursuing her passion.

Three, OB Residency is more grueling than both of you probably anticipate, but it manageable. If you are not planning on having children during it then I wouldn't even sweat it, but you are going to have a lot of time to yourself.

After residency, there are tons of choices in how she will practice that can make her lifestyle quite nice. Shift work as a laborist, MFM making bank reading ultrasounds all day with Bankers hours, Urogyn with mostly scheduled procedures, REI, etc..

If you are going to have children while she is in residency then I hope you can be near family, it takes things to about a 12 (scale of 1-10) on the Residency really sucks for life scale, and as they say it requires a village.

Edit:Forgot to mention, my wife was choosing between Dermatology and OBGYN (puts gun to head)

 

[SXMMD]

Dr G Oogle Thank you for the advice/reality check. I guess there is an element of anxiety here now that residency is right on top of me.

dabeags, thank you for weighing in. A 3 month old? I hope you and the spouse are getting some good sleep these days! You make fair points. We are not planning to have children in residency (at least while we are both in residency), so that's a relief. I do want to support her in her passion, I appreciate the advice on that point. Derm vs OBGYN and the spouse picked OB? Cheers buddy... next drink is on me Jokes aside, I hope everything turned out even better than hoped!

Have you guys found childcare strategies that work well for you? Am I thinking about this too early?

 

[Dr G Oogle]

Live near your parents. Realistically if you have any job and your partner has any job childcare can be a big challenge. If I were you I wouldn't worry about it because as the saying goes worrying is like sitting in a rocking chair, gives you something to do but it doesn't get you anywhere. Just enjoy each others company and your child free existence

 

[dabeags]

Dr G Oogle Thank you for the advice/reality check. I guess there is an element of anxiety here now that residency is right on top of me.

dabeags, thank you for weighing in. A 3 month old? I hope you and the spouse are getting some good sleep these days! You make fair points. We are not planning to have children in residency (at least while we are both in residency), so that's a relief. I do want to support her in her passion, I appreciate the advice on that point. Derm vs OBGYN and the spouse picked OB? Cheers buddy... next drink is on me Jokes aside, I hope everything turned out even better than hoped!

Have you guys found childcare strategies that work well for you? Am I thinking about this too early?

Residency has trained my wife to be completely functional on 5-6 hours of sleep so she has been alright for the first few months. Our closest family is a 4.5 hour drive away which makes things a bit tougher on the childcare front. We were going to do an in home nanny but they are pretty expensive for one with experience. Going to go with an small daycare run out of someones home with sitters to help after hours as needed. If she was making attending bucks we'd definitely have an in home nanny though.

 

[rokshana]

Hello!

I'm an FM resident (well, intern this coming July), my significant other is an M4 who really, really wants to pursue residency in OBGYN. She is very passionate about the field. The program I am at is an unopposed FM program and for her to pursue any residency she and I will have to spend some time away from each other.

We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about her specialty choice. My (limited) experience with OB has shown me that having a stable family life can be tough. We would like to settle down one day and start our own family, and the idea of living this rushed family life (constantly struggling to coordinate work schedules, involving a nanny in the upbringing of the kids, not getting alone time with the spouse, etc) bothers me a little.

I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice, but wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her. Before I do that I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges. Can you help a brother out with some advice and things to consider going forward?

Just a heads up, we are not yet married (or engaged), though that discussion has been on the table.

well since you are doing FM you will have more free time to be able to take on some of those duties and if need be can always go part time or even stay home with the kids...

does that sound a bit belittling and condesending? so does your need to make decisions for your SO...if you don't like her choice of career, then you need to decide if this is a relationship that is for you and if not ,get out. It is one thing to say, choose a middling program over a great one because of distance or go to a community program when you want to be at an academic center to support your relationship but to be asked to change specialty for the one you want to the one you don't is simply wrong...doesn't matter how "tactful" you think you can say that.

 

[SXMMD]

well since you are doing FM you will have more free time to be able to take on some of those duties and if need be can always go part time or even stay home with the kids...

does that sound a bit belittling and condesending? so does your need to make decisions for your SO...if you don't like her choice of career, then you need to decide if this is a relationship that is for you and if not ,get out. It is one thing to say, choose a middling program over a great one because of distance or go to a community program when you want to be at an academic center to support your relationship but to be asked to change specialty for the one you want to the one you don't is simply wrong...doesn't matter how "tactful" you think you can say that.

You sound like you:
1) Didn't read the entirety of my post before getting "triggered" and misinterpreting everything that followed
2) Have struggled in your relationships

Thanks for your advice. Good luck in the future.

 

[rokshana]

You sound like you:
1) Didn't read the entirety of my post before getting "triggered" and misinterpreting everything that followed
2) Have struggled in your relationships

Thanks for your advice. Good luck in the future.

no, i read your post...you feel that your SO's choice of specialty doesn't fit in with what you envision what you want your future to be...you seem to want an SO that will pick a specialty that will give her the time to take care of you and your future children.

you said it yourself..."I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice..." but now you seem to want to do so... as was said above if you make her choose between you and her choice of career, she is going to either break up with you or resent you...is that what you really want in a relationship?

my post was to make you think about flipping it around...what if you were asked to decide between your relationship and your career...would you think that was fair?

and lets face it...as an ob/gyn, she will make more money and be the bigger income...it really would make sense for you to be the person more involved with child care and work part time than her.

 

[BigTumor]

I think if we keep in mind that he has already matched it complicates how we should interpret this since he is already (at least for now) committed. This can make her choice seem "editable."

I have a young child and am married. It is hard for any physicians to take time off when kids are sick, so that is not particularly specialty dependent. Being a resident is physically draining and for attendings that operate and deliver when on call during the day, they are also pretty beat. There is opportunity for shift work. We have been fine with daycare and help from relatives, but once we move we will need a nanny or au pair, which many of my attendings did when their kids were young. There are definitely days when I just lie on the floor and let my child jump on me and call that quality time because I am too tired or sore but that's pretty rare. All in all I am energized by what I do and I think this makes me a better spouse and parent. I do have plenty of attendings who love what they do, but many are hustling pretty hard both in clinic and on call. But either way I think you should just be a sounding board for specialty choice, provide very little opinion, and let the chips fall where they may. I want my partner to change careers, so I can relate, but even though we have a strong marriage I pretty much stop at "what else did you consider before choosing to do X" or "what other fields might make you happier" and only when apropos.

 

[DokterMom]

So you're trying to decide between supporting your SO in the field she is passionate about or pushing her toward a field she doesn't care for because it is more conducive to her being a primary childcare provider for your hypothetical future children?



Oh! Oh! Oh! Oh! -- I know!

One of you should do family medicine. That's a less demanding residency and ultimately a career with more flexibility. That way that spouse could have the more flexible schedule and be the primary caretaker while the spouse with the higher income and more demanding career takes on the primary breadwinner role.

 

[SXMMD]

Lovely. The second a professional man has questions about balancing family life with a SO who is also a professional, he's a misogynst. Want cake, and eat it much?

Allow me to re-orient you to what's actually going on:
"We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about
her specialty choice"

Read: I am committed to supporting her in her choice of specialty, but I have some fears about balancing life outside of work

"I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice"

Read: Despite my concerns, I don't want to dissuade her from her passion

"wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her."

Read: I want to support her, but I have concerns about how we will manage family stuff down the line. How do I bring this up in a way that is sensitive to her career goals?

"I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges."

Read: I want to support her, I have concerns about family life that I want to bring up with her, before I do I want to know how others who've already had this issue handled it so that I can draw from their advice and experience

Are you with me so far?

Dr G oogle and dabeags posted excellent responses. My answer to them:

"Dr G Oogle Thank you for the advice/reality check. I guess there is an element of anxiety here now that residency is right on top of me."
to dabeags: "I do want to support her in her passion, I appreciate the advice on that point."

@rokshana:
"well since you are doing FM you will have more free time to be able to take on some of those duties and if need be can always go part time or even stay home with the kids...

does that sound a bit belittling and condesending?"

No, it doesn't at all sound condescending. Why should it? I am a family man, the well being of my family supersedes career goals every time. It may surprise you to know that I volunteered these possibilities to my SO already. She was happy, I am happy, we are happy.

Instead of jumping down my throat, maybe you can try to review what has been written in it's entirety and ask yourself if there is another way to interpret what has been said? I get that women in medicine have a hard time with a number of things related to gender inequality, but I promise you not all men are out to oppress you.

The advice in your second post is much appreciated

@DokterMom:
It would have been more polite, perhaps, to read through the thread on your own before jumping to Rokshana's interpretations and subsequent defense. Asking for clarification if my language was unclear would have sufficed. The advice you gave is much appreciated.

@BigTumor, your advice is much appreciated! That's pretty much how our conversation played out, and we are both happy with the results. We were able to reconcile differences in our vision of family and professional life and find middle ground that makes us both happy

 

[dabeags]

Man, whole lot of hate for OP.

Personally, I don't think your questions and concerns were out of line. In fact, it is better to have these kind of concerns and talk them through with your serious girlfriend prior to making a lifelong commitment to one another. Sounds like you are family above all else, I would make sure your future spouse shares those goals. If she does, then she will happily tailor her work life to do what is best for the family.

Frankly, I have already passed up a promotion and stayed in a position to that earns less and isn't what I would 100% like to be doing in order to keep a lifestyle more conducive to raising a family, it is NOT too much to expect my equal partner to do the same.

 

[aggie08]

As a current PGY-4 in Ob/Gyn (almost done!) who has a stable, happy marriage and 3 kiddos I feel obligated to come out of the woodwork and comment. A few points:

1. First, the most important factor in having what you're looking for is 100% the relationship you have with each other. Strong relationships/marriages will be fine, but struggling or new relationships will have cracks turned into crevices and eventually break if not mended.

2. PROGRAM CHOICE IS KEY. Seek out a program with residents who say they have happy relationships and spend time outside the hospital. I have received A++ training at a very friendly, supportive program (while still being "academic enough" to get people into fellowships).

3. Don't encourage a different choice. Residency is hard no matter what you're in, sure surgical training is a bit more rigorous and dealing with the lives of moms and babies is utterly stressful and hard sometimes, but if you don't love your field you will not survive this. Loving what you do is key to not being broken by residency.

4. Kids will never, ever be easy. Accept help from all angles. If you're not close to family, make good friends. Get an Au Pair. Find a great nanny. That being said, I've managed to feel 100% involved in all my kids lives despite my training.

5. You must have a commitment to each other that nobody makes the other feel guilty for the occasional late night at the hospital or week/month of tough rotations. There will be days you feel like you're doing 110% and there will be days she has to do the same. It balances out in the end as long as everyone is picking up the slack when and where it's needed. Guilt trips do not help anything.

6. Choose wisely. My husband is absolutely the reason this has worked out fine for us. He is low maintenance, he does not complain, and he is proud of what I do. He talks positively about my job and on the hard days reminds me why I chose it.

So, at the end of the day - specialty is much less the issue here than a whole host of other factors. Choosing a field you love and can be interested in even when you've been working way too much is absolutely of utmost importance. In order to make your life and her life easier in the future encourage her to choose the specialty she loves, whatever it ends up being.

 

[l_006]

Did you have your kiddos during residency?

My fiance and I would love to have babies soon. Im on my last year of med school. Just wondering if there is a better time to have kids. I've heard intern year is not great but I'd love to be pregnat then and have the baby at the end of intern year

 

[JayTee]

Did you have your kiddos during residency?

My fiance and I would love to have babies soon. Im on my last year of med school. Just wondering if there is a better time to have kids. I've heard intern year is not great but I'd love to be pregnat then and have the baby at the end of intern year

We have a toddler who was born in the middle of year 2. Residency isn't the ideal time to have children by any stretch but there isn't really a "good" time to have kids if you are both working, but I agree to avoid intern year. If you are young, there is not reason not to wait until the end of 4th year really. How difficult it will be depends on what your SO does for work and if you have family nearby, and how supportive your program and co-residents are.

 

[DokterMom]

Look - here's the deal. If having this conversation is like tiptoeing through the minefield, then you two are nowhere near being ready for marriage. This is a simple non-judgemental "how can we make this work?" conversation. You came close to accusing me of calling you a misogynist. Let me make it plainer for you -- If you assume that caring for children that are 50% yours biologically is more than 50% her responsibility, then you are being a misogynist. If you assume that you are equally responsible for their care then you're are not. Fair enough?

If you are a FM resident and she's an OB/GYN resident, your schedule is more flexible. Just is. That means that when push comes to shove as things inevitably do, that you, not she, will be the more available partner - the more available parent. Is this a problem for you?

If so, then do her the favor of breaking up with her now.

 

[Raryn]

Hello!

I'm an FM resident (well, intern this coming July), my significant other is an M4 who really, really wants to pursue residency in OBGYN. She is very passionate about the field. The program I am at is an unopposed FM program and for her to pursue any residency she and I will have to spend some time away from each other.

We understand that and I am committed to seeing her through her training, as she is in seeing me through mine, however I am a little tentative about her specialty choice. My (limited) experience with OB has shown me that having a stable family life can be tough. We would like to settle down one day and start our own family, and the idea of living this rushed family life (constantly struggling to coordinate work schedules, involving a nanny in the upbringing of the kids, not getting alone time with the spouse, etc) bothers me a little.

I didn't want to dissuade my partner from pursuing the specialty of her choice, but wanted to be tactful in bringing up my concerns with her. Before I do that I wanted to hear from actual OBGYN's about some of the challenges faced in relationships and family life and ways to go about mitigating some of those challenges. Can you help a brother out with some advice and things to consider going forward?

Just a heads up, we are not yet married (or engaged), though that discussion has been on the table.

So, in general, I feel for you. I am in the exact same situation - though a few years further along. My wife is finishing up her Ob/Gyn intern year right now - when she said a couple years ago that she was interested in the specialty the only thing I could say was "Are you sure?". But she liked it, interviewed for it, and matched it. It's been tough (especially since we're long distance at the moment) with the year being stressful, tons of nights, long hours, etc, but in the end I support her in her decision. Even when formulating the rank list, she ranked based on what programs she liked best... and while I brought up a different order that I might prefer (closer to family, different city, whatever), in the end it was her decision. Why?

Well, lets pretend you convince her to apply for a different specialty instead (I tried to get my wife to do Derm). Or to rank much differently than she prefers. She will inevitably have times she is unhappy with her program or her specialty choice - we all do! Do you really want her to potentially blame you at those times and this to cause conflict in your relationship? We're talking about major life decisions here. I think this is the place where you guys sit down together, discuss the possibilities, and then in the end it's her decision where to apply and how to rank.

Concerns to bring up include eventual lifestyle problems. Pretty much all residents are busy, but attendings vary, and Ob/Gyn attendings are probably busier than a lot of people. It's something worth talking about. But I'd rather be busy and enjoy my job than be bored out of my mind and not.

When it all comes down to it, I try to abide by the philosophy of "Happy Wife, Happy Life" (or at least the more gender neutral "Happy Spouse, Happy House").