Navy HSCP at expensive, private school?

[human_raisedbyhumans]

Hi everyone,

Long story short: applied to HPSP late, no more spots and offered HSCP. Will be attending UoP so looking at either a.) taking out 420k+ in loans and working it off / PAYE / do whatever people in that much debt do OR b.) take HSCP, ends up paying for ~240k over the 3 years thanks to UoP's outrageously priced zip code, leaving me with about ~180k ish debt and 3 years active duty payback.

Wanted to get more perspective because the majority opinion on SDN is that HSCP is "only worth it at a cheap, public school" but based on my calculations, I feel it could also be favorable in my situation as well. Thoughts?

P.S. and no, I wouldn't just be doing military dentistry for the money. I am very enticed by a set job after dental school where I can gain valuable experience and see the world without worrying about costs, malpractice insurance, etc. etc.

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[vellnueve]

That majority opinion only applies if you compare both options. I think HSCP is a great deal.

 

[schmoob]

If you plan on going career, it's still a great deal.

 

[LFA20]

HSCP is awesome
(im in it)

 

[chompsss]

I'll echo what @vellnueve said - the "it only makes sense if it's at a cheap school" thing only applies if you're considering accepting HSCP over HPSP. As compared no nothing, then yes, it absolutely makes sense. Plus, you'd only owe three years after school, since UoP is a 3-year program. I also agree with @AVB2104 - HSCP is great, speaking from first-hand experience.

 

[drill-and-fill]

I wish I would've picked HSCP over HPSP even though I went to an Ivy, simply because I would've been able to retire 4 years earlier. But then my case may not be a good example for you since I'm prior (w/ around 6 yrs of service) and I'm most likely going to do 20 years.

 

[human_raisedbyhumans]

At this point, I don't see myself making Navy dentistry my career. With that said, still seems like a good deal, yes?

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

I wish I would've picked HSCP over HPSP even though I went to an Ivy, simply because I would've been able to retire 4 years earlier. But then my case may not be a good example for you since I'm prior (w/ around 6 yrs of service) and I'm most likely going to do 20 years.

I've spoken with several people on the HSCP retirement issue. The consensus is that you need to put in 20 years after dental school, at which point you are given 24 years of service credit. So, you cannot retire with just 16 years after school. This is what the current detailer and several others have told me, take it for what it's worth.

Big Hoss

 

[schmoob]

I've spoken with several people on the HSCP retirement issue. The consensus is that you need to put in 20 years after dental school, at which point you are given 24 years of service credit. So, you cannot retire with just 16 years after school. This is what the current detailer and several others have told me, take it for what it's worth.

Big Hoss

This is not correct, Hoss. You can retire 16 years after commissioning because the member will have had 20 years AD. What the detailer is talking about is a scenario where the member has attended a service academy, or USUHS.

Even though a member is AD while at USUHS, they maintain status as O1 <2YOS. At commissioning, they are now an O3 <2YOS, despite being AD the previous 4 years. In this scenario the medical student gets all pay and benefits, AND goes to med school for free. If it counted towards retirement, then by the time they graduate, do An internship, residency, fellowship, and payback - they would be almost ready to retire.

Under HSCP, the member receives all pay and entitlements of an E-6 or E-7. Their pay increases with continuity also. They also have access to the GI Bill while in the program, unlike USU and service academies. So a medical/Dental student enlists as an OC1 and upon graduating they are an O3E >4YOS ("E" as long as they are at least 4 years and 1 day, but the E designation doesn't matter as far as pay unless the member was "real" prior service, because they would put on LCDR before the E starts paying more).

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

This is not correct, Hoss. You can retire 16 years after commissioning because the member will have had 20 years AD. What the detailer is talking about is a scenario where the member has attended a service academy, or USUHS.

Even though a member is AD while at USUHS, they maintain status as O1 <2YOS. At commissioning, they are now an O3 <2YOS, despite being AD the previous 4 years. In this scenario the medical student gets all pay and benefits, AND goes to med school for free. If it counted towards retirement, then by the time they graduate, do An internship, residency, fellowship, and payback - they would be almost ready to retire.

Under HSCP, the member receives all pay and entitlements of an E-6 or E-7. Their pay increases with continuity also. They also have access to the GI Bill while in the program, unlike USU and service academies. So a medical/Dental student enlists as an OC1 and upon graduating they are an O3E >4YOS ("E" as long as they are at least 4 years and 1 day, but the E designation doesn't matter as far as pay unless the member was "real" prior service, because they would put on LCDR before the E starts paying more).

This is what I had originally thought. But, a fellow dentist at my clinic did the HSCP and I was with him when he asked the junior detailer about the HSCP and retirement. He said it counts, but doesn't count, like I mentioned above. My friend then asked a few other people at this event and they said the same thing. It's entirely possible that none of them have a clue. That is why you never trust the detailer! I also feel like I've read on SDN that they won't let you use the GI Bill now while on the HSCP, people did in the past but they've squashed that now. Can anyone on the HSCP confirm this?

Big Hoss

 

[vellnueve]

I'm pretty sure the info is incorrect and HSCP allows retirement at 20 years of active service. But I've never really looked into it any closer. CDR Lee, the new career planner, would be the best one to ask.

 

[schmoob]

This is what I had originally thought. But, a fellow dentist at my clinic did the HSCP and I was with him when he asked the junior detailer about the HSCP and retirement. He said it counts, but doesn't count, like I mentioned above. My friend then asked a few other people at this event and they said the same thing. It's entirely possible that none of them have a clue. That is why you never trust the detailer! I also feel like I've read on SDN that they won't let you use the GI Bill now while on the HSCP, people did in the past but they've squashed that now. Can anyone on the HSCP confirm this?

Big Hoss

I have a feeling that the people who were saying that HSCP does not count towards retirement were confusing it with HPSP, which as you very well know, does not count towards retirement since they are considered reserve years.
I have not heard anything about the rules of using the GI Bill change, but it's very possible. I don't know why they would do that though, because it'll actually save the VA money since the student wouldnt qualify for the max benefits yet, nor be eligible for Yellow Ribbon or the MHA.

 

[LFA20]

My recruiter told me that the advantage of hscp vs hpsp is that I get higher pay after school and that I can retire 4 years earlier.

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

HSCP is awesome
(im in it)

Can you use the GI Bill while on the HSCP?

Big Hoss

 

[LFA20]

Can you use the GI Bill while on the HSCP?

Big Hoss

When I applied I was rejected and I stopped pursuing it. However, I do know a few people that used it during school with HSCP with no prior service. If I remember correctly they sent out a notice telling HSCP people not to use it or they will try to recoup all the money back.

 

[drill-and-fill]

When I applied I was rejected and I stopped pursuing it. However, I do know a few people that used it during school with HSCP with no prior service. If I remember correctly they sent out a notice telling HSCP people not to use it or they will try to recoup all the money back.

Why would you wanna use it tho? To pay for the diff that the HSCP couldn't pay for your dental school tuition? I would just save it to use it later when I go for a residency program outside...

 

[LFA20]

Why would you wanna use it tho? To pay for the diff that the HSCP couldn't pay for your dental school tuition? I would just save it to use it later when I go for a residency program outside...

I just wanted the extra money to spend . But yeah I am glad I didn't use it since the HSCP money alone covers 95% of my tuition and housing. If I were to do a residency I'd rather do it in-service tbh.

 

[schmoob]

I just wanted the extra money to spend . But yeah I am glad I didn't use it since the HSCP money alone covers 95% of my tuition and housing. If I were to do a residency I'd rather do it in-service tbh.

Money is complicated and should be used creatively.
Do not be afraid to use those loans. And max out your TSP! Then get an IRA. If you're a lifer, your loans get forgiven. No guilt. Your potential loss of income while in the Navy, as opposed to a rock star private practitioner makes up for it.
Be loyal to our Navy. Do good dentistry for our Sailors, take care of them, be a good Officer. But do not starve. Make the money work for you.

You cannot take it with you. Live in the now, but prepare for tomorrow.

 

[drill-and-fill]

Money is complicated and should be used creatively.
Do not be afraid to use those loans. And max out your TSP! Then get an IRA. If you're a lifer, your loans get forgiven. No guilt. Your potential loss of income while in the Navy, as opposed to a rock star private practitioner makes up for it.
Be loyal to our Navy. Do good dentistry for our Sailors, take care of them, be a good Officer. But do not starve. Make the money work for you.

You cannot take it with you. Live in the now, but prepare for tomorrow.

Amen!

 

[dentclc]

You cannot use the G.I. Bill during dental school while on HSCP if you don't have prior service. The G.I. Bill - the actual bill - has wording in it that defines "Active Duty" and it specifically says that being in a civilian institution for a course of study is not considered "Active Duty" in the eyes of G.I. Bill eligibility. There is a chance that the person at the VA reviewing your file isn't up to date on it but it would be a fluke. Class of 2015 was the last year that people were able to use it consistently. I heard of some in 2016 as well, but that was the year they started denying the requests.

 

[Incis0r]

Be loyal to our Navy. Do good dentistry for our Sailors, take care of them, be a good Officer. But do not starve. Make the money work for you.

You cannot take it with you. Live in the now, but prepare for tomorrow.

Wish I could frame this.

 

[caffeine jitters]

Forgive me if I sound really ignorant right now, but what is this talk of being able to retire after 20 years? I thought with HPSP you were obligated to pay back 4 years, then you could resign. Conversely, with HCSP, the payback would be 3 years.

I feel like I am missing some huge "details".

 

[vellnueve]

Yeah, like not understanding the difference between retirement and resignation.

 

[schmoob]

Resigning your commission means you get out and you're done.
Retiring means you do your 20, and transfer to the "Fleet Reserve" and continue collecting DoD pay via pension.

 

[caffeine jitters]

Resigning your commission means you get out and you're done.
Retiring means you do your 20, and transfer to the "Fleet Reserve" and continue collecting DoD pay via pension.

Awesome, thank you for that. When would the 20 years start for the HPSP and HSCP respectively?

 

[schmoob]

Awesome, thank you for that. When would the 20 years start for the HPSP and HSCP respectively?

HPSP and HSCP have the same payback period, depending on how long your scholarship is. If you get either one from the start of D1, it's 4 years. Your payback starts from your commissioning to Active Duty.
The difference between them with regards to retirement is with HSCP you are Active Duty enlisted while in school. You receive full pay and benefits; but you are liable for paying your own tuition though. When you graduate and commission under HSCP, you will already have 4 years of AD under your belt, leaving you with only 16 years of service required to retire with your 50% base pay pension. Those who choose HPSP will need to do 20 years after graduation to retire.