Prestige vs Total Cost of Attendance?

[Cat Nip]

Hello, if I have the stats, and can choose between an MD that costs me 60k tuition a year, and a DO school that costs 35k a year...

why would anyone choose the MD, assuming prestige isn't a factor (sorry, I really don't care about prestige).

Are the residency opportunities enormous for MDs compared to DOs?
Is it much easier for an MD to be hired?
If the two above are true statements, then is it by A LOT, or A LITTLE?
Is there really any practical reason to choose MD over DO, or at least one that allows paying 100k more to be reaosnable?

A school that costs me 100k less and allows me to have the same residency is way more desirable to me.

For example, I chose a normal in-state school to do my undergraduate chemistry degree instead of some out of state prestigious one, and have no debt because of it. No regrets in the slightest.

Chemistry is the same at every university. Isn't medicine also? (maybe DOs learn more, but nearly identical overall).

Am I missing something here?

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[Lexdiamondz]

Generally speaking, it's much easier for MDs to match in competitive specialties like Derm & surgical specialties, and it's far, far easier for MDs to match at top residencies in pretty much any field. If you're okay with that then go DO, but your life is much less complicated as an MD when it comes to residency, fellowships and finding academic positions

 

[Cat Nip]

Generally speaking, it's much easier for MDs to match in competitive specialties like Derm & surgical specialties, and it's far, far easier for MDs to match at top residencies in pretty much any field. If you're okay with that then go DO, but your life is much less complicated as an MD when it comes to residency, fellowships and finding academic positions

What does "much" mean in this context? I want to try and quantify this a bit. Is there a 50% chance higher match for competitive residencies, or is it closer to 10 or 20%, or what? I also have job shadowed a cardiologist from a D.O. school and it appears it you want to be competitive, you can.

 

[allantois]

Don't go to LECOM over MD.

Just no

 

[Cat Nip]

Don't go to LECOM over MD.

Just no

Why though? If its primarily prestige and not for practical reasons, then does it matter?

 

[1Cor1557]

Why though? If its primarily prestige and not for practical reasons, then does it matter?

it matters due to training post grad. your options will be limited post grad to DO community programs, if you want an academic university training it will be tougher in some specialties and next to impossible in others, and remember the same application you have another MD will have and yours will be set aside because of it for the rest of your career, no matter how much better yours gets there will always be an MD with the same credentials except with a better pedigree and will have the edge for this reason. Now if the choice is med school vs no med school and you wish to be a doc then there is nothing wrong with DO at all just understand this difference

 

[allantois]

Why though? If its primarily prestige and not for practical reasons, then does it matter?

Ultimately it's impossible to predict the future. If you end up in primary care, then yes you'd probably wish you had less debt. However, at this point you want to keep all doors open to all specialties, which an MD school will do. So it really depends on what field of medicine you are interested in.

 

[timephone]

Another consideration is having to take two sets of board exams, USMLE and COMLEX. I know a DO urologist who told me that having to study for both those exams (to allow for more flexibility during residency applications) was a major pain in the butt.

 

[Cat Nip]

it matters due to training post grad. your options will be limited post grad to DO community programs, if you want an academic university training it will be tougher in some specialties and next to impossible in others, and remember the same application you have another MD will have and yours will be set aside because of it for the rest of your career, no matter how much better yours gets there will always be an MD with the same credentials except with a better pedigree and will have the edge for this reason. Now if the choice is med school vs no med school and you wish to be a doc then there is nothing wrong with DO at all just understand this difference

I agree an MD would be a safer choice under the circumstance they cost roughly the same in terms of tuition. But 100k+ more debt because of MD is where I'm just not sure the difference between MD and DO are enough. Since I live in a state where there one MD school (and a top tier one at that), then you either have two choices:

1. An expensive out of state MD or
2. A relatively inexpensive DO school in comparison.

If you include interest, its probably roughly 125k difference between most DO and most out of state MDs. To me, its almost worth "risking" (even though I'm not really sure its that risky) a less specialty to save such an incredible amount of money.

 

[Cat Nip]

Another consideration is having to take two sets of board exams, USMLE and COMLEX. I know a DO urologist who told me that having to study for both those exams (to allow for more flexibility during residency applications) was a major pain in the butt.

Good point! But I know people who have done it. Are these two exams that different?

 

[el_duderino]

I'd choose any MD school over LECOM every day of the week, regardless of cost. Has nothing do with prestige, but to do with the education. LECOM is... I think basically an office building somewhere not in the vicinity of a hospital. Virtually all MD programs are directly attached to academic medical centers. That's meaningful. Where do LECOM students do their clinical rotations? They have a list of dozens of hospitals their students go to, because they don't have their own medical center. You won't have your medical school's staff on-site at your rotations to give you lectures, help you with issues, provide guidance, etc. That's a big deal. They also seem to treat their students somewhat like children, which I find odd.

And, to me, there's value in not having to ever explain to anyone what DO means and that, yes, you're a real doctor. People just don't get it. It's not a big deal in real life, but I would not be happy having to say that, ever.

From my experience with LECOM graduates, they get a great medical education. No denying that. They are smart and do just as well as anyone else. I think the extra money is worth it though.

 

[el_duderino]

Good point! But I know people who have done it. Are these two exams that different?

No, they're not, but I can't overstate how stressful taking Step 1 is. Having to do it again right after will be awful.

And $125,000 is a lot of money... but it's roughly the difference in yearly salary between an FM doc and an average specialist. The MD school will open more residency doors than the DO school.

 

[Cat Nip]

I'd choose any MD school over LECOM every day of the week, regardless of cost. Has nothing do with prestige, but to do with the education. LECOM is... I think basically an office building somewhere not in the vicinity of a hospital. Virtually all MD programs are directly attached to academic medical centers. That's meaningful. Where do LECOM students do their clinical rotations? They have a list of dozens of hospitals their students go to, because they don't have their own medical center. You won't have your medical school's staff on-site at your rotations to give you lectures, help you with issues, provide guidance, etc. That's a big deal. They also seem to treat their students somewhat like children, which I find odd.

And, to me, there's value in not having to ever explain to anyone what DO means and that, yes, you're a real doctor. People just don't get it. It's not a big deal in real life, but I would not be happy having to say that, ever.

From my experience with LECOM graduates, they get a great medical education. No denying that. They are smart and do just as well as anyone else. I think the extra money is worth it though.

Ok fair enough. What about DO schools that "aren't" LECOM though. There's still quite a few that cost 40-50k, compared to out-of-state MDs which cost 60-80k tuition.

 

[Betabet]

The fact that it's LECOM doesn't matter. In fact, most DO schools do their rotation sites and multiple hospitals with a few exceptions. You'll find that most schools will treat their students like children. The constant e-mails and reminders about policy are not unique to LECOM. It happens everywhere.

That being said, these are reasons to not go to any DO school over an MD school. MD schools will provide you with more resources than most DO schools. There's more opportunities for research, you have teaching hospitals, and it'll be a bigger payoff in the long run. If you go to a DO school you'll have to pay for 2 board exams. That's a lot more stress and time. I'm not sure how much board prep time LECOM gives, but you'll have to study OMM on top of basic sciences which is less dedicated time to study for basic sciences. You have the opportunity to essentially BUY time. If I could buy time, I'd do that in a heart beat.

In terms of "chemistry is the same at each school," that's absolutely not true here. Think about it this way, if you take chemistry at community college and get an A, does that mean you'd get an A if you took chemistry at Harvard? The questions at my school have very little board relevance for the most part. About half of the test is board relevant material and the other half is small detail crap like "what did it say in the research paper regarding X." The quality of education is vastly different. And I know most people here will say "medical school is what you make of it and based on the individual." But the point of pre-clinical years in med school is to prepare you for boards and rotations. And for most DO schools, I just don't think they do a great job.

Everyone's experience is different, but I bet if you ask, at least 80% of DOs would've gone the MD route if given the choice.

 

[el_duderino]

Ok fair enough. What about DO schools that "aren't" LECOM though. There's still quite a few that cost 40-50k, compared to out-of-state MDs which cost 60-80k tuition.

Compare clinical rotation sites.

 

[Cat Nip]

The fact that it's LECOM doesn't matter. In fact, most DO schools do their rotation sites and multiple hospitals with a few exceptions. You'll find that most schools will treat their students like children. The constant e-mails and reminders about policy are not unique to LECOM. It happens everywhere.

That being said, these are reasons to not go to any DO school over an MD school. MD schools will provide you with more resources than most DO schools. There's more opportunities for research, you have teaching hospitals, and it'll be a bigger payoff in the long run. If you go to a DO school you'll have to pay for 2 board exams. That's a lot more stress and time. I'm not sure how much board prep time LECOM gives, but you'll have to study OMM on top of basic sciences which is less dedicated time to study for basic sciences. You have the opportunity to essentially BUY time. If I could buy time, I'd do that in a heart beat.

In terms of "chemistry is the same at each school," that's absolutely not true here. Think about it this way, if you take chemistry at community college and get an A, does that mean you'd get an A if you took chemistry at Harvard? The questions at my school have very little board relevance for the most part. About half of the test is board relevant material and the other half is small detail crap like "what did it say in the research paper regarding X." The quality of education is vastly different. And I know most people here will say "medical school is what you make of it and based on the individual." But the point of pre-clinical years in med school is to prepare you for boards and rotations. And for most DO schools, I just don't think they do a great job.

Everyone's experience is different, but I bet if you ask, at least 80% of DOs would've gone the MD route if given the choice.

I agree with your resources argument. I disagree with your "medicine isn't the same at every schools" to the degree you put it. Chemistry is generally the same between "universities", not community college vs university. I went to chemistry graduate school. I taught several chemistry courses, went to other universities to do research, etc. I went to a mid-tier chemistry grad. program and checked out top tier and had friends go to all universities to earn masters/PhDs. There is NO DIFFERENCE between the top students at Harvard, or say, Nebraska state. Whats different, is that the "lower tier students" are more intelligent at Ivy Leagues. If you get an A at Oklahoma State, you'd probably get an A at Harvard, especially grade inflation at ivies in this area.

What I do agree with you on, is resources. The reason great science is produced at ivy leagues is not because of the intelligence of the students, but rather the resources available. So I know what you mean to some extent. However, at the end of the day, both are chemists, and you can get into the career you want with hard work. Once in your career, where you got your degree hardly matters anymore. In this way, I see how it compares to medicine.

 

[Cat Nip]

Compare clinical rotation sites.

Do you know a link that could expose the clear differences?

 

[el_duderino]

I agree with your resources argument. I disagree with your "medicine isn't the same at every schools" to the degree you put it. Chemistry is generally the same between "universities", not community college vs university. I went to chemistry graduate school. I taught several chemistry courses, went to other universities to do research, etc. I went to a mid-tier chemistry grad. program and checked out top tier and had friends go to all universities to earn masters/PhDs. There is NO DIFFERENCE between the top students at Harvard, or say, Nebraska state. Whats different, is that the "lower tier students" are more intelligent at Ivy Leagues. If you get an A at Oklahoma State, you'd probably get an A at Harvard, especially grade inflation at ivies in this area.

What I do agree with you on, is resources. The reason great science is produced at ivy leagues is not because of the intelligence of the students, but rather the resources available. So I know what you mean tot some extent. However, at the end of the day, both are chemists, and you can get into the career you want with hard work. Once in your career, where you got your degree hardly matters anymore. In this way, I see how it compares to medicine.

I took basic science classes at a community college, state university, and top-tier engineering college.

They were, emphatically, not even remotely the same.

That doesn't really apply to medical school, though, I think. I'm sure the quality of the preclinical education at LECOM and, say, Drexel are more or less the same.

 

[el_duderino]

Do you know a link that could expose the clear differences?

If at one school the students are doing most/all of their clinical rotations at the site where the academic administration and advisement work, that's great.

If at another school, students are dispersed among dozens of community hospitals throughout the region or elsewhere, that's not so great.

 

[Cat Nip]

I took basic science classes at a community college, state university, and top-tier engineering college.

They were, emphatically, not even remotely the same.

That doesn't really apply to medical school, though, I think. I'm sure the quality of the preclinical education at LECOM and, say, Drexel are more or less the same.

I didn't see any difference between state university and top-tier colleges. I would imagine if you took a physics course meant specifically for engineering majors, as opposed to a lesser track, there could be a huge difference. A place like MIT would probably have a harder chemistry course than Oklahoma state or Harvard.

I guess you have me worried about "resources" somewhat. Is it really that" horrible" to go to a DO school over an MD, in terms of "resources and clinical opportunities". It just seems very doable because I know so many doctors, with the DO title, who did perfectly fine finding a great specialty.

 

[Betabet]

I agree with your resources argument. I disagree with your "medicine isn't the same at every schools" to the degree you put it. Chemistry is generally the same between "universities", not community college vs university. I went to chemistry graduate school. I taught several chemistry courses, went to other universities to do research, etc. I went to a mid-tier chemistry grad. program and checked out top tier and had friends go to all universities to earn masters/PhDs. There is NO DIFFERENCE between the top students at Harvard, or say, Nebraska state. Whats different, is that the "lower tier students" are more intelligent at Ivy Leagues. If you get an A at Oklahoma State, you'd probably get an A at Harvard, especially grade inflation at ivies in this area.

What I do agree with you on, is resources. The reason great science is produced at ivy leagues is not because of the intelligence of the students, but rather the resources available. So I know what you mean tot some extent. However, at the end of the day, both are chemists, and you can get into the career you want with hard work. Once in your career, where you got your degree hardly matters anymore. In this way, I see how it compares to medicine.

Fair enough. While that is very true (you can get into the career you want), going to a DO school make it harder for you to obtain those goals. I don't know what kind of specialty you want, but let's go with extremes. Say you wanted to go into neurosurgery. Getting into a neurosurgery residency, while not impossible as a DO, will be harder than your MD counterpart. The training at a DO school won't be as good in terms of clinical rotations, most DO schools don't put an emphasis on research so that will be hard for you as well (which will be necessary if you want to go into a competitive field), and you'll experience the unspoken stigma of going to a DO school. Now, if you want primary care, I say go to the DO school if it's 100k cheaper. But unless you're very confident in this decision (it will most likely change while you are in school), then choose the MD school.

 

[Cat Nip]

Fair enough. While that is very true (you can get into the career you want), going to a DO school will be harder for you to obtain those goals. I don't know what kind of specialty you want, but let's go with extremes. Say you wanted to go into neurosurgery. Getting into a neurosurgery residency, while not impossible as a DO, will be harder than your MD counterpart. The training at a DO school won't be as good in terms of clinical rotations, most DO schools don't put an emphasis on research so that will be hard for you as well (which will be necessary if you want to go into a competitive field), and you'll experience the unspoken stigma of going to a DO school. Now, if you want primary care, I say go to the DO school if it's 100k cheaper. But unless you're very confident in this decision (it will most likely change while you are in school), then choose the MD school.

As far as research goes, I earned a chemistry masters with several hundred thousand hours of research and a major (at worst mid-tier) publication in progress. I would imagine this comes into play. I might earn an unspoken stigma going into DO school, I understand that. Even with just an MS in chemistry now, I already know most MDs or DOs never even took advanced quantum chemistry 600. I suppose the general public would stigmatize for sure. However, I don't care about the general publics "prestige" opinions. I would be podiatrist if I wasn't able to be a MD/DO because I like being a doctor. Although, I do want to specialize though.

 

[Betabet]

As far as research goes, I earned a chemistry masters with several hundred thousand hours of research and a major (at worst mid-tier) publication in progress. I would imagine this comes into play. I might earn an unspoken stigma going into DO school, I understand that. Even with just an MS in chemistry now, I already know most MDs or DOs never even took advanced quantum chemistry 600. I suppose the general public would stigmatize for sure. However, I don't care about the general publics "prestige" opinions. I would be podiatrist if I wasn't able to be a MD/DO because I like being a doctor. Although, I do want to specialize though.

At my school, they do not offer research for the specialty I want to go in. I had to search elsewhere. If you do want to specialize and go DO, I would make sure there are opportunities for you to do research in the specialty you want. Research in those specific fields is probably more important than what you did in your masters.

 

[Cat Nip]

At my school, they do not offer research for the specialty I want to go in. I had to search elsewhere. If you do want to specialize and go DO, I would make sure there are opportunities for you to do research in the specialty you want. Research in those specific fields is probably more important than what you did in your masters.

When you say you had to go elsewhere, what did you do in the scenario you couldn't find research in the area you desired? Just research somewhere else in the summers or how does that work if your school doesn't offer it?

 

[holdthemayo]

Unless you have a very compelling reason to pick DO, then go MD. LECOM will probably get you where you want to be, but the consensus is that an MD school will get you there with fewer headaches and much less uncertainty.

 

[Cat Nip]

Unless you have a very compelling reason to pick DO, then go MD. LECOM will probably get you where you want to be, but the consensus is that an MD school will get you there with fewer headaches and much less uncertainty.

Ok thanks, consensus amongst who?

 

[el_duderino]

Ok thanks, consensus amongst who?

Literally everyone. MD simply opens more doors.

 

[Cat Nip]

Literally everyone. MD simply opens more doors.

I don't disagree with that. Just doing for 120k cheaper, with more headaches, almost seems worth DO.

 

[Betabet]

When you say you had to go elsewhere, what did you do in the scenario you couldn't find research in the area you desired? Just research somewhere else in the summers or how does that work if your school doesn't offer it?

Right, I had to do a summer program which would probably be a breeze for you to get into with your background. Currently, I have to drive to another university to do research (about 45 minutes away). Depending on which LECOM campus you're going to, this is possible for you as well. It helps that there are no mandatory lectures.

 

[Cat Nip]

Right, I had to do a summer program which would probably be a breeze for you to get into with your background. Currently, I have to drive to another university to do research (about 45 minutes away). Depending on which LECOM campus you're going to, this is possible for you as well. It helps that there are no mandatory lectures.

Ok sounds good. Which LECOM campus has the most research opportunities, including the campuses that are close to places that are 45 minutes away if need to be (is LECOM where you went). Also, would it be a "breeze" for me to enter these research possibilities simply because of my M.S. in chemistry?

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Good point! But I know people who have done it. Are these two exams that different?

No, I only studied for USMLE. I should have studied the OMM part, but I didn't because OMM can suck my balls.

 

[Cat Nip]

No, I only studied for USMLE. I should have studied the OMM part, but I didn't because OMM can suck my balls.

Is it possible to only take the USMLE as a DO student? Or do you just mean you took both tests and just winged OMM on the complex?

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Is it possible to only take the USMLE as a DO student? Or do you just mean you took both tests and just winged OMM on the complex?

You have to take both the USMLE and COMLEX or only the COMLEX. If you study for USMLE, you cover everything for the COMLEX except the OMM. I did wing the OMM and it hurt my grade. However, nobody cares about my COMLEX because I have a USMLE score.

 

[DNC127]

Go MD no matter what. Here is my personal example: I am a DO student with multiple (6) first author publications in the #1 journal for my desired field, JAMA journals, ect. and I still wonder if I am making a mistake and should pursue a less competitive field because its so damn risky to gun for a academic spot in a surgical subspecialty as a DO. If I was an MD student with the same CV, it would be a lot smoother sailing. You don't ever wanna have to question "what could have been" if you had different letters behind your name. Trust me. At this point I would drop an extra 50k per year to have those other letters and the piece of mind knowing that my efforts had a good chance of getting me where I want to go.

 

[Cat Nip]

Go MD no matter what. Here is my personal example: I am a DO student with multiple (6) first author publications in the #1 journal for my desired field, JAMA journals, ect. and I still wonder if I am making a mistake and should pursue a less competitive field because its so damn risky to gun for a academic spot in a surgical subspecialty as a DO. If I was an MD student with the same CV, it would be a lot smoother sailing. You don't ever wanna have to question "what could have been" if you had different letters behind your name. Trust me. At this point I would drop an extra 50k per year to have those other letters and the piece of mind knowing that my efforts had a good chance of getting me where I want to go.

I can imagine it being harder to obtain a subspecialty spot as a DO, but what do you mean by "risky". If you gun for a spot, and don't get it, what do you "lose"? Impressive CV btw!

 

[el_duderino]

I can imagine it being harder to obtain a subspecialty spot as a DO, but what do you mean by "risky". If you gun for a spot, and don't get it, what do you "lose"? Impressive CV btw!

What do you lose? Your chance at the career you want.

 

[deleted831695]

Unless the monetary difference is like $150k+, then go for the MD. SDN does overstate things at time, but there's no denying the competitive stuff is tougher to obtain (but it's also hard for MDs as well). I opted to go DO because I wanted to stay close to home/loved ones (one big reason), not gunning for Jewish Dermatology, and I was comfortable with the decision since it's known state school (and cheaper!) and perfectly okay with the likely reality of staying here for residency (MI might be the most DO-friendly state). So unless you have those type of reasons, go for the MD.

So basically if a student doesn't want to enter primary care, apply MD? otherwise DO?

You apply for both period if you have borderline stats (which with how competitive it is nowadays, I'd say apply both to be safe if you're below 3.7 and 509).

 

[Cat Nip]

So basically if a student doesn't want to enter primary care, apply MD? otherwise DO?

I think if want to have an "easier" time specializing, apply MD. You can still enter a specialization as a DO, and many do.

 

[el_duderino]

So basically if a student doesn't want to enter primary care, apply MD? otherwise DO?

You apply both, and go MD unless you don't get accepted to an MD program, or have some really compelling reason to go DO.

 

[DNC127]

So basically if a student doesn't want to enter primary care, apply MD? otherwise DO?

If you want to be an academic physician, in a competitive specialty, go MD. Obviously there are DO ortho/neuro/ENT spots and DO's match in these specialties, but if you are looking at becoming an academic physician in these fields I would say beef up the app until it is competitive for MD schools. If you can't get into an MD school than just make due with what you have at a DO school, but don't let money or impatience be the factor for why you choose DO over MD. The problem is, you don't know what you really want till you are in med school in the thick of it, so why risk that you will change your mind and decide you like more competitive things?

 

[workaholic181]

If you want to be an academic physician, in a competitive specialty, go MD. Obviously there are DO ortho/neuro/ENT spots and DO's match in these specialties, but if you are looking at becoming an academic physician in these fields I would say beef up the app until it is competitive for MD schools. If you can't get into an MD school than just make due with what you have at a DO school, but don't let money or impatience be the factor for why you choose DO over MD. The problem is, you don't know what you really want till you are in med school in the thick of it, so why risk that you will change your mind and decide you like more competitive things?

Not to hijack this thread, but would you mind explaining the differences between "academic physician" vs say community physician. Academic physicians I imagine are attendings at university hospitals and also teach the medical students?

 

[el_duderino]

Not to hijack this thread, but would you mind explaining the differences between "academic physician" vs say community physician. Academic physicians I imagine are attendings at university hospitals and also teach the medical students?

Academic means working at a teaching facility; that is, a hospital with residency programs. Part of the job involves supervising and teaching fellows, residents, and medical students, mostly in clinical areas. When you're in third year on a medicine rotation, you'll be working with a team managing inpatients at the hospital. The team will consist of, for instance, an attending, a senior resident, two interns, and two medical students.

In a community hospital, it might just be the attending managing the patient by himself.

 

[Betabet]

Ok sounds good. Which LECOM campus has the most research opportunities, including the campuses that are close to places that are 45 minutes away if need to be (is LECOM where you went). Also, would it be a "breeze" for me to enter these research possibilities simply because of my M.S. in chemistry?

Yeah your background in research will have a big impact. LECOM-SH is about 40-45 minutes away from Pittsburgh and there are some students who get opportunities there (UPitt). LECOM Bradenton is sort of close to USF med school where you may be able to get something. I personally do not go there but I have friends doing research at both.

 

[workaholic181]

Academic means working at a teaching facility; that is, a hospital with residency programs. Part of the job involves supervising and teaching fellows, residents, and medical students, mostly in clinical areas. When you're in third year on a medicine rotation, you'll be working with a team managing inpatients at the hospital. The team will consist of, for instance, an attending, a senior resident, two interns, and two medical students.

In a community hospital, it might just be the attending managing the patient by himself.

Makes sense thanks for taking the time!

And it is significantly more difficult for DOs to get academic positions I gather from this thread. Is this true across the board or are the "DO friendly" specialties more open to DO attendings in this position? Also, would a DO having completed an AGCME residency improve the odds of landing an attending academic position?

 

[el_duderino]

Makes sense thanks for taking the time!

And it is significantly more difficult for DOs to get academic positions I gather from this thread. Is this true across the board or are the "DO friendly" specialties more open to DO attendings in this position? Also, would a DO having completed an AGCME residency improve the odds of landing an attending academic position?

DO decreases your chances. How much varies significantly from program to program. It doesn't really change your decision making, so quantifying how much it affects you is purely academic. You go DO only if you can't get into an MD program.

 

[el_duderino]

I don't want it to sound all doom and gloom. DO schools are, by and large, excellent and you will get a great education and are all but guaranteed a residency position. I just want people to understand the limitations you'll experience by going to a DO program and why it generally makes no sense to choose DO over MD given the option.

 

[fourandtwo]

I will possibly be facing the same situation in a few weeks! What I'm doing is going down a pros-cons list of DO VS MD. Then addressing each con, and seeing if they are important to me. TO ME, SPECIFICALLY!

 

[el_duderino]

I will possibly be facing the same situation in a few weeks! What I'm doing is going down a pros-cons list of DO VS MD. Then addressing each con, and seeing if they are important to me. TO ME, SPECIFICALLY!

I'd suggest you compare institution vs institution, not degree vs degree. The degree is one aspect of the comparison of institution. Other aspects you want to directly compare are the quality/experience of the clinical years, tuition, area of the country, setting, cost of living, etc.

 

[WedgeDawg]

I'm not sure if you're playing devils advocate or if you are trying to justify a decision that likely is the worse choice, but here's my two cents.

If given the opportunity to go to a DO school or a USMD school, there are very few circumstances that would justify, in my opinion, going to the DO school.

1. An enormous cost difference and a 100% chance that I was only interested in going into a non-competitive specialty (FM, psych, IM without guarantee of fellowship, Peds without guarantee of fellowship, PM&R, pathology). The cost difference would need to be enough to justify the possibility that I could very well be locked into one of these specialties even if I decide later on that I like a more competitive specialty better.

2. Some sort of highly significant social situation where I needed to spend the next 4 years in a specific location (family member in a certain area that I have to help care for, situation with SO, etc).

That's it. If I were given a choice between a free DO school and a full price expensive (80k/year) "low tier" MD school, I would pick the MD school every time (barring circumstances 1 or 2).

The major difference in terms of education that varies between schools is the clinical education, not the preclinical education. DO clinical education is less standardized than MD education - there are many reports from DO students on this forum of entire clinical rotations be nothing but shadowing. Of course, there are these reports from MD students too, but the standardization amongst MD schools means that even at the MD school with the worst clinical rotations, you'll still be given adequate exposure and preparation for what is expected of a 3rd year (and yes, there is definitely variability in clinical education between MD schools too). At DO schools, you don't necessarily have that guarantee. Now, you can debate this all you want, but to add another layer, even if this isn't totally true, it's viewed as such by program directors at particular programs. If they have the choice between MD school with known clinical curriculum and DO school that's a wild card, they're going to go with the risk-averse option.

 

[el_duderino]

So even the clinical education at Western is a wildcard?
@AlbinoHawk_DO can you post your thoughts too?

"Rotation sites include a variety of settings including community and county hospitals, sites with and without residency programs,"

They list 21 hospitals for their core rotation sites, "most" of which are located "within driving distance." The closest hospital is over a mile away and doesn't have residency programs.