Job options with an MD (without residency)

[greenzen]

You'll find the vast majority of people in this world allow money to become a much more substantial restriction on life than it really is.

Before you know it we will all be old and life will be over. Not a single person out there should do anything apart from what makes him or her happy.

So much truth right there.

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[Doctor4Life1769]

My view is that the more time one spends doing something he or she isn't fully committed to/passionate about, the worse off he or she is.

This is a very old thread, but the topic is perennial.

There is nothing more important than time. The resource is extremely limited.

In contrast to the above advice, for any future reader of this thread considering not going to residency, stop worrying about everything external (e.g., "do I need to do an intern year or full program first?") and run with your gut. That's hugely important. If you are ambivalent and not sure what you'll do if you don't go to residency, then double-consider pragmatism/feasibility, but if you do know what you want, then pursue that. (And for comparison, think about different people who have dropped out/not even finished programs to pursue their goals/passions)

I'm taking at least a year off after medical school to pursue "endeavours," and I might not return to practice medicine or even do an intern year. That's essentially against the advice of everyone I know. But yet again I'm aware that's just because they see it as against the norm/high risk and can't conceptualize what it means to have a deep passion for something. I truly believe however that if you have lucidity about what you want/need to do, it doesn't seem like risk at all.

The same way a painting is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, the true risk associated with any given situation is only as great as one perceives it to be.

One person might view the possibility of losing X-number of dollars as a big deal, whereas another might view the time lost not pursuing an endeavour as immeasurably more substantial.

What I've come to realize is that once you've found what you're passionate about, nothing becomes more important than pursuing that. Money is the least important thing on the priority list. If your reason for not going to residency is potentially lucrative, that's great. But if it's not, pursuing your goals is way more important than how quickly you pay off your loans. You'll find the vast majority of people in this world allow money to become a much more substantial restriction on life than it really is.

Before you know it we will all be old and life will be over. Not a single person out there should do anything apart from what makes him or her happy.

So... you're gonna start freelancing?

 

[Crayola227]

My view is that the more time one spends doing something he or she isn't fully committed to/passionate about, the worse off he or she is.

This is a very old thread, but the topic is perennial.

There is nothing more important than time. The resource is extremely limited.

In contrast to the above advice, for any future reader of this thread considering not going to residency, stop worrying about everything external (e.g., "do I need to do an intern year or full program first?") and run with your gut. That's hugely important. If you are ambivalent and not sure what you'll do if you don't go to residency, then double-consider pragmatism/feasibility, but if you do know what you want, then pursue that. (And for comparison, think about different people who have dropped out/not even finished programs to pursue their goals/passions)

I'm taking at least a year off after medical school to pursue "endeavours," and I might not return to practice medicine or even do an intern year. That's essentially against the advice of everyone I know. But yet again I'm aware that's just because they see it as against the norm/high risk and can't conceptualize what it means to have a deep passion for something. I truly believe however that if you have lucidity about what you want/need to do, it doesn't seem like risk at all.

The same way a painting is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, the true risk associated with any given situation is only as great as one perceives it to be.

One person might view the possibility of losing X-number of dollars as a big deal, whereas another might view the time lost not pursuing an endeavour as immeasurably more substantial.

What I've come to realize is that once you've found what you're passionate about, nothing becomes more important than pursuing that. Money is the least important thing on the priority list. If your reason for not going to residency is potentially lucrative, that's great. But if it's not, pursuing your goals is way more important than how quickly you pay off your loans. You'll find the vast majority of people in this world allow money to become a much more substantial restriction on life than it really is.

Before you know it we will all be old and life will be over. Not a single person out there should do anything apart from what makes him or her happy.

There's some truth to the spirit of this, and also some total BS.
Some people I know went from being on path to finishing residency and attending salary and dream job, to, well, not. And like the person below, they can live an impoverished life full of uncertainty and continued suffering in those fields, or finish residency.
Poverty sucks. Real poverty, sucks. It only doesn't suck I guess if you choose it, but I guess I wouldn't count that as poverty but a lifestyle choice. Some counterculture people like living off the grid and finding their next meal in a dumpster as part of their life adventure. Once the thrill of living a life you've only seen on a tele-drama wears off, eating out of a dumpster loses its sexy allure after a while.

The additional problem is one like mine, where I did not match and am trying my best to do something medically relevant, but there's not much out there where I can earn a living doing so. Sure, research positions are an option, but there are only so many. Currently I'm working doing over the phone medical interviews, volunteering one morning a week at a free clinic, doing research at my school where I graduated, and will soon be adding Uber driver to that, but there's only so long that a person can be stretched that many ways without breaking. I also applied to a bunch of paid research and pharma jobs, but hope has been in little supply in my life.

God forbid that you are single and at some point in your 5-7 year course of med school +1 yr internship/3 yr residency you become too physically disabled to finish or work something else full time. Than you're in Chicago2012's place, or looking at SSI $700 per month to live on.

It's not for nothing that some people wish they had never gone to medical school, or that some suicides have medical training in some form implicated in them.

Every time a patient says, "Thank you Dr. Idealist," it's like one of the happiest and most fulfilling moments in my life, and I would give anything for being a doctor to look anything like the highlight reel moments I've experienced or Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman or Doc Martin or any time it looked like being a doctor was more awesome than sucky, and was more spending time with patients helping them than making hand-massage-love to a computer keyboard, but it just isn't.

Get out now before you start, or ****ing finish in a residency and try to find a practice you enjoy to make the most of that MD and any security, happiness, and financial reward it might bring you, while trying to peel away its many leech-tentacle-suckers-of-misery from hollowing out the very marrow of your bones.

If like the dude above or some other people on here, you can make traveling the world as a DJ work or dumpster diving or Alaskan ice fishing, Uber driving, or being a birthing surrogate or mail order husband work for you instead, good luck.

 

[Phloston]

There's some truth to the spirit of this, and also some total BS.
Some people I know went from being on path to finishing residency and attending salary and dream job, to, well, not. And like the person below, they can live an impoverished life full of uncertainty and continued suffering in those fields, or finish residency.
Poverty sucks. Real poverty, sucks. It only doesn't suck I guess if you choose it, but I guess I wouldn't count that as poverty but a lifestyle choice. Some counterculture people like living off the grid and finding their next meal in a dumpster as part of their life adventure. Once the thrill of living a life you've only seen on a tele-drama wears off, eating out of a dumpster loses its sexy allure after a while.



God forbid that you are single and at some point in your 5-7 year course of med school +1 yr internship/3 yr residency you become too physically disabled to finish or work something else full time. Than you're in Chicago2012's place, or looking at SSI $700 per month to live on.

It's not for nothing that some people wish they had never gone to medical school, or that some suicides have medical training in some form implicated in them.

Every time a patient says, "Thank you Dr. Idealist," it's like one of the happiest and most fulfilling moments in my life, and I would give anything for being a doctor to look anything like the highlight reel moments I've experienced or Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman or Doc Martin or any time it looked like being a doctor was more awesome than sucky, and was more spending time with patients helping them than making hand-massage-love to a computer keyboard, but it just isn't.

Get out now before you start, or ****ing finish in a residency and try to find a practice you enjoy to make the most of that MD and any security, happiness, and financial reward it might bring you, while trying to peel away its many leech-tentacle-suckers-of-misery from hollowing out the very marrow of your bones.

If like the dude above or some other people on here, you can make traveling the world as a DJ work or dumpster diving or Alaskan ice fishing, Uber driving, or being a birthing surrogate or mail order husband work for you instead, good luck.

I don't even know how to respond to this type of commentary. If I voiced my thoughts, they'd probably come off / parallel Obama's recent ones on Huckabee. The only difference is I'm nowhere near as awesome as Obama.

 

[Crayola227]

I don't even know how to respond to this type of commentary. If I voiced my thoughts, they'd probably come off / parallel Obama's recent ones on Huckabee. The only difference is I'm nowhere near as awesome as Obama.

Funny, seeing as you're a med student in Australia.

I'm sure you have valuable insights into the challenges of practicing as a physician, or practicing in the US, or having $300,00K in loans. Or that you understand the career challenges of what to do with an MD and no residency in the US.

Maybe you agree with the poster I disagreed with, that in the US with an MD, $300K in loans, and no residency, that the important thing is to just be happy and no worries about poverty here. I agree with that poster that money is not the most important thing, but seeing what my friend is going through now, I have to say any pathway that leads to living near the poverty line here is not a pretty one.

Please, if you have any personal insight into job options with an MD without a residency in the US, please share.

 

[Chicago2012]

Funny, seeing as you're a med student in Australia.

I'm sure you have valuable insights into the challenges of practicing as a physician, or practicing in the US, or having $300,00K in loans. Or that you understand the career challenges of what to do with an MD and no residency in the US.

Maybe you agree with the poster I disagreed with, that in the US with an MD, $300K in loans, and no residency, that the important thing is to just be happy and no worries about poverty here. I agree with that poster that money is not the most important thing, but seeing what my friend is going through now, I have to say any pathway that leads to living near the poverty line here is not a pretty one.

Please, if you have any personal insight into job options with an MD without a residency in the US, please share.

Crayola, obviously I agree that getting approximately 300K in debt and not having residency is an extremely bad situation with almost no way to resolve it without eventually getting at least one year of residency under your belt, but in the grand scheme of things being happy with what you do is what's most important. For me, I would be most happy completing residency and helping people as a Family Physician, but some might realize at this point, either because they realize after more intimate experience with medicine in medical school or because this was a decision forced upon them by overbearing parents, that this life is not what they want and that medicine is not their passion. For those, there is no point clogging a residency system that already sees an overabundance of applicants vying for positions between AMGs and IMGs. It makes no sense. Might as well leave those positions to someone who would be happy with it.

 

[Crayola227]

Crayola, obviously I agree that getting approximately 300K in debt and not having residency is an extremely bad situation with almost no way to resolve it without eventually getting at least one year of residency under your belt, but in the grand scheme of things being happy with what you do is what's most important. For me, I would be most happy completing residency and helping people as a Family Physician, but some might realize at this point, either because they realize after more intimate experience with medicine in medical school or because this was a decision forced upon them by overbearing parents, that this life is not what they want and that medicine is not their passion. For those, there is no point clogging a residency system that already sees an overabundance of applicants vying for positions between AMGs and IMGs. It makes no sense. Might as well leave those positions to someone who would be happy with it.

I agree with you.

I'm probably arguing from a totally different side that I didn't make clear.

If someone is so far in that they got the MD, sure, try to find something else you love if that's it for you.
Finishing a year of residency will open up more doors for things you might want to do. Better to do that year, or even a residency, and then move on to something else. Do the year and then decide your passion is stand up comedy. Do some tours. Discover that life in hotels, getting booed off stage, and hardly having enough money eat isn't as great as you thought, and sucks only slightly less than the intern year you did. Then you can say, "I have a better fall back plan. I think I could live with the trade off of being a medical consultant. I'm fully licensed since I did that year/boarded since I did that residency, now I'm going to do this job, have this level of job satisfaction, and this QOL and salary. That way, I can better finance myself, and I'll do stand up on the weekends."

The thing to consider is, what job am I going to be able to get? Will I like that job? Will I be able to live with its salary in relation to my loan?

I only fear for people not to do that year, because if you don't out of the gate of med school, each year it will be harder to match, and the places less desirable. Then, after about 5 years post grad, it may be impossible to do it at all. You may find yourself with an MD, huge loans, and no good career options. It is easier to come back 2 years later to a PGY2 position somewhere than 1 years later to PGY1. And even if the PGY2 isn't there for you, you've got a full license. Bettter all around. Capice?

Do what you love. Make plans to have a roof over your head, because whatever you love you will find harder to enjoy if you're trapped outside in the rain. Keep your options open.

 

[Mysterio123]

Consider going into professional boxing. That's kinda what I wanted to do. Finish MD, take a year off to train, and go into pro sports. And if you cant make it pro, your MD degree can save you as a back up.

I feel like this comment might get a lot of negative responses :/ but I hope I helped.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Consider going into professional boxing. That's kinda what I wanted to do. Finish MD, take a year off to train, and go into pro sports. And if you cant make it pro, your MD degree can save you as a back up.

I feel like this comment might get a lot of negative responses :/ but I hope I helped.

What's going to get you a lot of negative responses is your penchant for bumping old threads and making somewhat off-topic comments.

 

[pepz202]

I was an unmatched IMG who was also looking for a job/part-time job while applying for residency and I got lucky that another IMG friend was leaving a position with a Urologist at a busy practice in Orange County, CA. I started to work for that urologist in July and I will be leaving the position in June if anyone is interested. It is a payed position as a Medical Assistant but it does come with perks (I will explain). I started off learning what a medical assistant does in a busy urology practice, and once I mastered that the Doctor had me obtain H&P's from all the new patients. Once he felt confident with my abilities, he had me presenting cases to him after all patients were seen and critiquing my oral presentations and offering suggestions. We would also do mock cases very similar to usmle step 2 ck, but would go a step further and do more management such as what is found in usmle step 3 questions. Overall it was a great experience as the doctor is very knowledgeable (being a UCLA grad) and helpful (he is always looking for ways to help you both match and succeed as an intern).

If anyone is interested in taking the position and is Bilingual (Spanish or Vietnamese) please contact the following email: [email protected]

P.S. UCI medical center is very close to his office and allows you to attend grand rounds.