Medical Genetics- How is the pay

[junlujlu]

Anybody know how the pay is for medical genetics physician

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[Eldarion]

Anybody know how the pay is for medical genetics physician

No response in 3 years? Bumping to 2008!

[Edit]: I'm interested in finding out career prospects for physicians trained in med genetics and what residency programs they generally go through before doing med genetics training programs.

 

[Towel]

[Edit]: I'm interested in finding out career prospects for physicians trained in med genetics and what residency programs they generally go through before doing med genetics training programs.

I was considering Medical Genetics seriously for a while as the follow-up to my impending IM residency, enough to do an away genetics clerkship and apply to a few combined med-gen residency programs. My experience was that most genetics fellows come through a Peds residency. The vast majority. A few come from Fam Med, and very rarely from Medicine.

This made sense once I learned more, because the clinical portion of a genetics fellowship (the ones I've seen, anyway) is very heavy on pediatrics. The major clinical responsibilities of the fellows are 1) diagnosing and managing syndromic-appearing neonates, 2) managing acute/ER/inpatient visits of children with metabolic disorders, and 3) assessing developmentally-delayed children in clinic. There is a very small smattering of adult medicine: mostly assessing families for cancer syndromes, with a little bit of acting as consultant for adults with genetic disease.

I also looked into the makeup of academic Med Gen divisions around the country. Most are quite small, as you'd expect. A large group is 4+ physicians. Very, very few of these are internists. It's rare to find a group with even one, and only a handful of the largest groups have more than one. However, the impression I got is that this rarity is not necessarily from lack of demand, and that an IM-trained geneticist might even be well sought-after by most groups. There is even some discussion of altering fellowship programs and boards requirements to make genetics more friendly to internists who seek an adult-oriented practice. Still, the peds-oriented fellowship remained an obstacle to me, and I was more interested in a short-track IM program than a med-peds combo.

The lifestyle of the geneticists, however, seemed wonderful. Most I've met were academics with lab or other research interests. The pace leaves plenty of time for these pursuits. There are few emergencies, and the inpatient service is all consults. Even the fellows form strong bonds with the families they see over and over again, and the attendings can become ersatz primary care docs for kids they watch grow up. Clinics are models of multidisciplinary teams, and there is little time pressure. It is a highly intellectual field, and every new patient sends you to the textbooks or OMIM. There are true master clinicians who can diagnose just by appearance, but who still order the sophisticated and ever-changing molecular diagnostic studies. It is a truly fascinating field of medicine, particularly if you have a scientific bent.

Hope this helps.

 

[Haemulon]

Good write up. I too have considered med gen on and off, but like you am more interested in adult medicine I think. From all accounts that I have seen, the job market/salary range is somewhat soft even though the field has much potential for growth. One path I had considered would be to do the peds/med gen or im/med gen residency, followed by fellowships in areas like molecular genetics, cytogenetics, and molecular genetic pathology. With these certifications, one could potentially run/participate/consult for one or more diagnostics labs along with maintaining clinic hours. Although the market for small independent labs of that sort is really tough as well, considering the big powerhouse labs dominating much of the market.

 

[MiesVanDerMom]

Just wanted to say this is a great description of med gen! My older son has two rare genetic diseases and I have to say, you form a wonderful bond with your med gen doctors. Of all the many many specialists he sees, they have always impressed me the most in both their intellect/clincial proficiency and their bedside manner and compassion. It's true they become your PCP more than your actual PCP too. I'd love to go into med gen if I had the time for the training. But it is a research heavy field and I hate research

I was considering Medical Genetics seriously for a while as the follow-up to my impending IM residency, enough to do an away genetics clerkship and apply to a few combined med-gen residency programs. My experience was that most genetics fellows come through a Peds residency. The vast majority. A few come from Fam Med, and very rarely from Medicine.

This made sense once I learned more, because the clinical portion of a genetics fellowship (the ones I've seen, anyway) is very heavy on pediatrics. The major clinical responsibilities of the fellows are 1) diagnosing and managing syndromic-appearing neonates, 2) managing acute/ER/inpatient visits of children with metabolic disorders, and 3) assessing developmentally-delayed children in clinic. There is a very small smattering of adult medicine: mostly assessing families for cancer syndromes, with a little bit of acting as consultant for adults with genetic disease.

I also looked into the makeup of academic Med Gen divisions around the country. Most are quite small, as you'd expect. A large group is 4+ physicians. Very, very few of these are internists. It's rare to find a group with even one, and only a handful of the largest groups have more than one. However, the impression I got is that this rarity is not necessarily from lack of demand, and that an IM-trained geneticist might even be well sought-after by most groups. There is even some discussion of altering fellowship programs and boards requirements to make genetics more friendly to internists who seek an adult-oriented practice. Still, the peds-oriented fellowship remained an obstacle to me, and I was more interested in a short-track IM program than a med-peds combo.

The lifestyle of the geneticists, however, seemed wonderful. Most I've met were academics with lab or other research interests. The pace leaves plenty of time for these pursuits. There are few emergencies, and the inpatient service is all consults. Even the fellows form strong bonds with the families they see over and over again, and the attendings can become ersatz primary care docs for kids they watch grow up. Clinics are models of multidisciplinary teams, and there is little time pressure. It is a highly intellectual field, and every new patient sends you to the textbooks or OMIM. There are true master clinicians who can diagnose just by appearance, but who still order the sophisticated and ever-changing molecular diagnostic studies. It is a truly fascinating field of medicine, particularly if you have a scientific bent.

Hope this helps.

 

[guest9999]

I am a clinical geneticist. This is a pretty accurate assessment though our field is quite broad. I see just about everything that comes my way (peds, metabolic conditions, cancer, prenatal counseling, etc).
In regard to the pay, it seems in the US the pay is probably about 110-140K though keep in mind this is usually in an academic center. Range of starting salaries from recently graduated fellows I have asked ranged from 100-135K. Because we don't see a lot of patients in the day, our salaries are not reflective of revenue that we generate for the hospital or the university but often reflect a salaried position for service regarded as necessary. This is in contrast to a procedure-oriented specialty.

I would suggest that a residency in Med-Peds prior to genetics fellowship is often considered highly advantageous from a clinical preperation point of view.

I was considering Medical Genetics seriously for a while as the follow-up to my impending IM residency, enough to do an away genetics clerkship and apply to a few combined med-gen residency programs. My experience was that most genetics fellows come through a Peds residency. The vast majority. A few come from Fam Med, and very rarely from Medicine.

This made sense once I learned more, because the clinical portion of a genetics fellowship (the ones I've seen, anyway) is very heavy on pediatrics. The major clinical responsibilities of the fellows are 1) diagnosing and managing syndromic-appearing neonates, 2) managing acute/ER/inpatient visits of children with metabolic disorders, and 3) assessing developmentally-delayed children in clinic. There is a very small smattering of adult medicine: mostly assessing families for cancer syndromes, with a little bit of acting as consultant for adults with genetic disease.

I also looked into the makeup of academic Med Gen divisions around the country. Most are quite small, as you'd expect. A large group is 4+ physicians. Very, very few of these are internists. It's rare to find a group with even one, and only a handful of the largest groups have more than one. However, the impression I got is that this rarity is not necessarily from lack of demand, and that an IM-trained geneticist might even be well sought-after by most groups. There is even some discussion of altering fellowship programs and boards requirements to make genetics more friendly to internists who seek an adult-oriented practice. Still, the peds-oriented fellowship remained an obstacle to me, and I was more interested in a short-track IM program than a med-peds combo.

The lifestyle of the geneticists, however, seemed wonderful. Most I've met were academics with lab or other research interests. The pace leaves plenty of time for these pursuits. There are few emergencies, and the inpatient service is all consults. Even the fellows form strong bonds with the families they see over and over again, and the attendings can become ersatz primary care docs for kids they watch grow up. Clinics are models of multidisciplinary teams, and there is little time pressure. It is a highly intellectual field, and every new patient sends you to the textbooks or OMIM. There are true master clinicians who can diagnose just by appearance, but who still order the sophisticated and ever-changing molecular diagnostic studies. It is a truly fascinating field of medicine, particularly if you have a scientific bent.

Hope this helps.

 

[homeobox_genes]

Good write up. I too have considered med gen on and off, but like you am more interested in adult medicine I think. From all accounts that I have seen, the job market/salary range is somewhat soft even though the field has much potential for growth. One path I had considered would be to do the peds/med gen or im/med gen residency, followed by fellowships in areas like molecular genetics, cytogenetics, and molecular genetic pathology. With these certifications, one could potentially run/participate/consult for one or more diagnostics labs along with maintaining clinic hours. Although the market for small independent labs of that sort is really tough as well, considering the big powerhouse labs dominating much of the market.

If you are thinking of financial renumeration, the path you've just described is unlikely to be what you're looking for.

 

[homeobox_genes]

I was considering Medical Genetics seriously for a while as the follow-up to my impending IM residency, enough to do an away genetics clerkship and apply to a few combined med-gen residency programs. My experience was that most genetics fellows come through a Peds residency. The vast majority. A few come from Fam Med, and very rarely from Medicine.

This made sense once I learned more, because the clinical portion of a genetics fellowship (the ones I've seen, anyway) is very heavy on pediatrics. The major clinical responsibilities of the fellows are 1) diagnosing and managing syndromic-appearing neonates, 2) managing acute/ER/inpatient visits of children with metabolic disorders, and 3) assessing developmentally-delayed children in clinic. There is a very small smattering of adult medicine: mostly assessing families for cancer syndromes, with a little bit of acting as consultant for adults with genetic disease.

I also looked into the makeup of academic Med Gen divisions around the country. Most are quite small, as you'd expect. A large group is 4+ physicians. Very, very few of these are internists. It's rare to find a group with even one, and only a handful of the largest groups have more than one. However, the impression I got is that this rarity is not necessarily from lack of demand, and that an IM-trained geneticist might even be well sought-after by most groups. There is even some discussion of altering fellowship programs and boards requirements to make genetics more friendly to internists who seek an adult-oriented practice. Still, the peds-oriented fellowship remained an obstacle to me, and I was more interested in a short-track IM program than a med-peds combo.

The lifestyle of the geneticists, however, seemed wonderful. Most I've met were academics with lab or other research interests. The pace leaves plenty of time for these pursuits. There are few emergencies, and the inpatient service is all consults. Even the fellows form strong bonds with the families they see over and over again, and the attendings can become ersatz primary care docs for kids they watch grow up. Clinics are models of multidisciplinary teams, and there is little time pressure. It is a highly intellectual field, and every new patient sends you to the textbooks or OMIM. There are true master clinicians who can diagnose just by appearance, but who still order the sophisticated and ever-changing molecular diagnostic studies. It is a truly fascinating field of medicine, particularly if you have a scientific bent.

Hope this helps.

Towel, this is an excellent description.

 

[ravupadh]

Wow.. I'm highly considering this field! How long would the entire residency be if you did the IM/Med Gen path. I know this isn't a reliable source but I read on Wikipedia that some programs offer an accelerated IM/Med gen 4 year program. Anyone know how prevalent those are?

And I'm very heavy into the molecular genetics field. How long is the fellowship for that? Thanks.

 

[jdh71]

Wow.. I'm highly considering this field! How long would the entire residency be if you did the IM/Med Gen path. I know this isn't a reliable source but I read on Wikipedia that some programs offer an accelerated IM/Med gen 4 year program. Anyone know how prevalent those are?

And I'm very heavy into the molecular genetics field. How long is the fellowship for that? Thanks.

med-peds programs are all over the place, they are generally not as competitive as many others and you can usually end up training at the program you really like

 

[mdgeneticist]

Hello,

I'm a Clinical Geneticist, and I LOVE my job! I work in a 3 person private practice, and my salary is $210/year (I'm less than five years our of fellowship). My academic counterparts are earning $140-$170/year depending on their experience. I have an awesome lifestyle. Each new patient represents a mystery for me to solve, and I feel that I really have the potential to help not only my patients, but their families as well. I would encourage anyone with an interest in Genetics to pursue this field.

Good luck!

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

Hello,

I'm a Clinical Geneticist, and I LOVE my job! I work in a 3 person private practice, and my salary is $210/year (I'm less than five years our of fellowship). My academic counterparts are earning $140-$170/year depending on their experience. I have an awesome lifestyle. Each new patient represents a mystery for me to solve, and I feel that I really have the potential to help not only my patients, but their families as well. I would encourage anyone with an interest in Genetics to pursue this field.

Good luck!

I was curious.
I'm not pursuing this field... however, if an OB were to do this track, would they be able to apply this knowledge towards correcting certain known genetic abnormalities via IVF? I know it sounds sci-fi or whatever, but was curious.

 

[ravupadh]

So I'm guessing the field would be ideal for someone going into medical research since both the research and clinical aspects would highly complement eachother? I'm thinking of doing an MD/PhD with a PhD in gene therapy.

 

[doctor harsh]

nice posts everyone.... I'm also aspiring to train as a Medical Geneticist... although right now i'll be going for an MPH in Epidemiology and Human Genetics at U of Texas Health Science Center at Houston.... will apply for a residency in Med-Gen after that... feeling nice to find people who are already into it

 

[Erfan1985]

Hi every Body
Anybody knows anything about Salary rates , Job market and Life style for those having Phd in Medical genetics?

 

[clingen]

Hello,

I'm a Clinical Geneticist, and I LOVE my job! I work in a 3 person private practice, and my salary is $210/year (I'm less than five years our of fellowship). My academic counterparts are earning $140-$170/year depending on their experience. I have an awesome lifestyle. Each new patient represents a mystery for me to solve, and I feel that I really have the potential to help not only my patients, but their families as well. I would encourage anyone with an interest in Genetics to pursue this field.

Good luck!

Thanks all for nice write-ups.

I am thinking about switching to med gen after two years on IM. What is the risk of being a clinical geneticist not board-certified in IM?

 

[tcp03]

Does anyone know if you can pursue training in medical genetics after an Emergency Medicine residency? Thanks!

 

[gutonc]

Does anyone know if you can pursue training in medical genetics after an Emergency Medicine residency? Thanks!

According to the ABMG (which...quite honestly, you could have Googled yourself, but you're welcome for doing your homework for you), yes. But you have to find a program willing to accept you which is likely to be your biggest hurdle.

Also...why?

 

[tcp03]

Lol if you're going to talk to me like a 5 year old then your opinion is not welcome...and why?...because I want to. You're quite rude for a physician

 

[Dr Google]

Hello everyone, glad to find a thread on beloved Med Gen!

I have a Quick question- Is it possible to work in the academia ( I want to work in Evolutionary Genetics) after finishing a residency in Medical Genetics?

The reason for me following this weird path is-
1) I want to do an MD in Medical Genetics for the monetary remuneration a residency can offer ( I need to sort a few financial issues back home, and a PhD stipend most likely won't be enough.)
2) But my 'true love' is Evolutionary Genetics; so hopefully, with an MD in Medical Genetics, I would still be able to make a career in it.
But I don't really have my feet wet in this field, so need advice from you all who are already on the path and know what lies in it.

Would really, really appreciate if you could throw in a quick reply here.
(I'll be checking this thread regularly, so please respond, if you can, even if you find this thread months later after my post.)
Thanks

 

[D elegans]

Hello everyone, glad to find a thread on beloved Med Gen!

I have a Quick question- Is it possible to work in the academia ( I want to work in Evolutionary Genetics) after finishing a residency in Medical Genetics?

The reason for me following this weird path is-
1) I want to do an MD in Medical Genetics for the monetary remuneration a residency can offer ( I need to sort a few financial issues back home, and a PhD stipend most likely won't be enough.)
2) But my 'true love' is Evolutionary Genetics; so hopefully, with an MD in Medical Genetics, I would still be able to make a career in it.
But I don't really have my feet wet in this field, so need advice from you all who are already on the path and know what lies in it.

Would really, really appreciate if you could throw in a quick reply here.
(I'll be checking this thread regularly, so please respond, if you can, even if you find this thread months later after my post.)
Thanks

Not sure if you're serious, but giving you the benefit of the doubt...

Are you in medical school right now? If not, don't! You will incur massive debt that will be very difficult to pay off in a timely manner with an academic position.

You are much better off being paid to go to school with a PhD program and go into evolutionary genetics (an awesome field) straight-up.

 

[ravupadh]

Is it possible for a DO/PhD to apply for medical genetics residencies? I just got accepted to UMDNJ SOM but I noticed that there are no DO medical genetics residencies. Since I'm planning to do the DO/PhD, is it even possible for them to apply to allopathic medical genetics residency programs?

 

[Spooner13]

Is it possible for a DO/PhD to apply for medical genetics residencies? I just got accepted to UMDNJ SOM but I noticed that there are no DO medical genetics residencies. Since I'm planning to do the DO/PhD, is it even possible for them to apply to allopathic medical genetics residency programs?

Yes, it's definitely possible. Most graduates from DO programs do not go to Osteopathic residencies...the majority go to allopathic residencies. And from what I've heard, getting into a medical genetics residency is not very competative. So you'll be able to enter an allopathic residency after you graduate.

 

[Dr Google]

Not sure if you're serious, but giving you the benefit of the doubt...

Are you in medical school right now? If not, don't! You will incur massive debt that will be very difficult to pay off in a timely manner with an academic position.

You are much better off being paid to go to school with a PhD program and go into evolutionary genetics (an awesome field) straight-up.

Thanks for the reply! Actually I have already done my Medical School from India, without any substantial debt, and was planning to write the USMLE exams... But before writing it, I need to know whether -
a) Will I still be able to make the turn later and move towards working in evolutionary genetics, and
b) Whether getting a residency in medical genetics itself is doable, or is it super-competitive like surgery and radiology (a lot of Med Gen program websites I went through stated that they do NOT accept IMGs, I wonder why )

 

[PaperMaker]

The med gen doc that I shadowed was a FMG, She's from Turkey and she loves her job. Def doable.

...But she has 250+ on step 1 and 2.

 

[GeneMD2B]

Hi ravupadh and Dr. Google,





I was interviewing for Clinical Genetics spots last year for this coming July, and I thought I might have some useful information forboth of you.

First, there are lots of DOs in allopathic residency programs in many specialties, and in some specialties they are very well received. While I am not sure in general how clinical genetics programs think about DOs I do know that UMDNJ has some very nice and very smart clinical geneticists at the New Jersey Medical School. I am sure that it would be possible to do anaway rotation there which seems like it could help. One thing to be aware of is that, in the past, ACGME accredited residency programs accepted Osteopathic internships, but it seems that there may be a trend away from this in the future, so check before you do one.

Second, there are lots of IMGs in clinical genetics, both residents and faculty members. If it is what you want to do, then you should try and do it. That said, it is not as uncompetitive as one might guess from the NRMP match fill rates. I have been told that many programs would rather not fill than have someone that they were not pleased with, so they are not just trying to fill positions to get service work done.

Oh and something everyone should be aware of is that specialties that are competitive one year may not be competitive the next. It is anyone's bet about how competitive clinical genetics will be in four years. If there is a hit TV show that features a clinical geneticist prominently we could be ultra-competitive for a year or two!

Best of luck to you both.

 

[km72]

There's a lot of great info on here about this specialty. I'm highly interested in genetics and have shadowed a geneticist. However, in the practice that I shadowed, the geneticist almost exclusively saw pediatric patients and the genetic counselors worked with pre-natals. As someone who is not interested in pediatrics, what opportunities exist for practicing genetics with either adults or pre-natals?

 

[CHAGEO]

I'm interested in doing gene therapy. I was wondering if anyone knows which residency or fellowship programs that offer the training in this procedure? Thanks

 

[gutonc]

I'm interested in doing gene therapy. I was wondering if anyone knows which residency or fellowship programs that offer the training in this procedure? Thanks

Where are you in your training? Because your question makes it sound like you're a pre-med at best. There is no "training in gene therapy" because there is no gene therapy outside of the lab and some clinical trials. It's coming, don't get me wrong. But you're not going to find a "gene therapy" fellowship for quite some time.

 

[CHAGEO]

Where are you in your training? Because your question makes it sound like you're a pre-med at best. There is no "training in gene therapy" because there is no gene therapy outside of the lab and some clinical trials. It's coming, don't get me wrong. But you're not going to find a "gene therapy" fellowship for quite some time.

Thanks so much for your reply. I'm a 2nd year osteopathic medical student. I learned about gene therapy in my biochemistry class last year. I think it is very interesting. I think gene therapy may be promising for cancer and genetic disorders treatment. I just want to learn more about gene therapy. I didn't know that there is no gene therapy outside of the lab and some clinical trials .

 

[gutonc]

Thanks so much for your reply. I'm a 2nd year osteopathic medical student. I learned about gene therapy in my biochemistry class last year. I think it is very interesting. I think gene therapy may be promising for cancer and genetic disorders treatment. I just want to learn more about gene therapy. I didn't know that there is no gene therapy outside of the lab and some clinical trials .

You and several hundred other scientists with multiple R01 (and similar) grants. Point is...it's not a specialty and not in the clinic yet. Not that it couldn't be by the time you get around to your training or practice, but it's not the sort of thing I'd bet on.

 

[Muffinho]

I'm bumping this thread with a simple question:

Are there are lot of PhD Geneticists working with those of you who are Medical Geneticists? I am considering a PhD over MD (applying next year, have a decent shot of getting in).

 

[referee3]

Also going to bump.

Do medical geneticist's working in private practice ever conduct research and publish?

 

[gutonc]

Also going to bump.

Do medical geneticist's working in private practice ever conduct research and publish?

Yes. Although it's typically clinical research not bench research.

 

[Bioeli]

Could you tell me your experience, how did yo became geneticist (I know there are may ways)? Where did you do your residency or fellowship?
Do you have to match for IM, peds or Ob/gyn and after match again for genetics residency?
I like genetics in all life stages, that's why I don´t want a combined residency, I wold like to do the residency in genetics more than a fellowship (because for a fellowship I need another medical specialty before)

My other option is to do a master in genetics, but then clinic won´t be an option for me. I also like genetics in not so rare diseases, like diabetes genetics, nutrigenomics, and other common diseases. Also, I would love to work in gene therapy and translational medicine...so is the residency in genetics a good path? or better a master/PhD?
The problem with a master or PhD is that I will have to pay for it, and in residency, I will get paid.