How about a good ol' fashioned "what are my chances" thread?

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thanks! what it the UCSF rubric?


google "residency thank you note sample ucsf" it's the first hit

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Hey friends,
I think I might need to hear some blunt advice. MS-3, (very) soon-to-be MS-4 who decided on Rad Onc way too late in the process. I'd appreciate ANY insight you could give me.

Top 10 med school
Step 1: 250
Clinicals: Not AOA, but Honors in Surgery, Internal Medicine, Family. HP in Psych
Research: ZERO current publications. By the time I apply, I should have 1 first-author surgical oncology manuscript accepted for publication in a high profile journal. Might have 1 first-author manuscript accepted in ENT (what I originally planned on). Since deciding on Rad Onc, I tried getting involved in the department. Threw myself into 3 different projects, but looking at the timeline realistically and honestly, I do not believe I can get any of them done in time.
Away Rotations: Still hoping for 1 in August, it's so late in the process, I'm thinking it'll be at a "lower tier" school, whatever that really means. One lined up at a decent East-Coast program in October, but that's too late for it to matter anyway. Long story short, I probably won't have a letter from a "big wig."

I'm starting to think I need a year off for research. I have a number of projects confirmed, so I'm fairly confident that the research year would look productive. BUT, our department advisor thought I wouldn't need it to match, although he didn't say it with much confidence. My concern isn't about going to MDA, my concern is about matching. I'm a weirdly adaptable human being, and I know I can be happy even if I ended up matching to the Radiation Oncology Department of Ciudad Juarez University. I just do not want to go through this process more than once, or enter my PGY-1 year without knowing where I'd be the following year. Any advice would be truly appreciated, and I'd be happy to drink a beer in your honor.
 
I just do not want to go through this process more than once, or enter my PGY-1 year without knowing where I'd be the following year. Any advice would be truly appreciated, and I'd be happy to drink a beer in your honor.

I can tell you many on this board and this specialty have done just that. The uncertainty in having an internship and no advanced program to go to can be nerve-wracking, but quite frankly you'd be surprised at how many spots open up. Remember, no 4th year med students can take spots that open up during the year since they need to complete an internship first. Programs often add spots and in some cases, new programs have formed in the past few years where spots become available midway through the year.

The one kink might be the recent change of NRMP trying to make all of these "out of match" spots go through their own match.
 
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You're on the cusp. You might be attractive to programs b/c of your pedigree and few things you have submitted, or you might slip through the sieve. I would apply broadly with what you have, and then try to re-arrange and line-up a rotation at a 'name' place. There are too many out there to say you can't get one. There has got to be 20 places with at least 2 people that would get you a decent letter. But, if you got a residency spot or didn't, I wouldn't be surprised. I was pretty similar to you in that respect, but didn't go to as good medical school.
 
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Yeesh. This'll be tough. Also, one of the barriers to getting an away rotation is that my school is off a few weeks from other schools' schedules (i.e. most places start their rotations during the final week of my Sub-I.) My school already said they won't be flexible on the dates, and that leaves about 70% of the programs out there out of my reach. All the remaining top programs already have their August spots all claimed too (another downside of deciding later).

But when you say?
"But, if you got a spot or didn't, I wouldn't be surprised."
are you referring to getting an away rotation or matching? Hmmm...I'm thinking I should take a year off now.
 
Yeesh. This'll be tough. Also, one of the barriers to getting an away rotation is that my school is off a few weeks from other schools' schedules (i.e. most places start their rotations during the final week of my Sub-I.) My school already said they won't be flexible on the dates, and that leaves about 70% of the programs out there out of my reach. All the remaining top programs already have their August spots all claimed too (another downside of deciding later).

But when you say?
are you referring to getting an away rotation or matching? Hmmm...I'm thinking I should take a year off now.

If you're trying to decide whether to take a year off, the question to ask yourself is probably whether you want to match or you want to have a choice of program. I am just finishing up a year off to apply this year, and was in the same position as you last year.. My app was fairly similar with some other pluses and minuses, but I was told I'd likely match somewhere if I played my cards right. I decided to take the year off, and was very productive, and have been told that I will have a number of interviews and likely a pick of programs. Take it with a grain of salt, I haven't applied yet. But that may be something to consider in your choice if you have a particular geographic desire or hope for a certain type of program. My impression though is that nearly all the rad onc programs offer an excellent education.
 
But that may be something to consider in your choice if you have a particular geographic desire or hope for a certain type of program.

"A choice of program" is always a stretch in a competitive specialty like radiation oncology.

My advice is that you may not get the geographic location you desire even if you are the perfect candidate. I think a lot of program faculty don't understand how competitive this field has gotten, and can at times give incorrect advice regarding the competitiveness of their applicants. This may or may not actually pertain to your situation SJSM001, but in general...

I agree with SimulD's and medgator's advice.
 
Yeesh. This'll be tough. Also, one of the barriers to getting an away rotation is that my school is off a few weeks from other schools' schedules (i.e. most places start their rotations during the final week of my Sub-I.) My school already said they won't be flexible on the dates, and that leaves about 70% of the programs out there out of my reach. All the remaining top programs already have their August spots all claimed too (another downside of deciding later).

But when you say?
are you referring to getting an away rotation or matching? Hmmm...I'm thinking I should take a year off now.

This is a common scenario and schools usually have a work-around for it. It may involve filling a gap with a short elective or vacation time, but it can certainly be done.
 
"A choice of program" is always a stretch in a competitive specialty like radiation oncology.

My advice is that you may not get the geographic location you desire even if you are the perfect candidate. I think a lot of program faculty don't understand how competitive this field has gotten, and can at times give incorrect advice regarding the competitiveness of their applicants. This may or may not actually pertain to your situation SJSM001, but in general...

I agree with SimulD's and medgator's advice.

Absolutely on both accounts. Just pointing out that it's possible that taking a year off may give the OP more interviews (and thus options to rank) than applying this year.
 
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This is a common scenario and schools usually have a work-around for it. It may involve filling a gap with a short elective or vacation time, but it can certainly be done.

This has been a major issue for me as well: One subset of schools is on one schedule, the other is on a different schedule offset by exactly one week. I have exactly two months for aways, with a required rotation following directly after. I could reschedule the required, but then I'd be running into October, and I'm not sure how useful aways would be at that point. Is this an issue that one can contact a clerkship director or their assistant directly about?
 
This has been a major issue for me as well: One subset of schools is on one schedule, the other is on a different schedule offset by exactly one week. I have exactly two months for aways, with a required rotation following directly after. I could reschedule the required, but then I'd be running into October, and I'm not sure how useful aways would be at that point. Is this an issue that one can contact a clerkship director or their assistant directly about?

Potentially. Your own school would probably be of more help. I doubt the away institution is going to be able to accommodate your 4-week block unless it's an institution that doesn't have their own set blocks (hospitals without med schools). Even then, I'm not sure.

I ran into similar issues and ended up taking a mix of short electives and vacation to fill the gaps. My registrar was very accommodating as this comes up all the time.
 
This has been a major issue for me as well: One subset of schools is on one schedule, the other is on a different schedule offset by exactly one week. I have exactly two months for aways, with a required rotation following directly after. I could reschedule the required, but then I'd be running into October, and I'm not sure how useful aways would be at that point. Is this an issue that one can contact a clerkship director or their assistant directly about?

My last away ends in the middle of October. Does anybody think this is problematic? I'm planning on getting a letter from it regardless. It's already scheduled, so I'm not backing out at this point but I hope it doesn't mess anything up.
 
I was in a similar situation with an away rotation that ended in the middle of October and if anything, the timing of that clerkship helped more than it hindered. At first, I was kind of disappointed because many of the prominent faculty were away at ASTRO toward the end of September, but because so many of the residents were away as well, I got to function as something more than just a rotating student and I think I ended up finding more opportunities to impress than I would have otherwise. I didn't get a letter from that institution because my application was already submitted, but in some senses, I think that not asking for a letter made my participation a little more genuine. When one of the senior faculty members approached me about a LOR, rather than asking for a document that we both knew was superfluous (given that my application was already submitted), I instead just asked for their support in my application to the program. Long story short, I ended up matching at that place and I couldn't be happier.
 
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My last away ends in the middle of October. Does anybody think this is problematic? I'm planning on getting a letter from it regardless. It's already scheduled, so I'm not backing out at this point but I hope it doesn't mess anything up.

Tough question. At that specific program, I don't think it will hurt you (as illustrated by the example above). If you're doing it to break into a specific geographical area or to get a LOR, it's possible it won't help you quite as much as it would have earlier in the application season. In the rare instance that a programs reviews applications and sends out interviews before October, you MAY miss your window. However, not only is this rare, but many programs send out one batch of interviews early and then a later batch (Michigan, for instance), in which case it won't be an issue.

I would line up and submit your application with the assumption that you will not need that LOR. It isn't a guarantee anyway. If you get it, gravy. If not, you still have what you need.
 
Hey everybody,

Long-time-reader, first-time poster here, haha. I've been scouring the boards looking for people more like me to get a better idea of my chances and to help guide my decision making. Unfortunately, you are all (like most SDNers) amazing.

I've been interested in RadOnc since first year, but after step 1, I took myself out of the game, crossed my fingers and hoped that I would fall in love with something other than radonc during 3rd year.... didn't happen. Now, in starting my fourth year, I haven't found anything that I rather do more than radiation oncology. I thought that I'd throw my stats out there and ask you all your opinions on what I should do in order to stack the odds in my favor while playing the hand I've been dealt. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Step 1: 228...
Med school: Top 30 or so, US allopathic
Pre-clinical: All P (school is P/F)
Clinical: Honors in OB/Gyn and RadOnc AI (I have an interest in gyn and breast cancers) - Honored all clerkships clinically (not officially though because of shelf exams), except Peds.
Research: First author publication as a first year in PRO. Submitting second publication to Breast later this month. 2 radonc-related abstracts at ASCO breast cancer symposium. 4 radonc-related poster presentations. As an undergrad, 1 cancer-related publication (5th author, haha), 2 cancer-related abstracts and posters.
LoR: 1 from my program director (awesome guy, publishing-machine), 1 from my research mentor (junior faculty, but well known in the brachy world), and 1 hopefully from a big name/program director on my away rotation.
Aways: Did an AI at my home institution, planning 3 aways (I feel like they're all reaches based on my stats, but they're not at any of the top 10 programs, haha).
"Extras": I've been told that I work hard, I'm very easy and fun to work with, and patients love me :cool:

So, I guess my questions are: 1) Do I have a chance? 2) If so, should I apply this cycle? or take a year off? and 3) Any suggestions for beefing up my application (if at all possible) before applying?

Thanks for your help!
 
Hey everybody,

Long-time-reader, first-time poster here, haha. I've been scouring the boards looking for people more like me to get a better idea of my chances and to help guide my decision making. Unfortunately, you are all (like most SDNers) amazing.

I've been interested in RadOnc since first year, but after step 1, I took myself out of the game, crossed my fingers and hoped that I would fall in love with something other than radonc during 3rd year.... didn't happen. Now, in starting my fourth year, I haven't found anything that I rather do more than radiation oncology. I thought that I'd throw my stats out there and ask you all your opinions on what I should do in order to stack the odds in my favor while playing the hand I've been dealt. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Step 1: 228...
Med school: Top 30 or so, US allopathic
Pre-clinical: All P (school is P/F)
Clinical: Honors in OB/Gyn and RadOnc AI (I have an interest in gyn and breast cancers) - Honored all clerkships clinically (not officially though because of shelf exams), except Peds.
Research: First author publication as a first year in PRO. Submitting second publication to Breast later this month. 2 radonc-related abstracts at ASCO breast cancer symposium. 4 radonc-related poster presentations. As an undergrad, 1 cancer-related publication (5th author, haha), 2 cancer-related abstracts and posters.
LoR: 1 from my program director (awesome guy, publishing-machine), 1 from my research mentor (junior faculty, but well known in the brachy world), and 1 hopefully from a big name/program director on my away rotation.
Aways: Did an AI at my home institution, planning 3 aways (I feel like they're all reaches based on my stats, but they're not at any of the top 10 programs, haha).
"Extras": I've been told that I work hard, I'm very easy and fun to work with, and patients love me :cool:

So, I guess my questions are: 1) Do I have a chance? 2) If so, should I apply this cycle? or take a year off? and 3) Any suggestions for beefing up my application (if at all possible) before applying?

Thanks for your help!

You've done all the right things. I would take step 2 early, apply broadly, and hope for the best.
 
Hey everybody,

Long-time-reader, first-time poster here, haha. I've been scouring the boards looking for people more like me to get a better idea of my chances and to help guide my decision making. Unfortunately, you are all (like most SDNers) amazing.

I've been interested in RadOnc since first year, but after step 1, I took myself out of the game, crossed my fingers and hoped that I would fall in love with something other than radonc during 3rd year.... didn't happen. Now, in starting my fourth year, I haven't found anything that I rather do more than radiation oncology. I thought that I'd throw my stats out there and ask you all your opinions on what I should do in order to stack the odds in my favor while playing the hand I've been dealt. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Step 1: 228...
Med school: Top 30 or so, US allopathic
Pre-clinical: All P (school is P/F)
Clinical: Honors in OB/Gyn and RadOnc AI (I have an interest in gyn and breast cancers) - Honored all clerkships clinically (not officially though because of shelf exams), except Peds.
Research: First author publication as a first year in PRO. Submitting second publication to Breast later this month. 2 radonc-related abstracts at ASCO breast cancer symposium. 4 radonc-related poster presentations. As an undergrad, 1 cancer-related publication (5th author, haha), 2 cancer-related abstracts and posters.
LoR: 1 from my program director (awesome guy, publishing-machine), 1 from my research mentor (junior faculty, but well known in the brachy world), and 1 hopefully from a big name/program director on my away rotation.
Aways: Did an AI at my home institution, planning 3 aways (I feel like they're all reaches based on my stats, but they're not at any of the top 10 programs, haha).
"Extras": I've been told that I work hard, I'm very easy and fun to work with, and patients love me :cool:

So, I guess my questions are: 1) Do I have a chance? 2) If so, should I apply this cycle? or take a year off? and 3) Any suggestions for beefing up my application (if at all possible) before applying?

Thanks for your help!

I think you definitely have a chance. I'd apply this year, worst case you do a prelim year and reapply (Met at least a few people doing that this last year on the trail.)

As far as beefing up your app, like thesauce said, you've done everything right up to this point. All you really have left that you can effectively change are LORs and your away rotations. Its hard to give input on your away selection without knowing which schools you are considering, but its probably a good idea not to try for a "top 10." If you get some geographically diverse, appropriately competitive aways you should do well!

I think you'll match, but where would be kind of a question mark.
 
I've never understood the preemptive year off. I've seen a couple people burn themselves with that. If you're ok with a year off but would rather match, toss your hat in the ring with no backup specialty. If you don't match, there's your year off.

I think with your strong research and above average step 1 you'll likely get ~8-10 interviews. Magic number for most is 7. Apply everywhere and be personable. You're more than likely to get a spot.
 
I've never understood the preemptive year off. I've seen a couple people burn themselves with that. If you're ok with a year off but would rather match, toss your hat in the ring with no backup specialty. If you don't match, there's your year off.

I think with your strong research and above average step 1 you'll likely get ~8-10 interviews. Magic number for most is 7. Apply everywhere and be personable. You're more than likely to get a spot.

How did they burn themselves?
 
Hey everyone...I just wanted to share my stats and see if some of you veterans could provide some insight as far as if you think I'm a good candidate, how many interviews do you think I could get if I apply broadly, and what tier of schools would potentially be interested in me. I feel like my score will work in my favor, but I just don't know what to expect come interview time...especially cuz I don't have the high publication numbers that other applicants seem to have. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Step 1: 252
Med school: US, allopathic, ~Top 50-60 probably
Pre-clinical: 4-5 H's sprinkled in with the rest P's
Clinical: Honors in Medicine; high averages with good evals in all the others but didn't Honor because of shelf exams
AOA: Not AOA
Research: First author journal publication case report, working on 2 projects in the department right now, submitted an abstract to the breast cancer symposium, participated in a summer research program for med students at Sloan Kettering after 1st year
LoR: 1 from dept chair who is fairly big name, 1 from my research mentor at Sloan Kettering (I only worked with him for a summer but I figured having a letter from that institution would be good...right?), 1 from a jr faculty member who I've worked on most of my research with, 1 from either my home program director or 1 from an away
Aways: Planning 2. One scheduled at a mid tier place in a popular city. Waiting to hear back on another one from an upper/mid tier place in another big city.


THANKS!!!
 
I've never understood the preemptive year off. I've seen a couple people burn themselves with that. If you're ok with a year off but would rather match, toss your hat in the ring with no backup specialty. If you don't match, there's your year off.

I think with your strong research and above average step 1 you'll likely get ~8-10 interviews. Magic number for most is 7. Apply everywhere and be personable. You're more than likely to get a spot.
 
Hey everyone...I just wanted to share my stats and see if some of you veterans could provide some insight as far as if you think I'm a good candidate, how many interviews do you think I could get if I apply broadly, and what tier of schools would potentially be interested in me. I feel like my score will work in my favor, but I just don't know what to expect come interview time...especially cuz I don't have the high publication numbers that other applicants seem to have. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Step 1: 252
Med school: US, allopathic, ~Top 50-60 probably
Pre-clinical: 4-5 H's sprinkled in with the rest P's
Clinical: Honors in Medicine; high averages with good evals in all the others but didn't Honor because of shelf exams
AOA: Not AOA
Research: First author journal publication case report, working on 2 projects in the department right now, submitted an abstract to the breast cancer symposium, participated in a summer research program for med students at Sloan Kettering after 1st year
LoR: 1 from dept chair who is fairly big name, 1 from my research mentor at Sloan Kettering (I only worked with him for a summer but I figured having a letter from that institution would be good...right?), 1 from a jr faculty member who I've worked on most of my research with, 1 from either my home program director or 1 from an away
Aways: Planning 2. One scheduled at a mid tier place in a popular city. Waiting to hear back on another one from an upper/mid tier place in another big city.


THANKS!!!

You're in good shape
 
Yeah, I just feel like I'm in a weird transition zone in that, I don't know if I'll be able to have a wide selection of places that are interested in me (especially top tier places), or if I should set my sights on the middle tier types. I'm more interested in small, clinically based programs anyway, but I'd love to have some choices!
 
Yeah, I just feel like I'm in a weird transition zone in that, I don't know if I'll be able to have a wide selection of places that are interested in me (especially top tier places), or if I should set my sights on the middle tier types. I'm more interested in small, clinically based programs anyway, but I'd love to have some choices!

It is SO hard to predict, but based on your stats you'll probably have a good mix. Truth be told, with Rad Onc though you generally just apply to all of them except those you'd never go to and then if you get too many interviews to attend then you can start to have some choices!
 
.
 
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Yet another uncertain soon-to-be applicant. Any insight would be appreciated.

Step 1: 243
Med school: ~Top 50 or so
Pre-clinical: Mostly H's, 4 HP's
Clinical: Honors in everything (still waiting on medicine, but I expect an H based on my shelf score and evaluations)
AOA: Probably senior AOA (but it could go either way)
Research: PhD in cancer biology with 1 high-profile 1st author publication related to DNA repair, several co-author (2nd-3rd author) publications submitted, several first author reviews and book chapters, and should have two 1st author radonc specific papers (one clinical/outcomes, one physics/dosimetry) submitted within the next month. Presenting the clinical study at ASTRO. 4-5 other published abstracts at ASCO, SABCS, AACR. I also got a pre-doctoral breast cancer research fellowship from the Department of Defense.
LoR: Planning on one from my PhD mentor (pathologist, and director of our Cancer Center), one from a medical oncologist who gave me a superb review, one from the attending with whom I have done my clinical radonc research (and who did her fellowship at the place I would like to match), and one (hopefully) from a big name at one of my upcoming aways.
Aways: Two scheduled. One at a top tier program (where I would like to go), and one at a mid-upper tier program.

I know I'm good on research, but how much will a 243 on Step I hurt me? Step 2 is a week from today, and I understand that even a stellar score on that won't necessarily change my prospects. I'm shooting for a top tier program, and want to know if I even have a chance.

Thanks.

If you want to improve your chances, take a year (or two) off and get more pubs.
 
LOL. Yes, BRCA1, he's kidding...I hope

Actually, I'm applying this year and uh...well one less phd/aoa/240 applicant would help so um... I wasn't kidding, and my advice would technically improve his application.

:smuggrin:
 
I think you definitely have a chance. I'd apply this year, worst case you do a prelim year and reapply (Met at least a few people doing that this last year on the trail.)

As far as beefing up your app, like thesauce said, you've done everything right up to this point. All you really have left that you can effectively change are LORs and your away rotations. Its hard to give input on your away selection without knowing which schools you are considering, but its probably a good idea not to try for a "top 10." If you get some geographically diverse, appropriately competitive aways you should do well!

I think you'll match, but where would be kind of a question mark.

I chose to only do aways at programs that I would LOVE to go to. All 3 of them are easily top-mid tier, have several well-known faculty and are in locations where I have ties (2 west coast and 1 Midwest). I am hoping to get a letter from a big name from my first away rotation, but if that isn't possible, hopefully I will have a chance at either of the next 2. My only real concern with my away selection is that I didn't rotate at any "safety" programs... mainly because I don't feel like I would be "safe" applying to any programs with my stats.

I definitely don't want to limit myself geographically and would be extremely grateful and ecstatic to get into the field at all, but given the choice, would prefer to stay on the west coast or midwest area. Any chance of this happening? Or, should I stay the course, apply broadly and continue to hope for the best?

Thanks again for all of your help and advice!
 
I chose to only do aways at programs that I would LOVE to go to. All 3 of them are easily top-mid tier, have several well-known faculty and are in locations where I have ties (2 west coast and 1 Midwest). I am hoping to get a letter from a big name from my first away rotation, but if that isn't possible, hopefully I will have a chance at either of the next 2. My only real concern with my away selection is that I didn't rotate at any "safety" programs... mainly because I don't feel like I would be "safe" applying to any programs with my stats.

I definitely don't want to limit myself geographically and would be extremely grateful and ecstatic to get into the field at all, but given the choice, would prefer to stay on the west coast or midwest area. Any chance of this happening? Or, should I stay the course, apply broadly and continue to hope for the best?

Thanks again for all of your help and advice!

I'd stay the course and apply broadly! You have a wonderful chance to match in the midwest, and there are a lot of "under rated" programs there due to location that give a great education.

The west coast is a tough nut to crack. Some people I know did very well out there, and others struggled to get interviews. In the mean time I wouldn't get too hung up on the west coast. I'd do like most do these days, apply broadly and then if you have the "problem" of having too many interviews then you can start to exert your preferences :)
 
Hey Everyone!

I was wondering what your thoughts were on my chances.
Grades: All pass in first year (P/F)
Clinicals: No grades yet.
Step 1: 224
Step 2: hopefully will do significantly better

Medical school: Not top 50
I have some rad-onc related research, 1 ASTRO abstract (will turn into a paper), a couple of papers in unrelated medicine topics. I have been involved in the oncology club and built a relationship with rad-oncs in the area. I tend to get along with most people. I'm also a white female (which from what I've seen, is a minority in the field).

Essentially, I think that rad/onc is where I should be. WAMC for a low to mid tier program? Also, which programs would be considered low-tier to mid-tier for rad/onc (given that all are obviously competitive)?

I appreciate your input!
 
Hey Everyone!

I was wondering what your thoughts were on my chances.
Grades: All pass in first year (P/F)
Clinicals: No grades yet.
Step 1: 224
Step 2: hopefully will do significantly better

Medical school: Not top 50
I have some rad-onc related research, 1 ASTRO abstract (will turn into a paper), a couple of papers in unrelated medicine topics. I have been involved in the oncology club and built a relationship with rad-oncs in the area. I tend to get along with most people. I'm also a white female (which from what I've seen, is a minority in the field).

Essentially, I think that rad/onc is where I should be. WAMC for a low to mid tier program? Also, which programs would be considered low-tier to mid-tier for rad/onc (given that all are obviously competitive)?

I appreciate your input!


Your chances are 70.2% (the 95% CI is 0-100). Seriously though just apply, have a backup in mind because your stats are below average.
 
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Your chances are 36.2% (the 95% CI is 0-100). Seriously though just apply, have a backup in mind because your stats are below average.

For that joke you could have picked 70% chance, now they are just going to freak out that you picked such a low number :)
 
2 away and 1 home rotation is usually enough. I think you have a good chance as it stands... try to get involved in some radonc research if you can.
 
You're in good shape. Even in these competitive areas,there are quite a few mid-range programs. Plus you're a highly competitive candidate. I agree that two aways plus one rotation at your home program are plenty
 
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Hey everyone, I'd really appreciate any feedback.

D.O. student, early MS3
USMLE Step 1 = 261
Clinical: A's on the few rotations I've had so far (A/B/C/Fail system), grading seems generous enough to have mostly A's and some B's
Research:
-Non-Rad/Onc: 2nd author on abstract + presentation on one project, and one other project involving software analysis that didn't amount to anything
-Rad/Onc: Likely scenario is to end up with about 2 abstracts or case reports, likely none 1st author and none full articles
AOA: Yes-ish (SSP, D.O. equivalent)
ECs: Mild-moderate volunteering including founding+president of a non-Rad/Onc club. Worked library and freelanced Step 1 prep during school.
LoRs: No home institution. My non-Rad/Onc research mentor will write glowing, golden prose, and I'll get a great LOR from a Rad/Onc senior doc. All other LOR's are up in the air still, but I plan to do 3 Rad/Onc rotations total.
Extra: Worked a couple part-time jobs for a small period of time before med school, really into teaching (long history of tutoring/teaching, especially math). My age may bring my maturity into question, as it did when applying to medical school.

I'm worried my weak research and D.O status will necessitate a backup specialty -- I was thinking about applying to Rads too. I'm also looking to go to California, as hopeless as that may sound...what do you guys say?
 
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Hey everyone, I'd really appreciate any feedback.

D.O. student, early MS3
USMLE Step 1 = 261
Clinical: A's on the few rotations I've had so far (A/B/C/Fail system), grading seems generous enough to have mostly A's and some B's
Research:
-Non-Rad/Onc: 2nd author on abstract + presentation on one project, and one other project involving software analysis that didn't amount to anything
-Rad/Onc: Likely scenario is to end up with about 2 abstracts or case reports, likely none 1st author and none full articles
AOA: Yes-ish (SSP, D.O. equivalent)
ECs: Mild-moderate volunteering including founding+president of a non-Rad/Onc club. Worked library and freelanced Step 1 prep during school.
LoRs: No home institution. My non-Rad/Onc research mentor will write glowing, golden prose, and I'll get a great LOR from a Rad/Onc senior doc. All other LOR's are up in the air still, but I plan to do 3 Rad/Onc rotations total.
Extra: Worked a couple jobs before med school, really into teaching (heavy history of tutoring/teaching, especially math). My age may bring my maturity into question, as it did when applying to medical school.

I'm worried my weak research and D.O status will necessitate a backup specialty -- I was thinking about applying to Rads too. I'm also looking to go to California, as hopeless as that may sound...what do you guys say?

I think your research is fine. The problem with your app is the D.O. Try to do as many externships as you can.
 
I think your research is fine. The problem with your app is the D.O. Try to do as many externships as you can.

Thanks! I'll be able to get at least 3 total. I'd be curious to hear any anecdotes from D.O.'s here that have applied Rad/Onc or to hear about how many D.O.'s are in everyone's residency programs...
 
Ah, so good to be back in this thread on the other side of the application process. To everyone reading this: take a deep breath -- you'll be fine.

I'm not a DO, but I had the pleasure of running into a handful of DO students on the interview trail last year. Many of last year's applicants submitted their match info to a shared Google Doc (which you can find here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...UFl6anRWdWVmQ2N4WkhtZl85RUE&usp=sharing#gid=6). Just glancing at the places where people matched, I see that 3 students from osteopathic medical schools matched.

Now I wouldn't be surprised if there is *some* bias in favor of MD applicants but if this is what you want to do, go for it! You've got phenomenal board scores and grades. Just work on the research and picking up those oh-so-important letters of recommendation and you should be set.

Best of luck!
 
Ah, so good to be back in this thread on the other side of the application process. To everyone reading this: take a deep breath -- you'll be fine.

I'm not a DO, but I had the pleasure of running into a handful of DO students on the interview trail last year. Many of last year's applicants submitted their match info to a shared Google Doc (which you can find here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...UFl6anRWdWVmQ2N4WkhtZl85RUE&usp=sharing#gid=6). Just glancing at the places where people matched, I see that 3 students from osteopathic medical schools matched.

Now I wouldn't be surprised if there is *some* bias in favor of MD applicants but if this is what you want to do, go for it! You've got phenomenal board scores and grades. Just work on the research and picking up those oh-so-important letters of recommendation and you should be set.

Best of luck!

Congrats on your match, man.

That Google Doc is a fantastic resource, thank you! I appreciate the feedback and encouragement. I'll keep chugging along then.
 
Hello everyone. I humbly come to ask for your advice. I am an MD/PhD student, currently in my last year of the PhD, and only in the past year or so have I even become somewhat introduced to rad onc. I feel like I have finally found the field of medicine that I want to pursue, but am weary about my chances.

MD/PhD student, last year of PhD. Top 25 programs I think?
Step 1: 228 (eek, taken in 2010)
Pre-clincial grades: passes, an honor here or there, nothing special.
Research: getting my phd in engineering/robotics. My research focuses on the image-guided targeting of areas deep in the body for therapeutic delivery. When I started my project, there were no ties to the field of radiation oncology, but as I progressed I started to realize that this is very much in the vein of the field, and actually led to my interest in rad onc. I know this isn't typical physics/bio research, but would you still consider it rad onc-relevant research? Also, my lab is mostly pure engineering/robotics, and we mainly publish in technical engineering journals and conference papers. I'm not sure how well these translate into the clinical world. I have a couple first author, and a couple 2nd-middle author papers in these journals.

I've met some of the faculty in our department here, and have gotten to know some of the residents. I also did some shadowing of one of the docs for a period of time, which really confirmed for me my desire to pursue the clinical field. I really had no direction my first two years of med school, leading to my mediocre grades and scores, but I'm motivated now and want to improve in my remaining 3 years I have left. Mainly though, I'm worried if my step 1 score has shot myself in the foot, and if my several years of research in engineering have limited my relevancy to the field. Right now I'm focused on finishing my thesis work, but I might have some small amount of time to get involved in other things if they would make my application stronger.

Thanks.
 
My research focuses on the image-guided targeting of areas deep in the body for therapeutic delivery.

I would need to know some specifics about the research you're describing to determine its relevance to rad onc. What type of imaging and what treatment modality (radiation? chemo? surgery?).
 
I would need to know some specifics about the research you're describing to determine its relevance to rad onc. What type of imaging and what treatment modality (radiation? chemo? surgery?).

I will PM you with specific details. In short, it is analogous to brachytherapy.
 
I am starting to stumble into rad-onc and I am finding it very interesting. I have a problem that I like everything I do, but having spent some recent time shadowing in rad-onc, potentially I have found my desired speciality.

Step 1: 251
Step 2: taking early june
Did a PhD in 4 years in biochemistry, and 1 year post-doc fellowship in pediatric oncology
Med school: Osteopathic, live in Ohio where several of the programs historically take DOs
Pre-clinical: consistently in top 20%, my school is p/f and only gives marks for top percents
Clinical: 50% honors thusfar.
AOA: No AOA in the DO world, but SSP which is a crappy equivalent of AOA
Research: 10-11 publications. co-first author Nature chemical biology. 20+ talks/poster/presentations. Like any PhD, 3 unpublished manuscripts and 1 from post-doc. No rad-onc pubs, but 8 pubs from PhD, and 2 prospective publications during med school.
LoR: Don't know yet regarding radonc LOR, planning out 4rd year schedule for a few lors from Radonc. 2 LORs from program directors of surgery and family medicine, pretty big shots in our local community.
extracurriculars: few committee appointments on national committees in other medical specialities, actively involved with these
Aways: Planning 2, hopefully OSU/CCF.
 
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Hello All. I would love to hear your thoughts on my chances, my application is slightly different than others due to my previous focus on ophthalmology.


School: top 20
Step1: 250
Step 2 to be seen

Complete Pass fail school

Research: I am currently in my third year after taking a year off focused on ophthalmology research at the NIH. I now have 2 first author publications and 4 2nd author or beyond publications, along with >10 abstracts in ophtho/neuro research submitted since my undergraduate years. The only Onc related research i have is a review paper on chemobrain from my first year at medical school. I am working on a case report in my radonc department and trying to develop some potential projects. I do not know how successful they will be, worst case scenario I will work on a review paper just to have something out there.

I can understand how it is strange that I have spent a year off in one field and now would like to make the jump. How much did this time off hurt in that respect and what should my next steps be from here?

Thank you!
 
Hey all, long time lurker. First time post

School: top 25
Step1: 241
Step 2 deciding whether to take this in June or December

Preclinical: P/F
Clinical: Honors - Obgyn/Psych/Surg, High Pass - family med, Pass - Peds, Still need to take Neuro and Internal med

Doing two aways one east and one west coast plus home institution

Applying to 70+ schools.

Research:
completed: 1st abstract in rad onc, name on 2 friends posters and another friends abstract
working on: 1st rad onc paper, 2nd author abstract for ASTRO, 1st author education paper, 2nd optho paper waiting for revisions,

LoR: Research mentor, Psych Director, I will need to find another

extracurriculars: volunteer things, some leadership, several medical trips

Question: I want to do aways at opposite ends of country in big cities to keep every area open to apply. What schools would fit my profile? Some mentors say go HAM and apply to top 10 for away knowing if they say no now, I know before applying and some say not top 10 and pick something reasonable, but cant name places outside of top, that fit me.
how many aways do you think I should shoot out?

To Ldaizag: you have a lot of research and great score, your app is competitive, one paper in rad onc related area of even abstract to show that this new direction is real and then tie in why the switch in either personal statement or interview. Im also the one asking question so grain of salt.

To Petypet: your have a great application. tons of research and great score. I know alot of programs that love PhD to help with wet lab support and to keep them after residency. again coming from a third year lurker non PhD.
 
Disclaimer: I am only a MS4 who is currently applying for Rad Onc, but am currently sitting on double-digit (barely) interviews currently (of which the most recent Charting the Outcomes states I should match somewhere)

Petypet - I think being Osteopathic will hurt you somewhat, but Rad Onc spots have been taken by DOs in a couple programs in the NE/Midwest in recent years (can't speak for other geographical regions). Focus on getting 3-4 Rad Onc specific LoRs from the biggest name possible in a department (ask current residents when you interview who they would consider as 'big names'). If someone offers to write you a letter from a Rad Onc dept, take it; you can always decide not to use it later.

I think your research will help you, but most places want Rad Onc specific research, so I'd' do what I could to get an abstract/poster accepted (and hopefully published) by the time ERAS goes out. Speak to your local Rad Onc department (or one that's close by as you may not have a local department as a DO) if you can do a quick chart review in time to submit for ASTRO (deadline is end of Feb. for abstract), even if it's not first author. It'll be better if you do it with a researcher who is at a residency program.

Regarding aways: I can't speak for OSU, but I know CCF has 'big names' (Look for the two oldest attendings there, they are both editors for IJROBP IIRC) that people will know at least regionally, if not nationwide. I also think you would benefit from taking Step 2 earlier rather than later, but only if you could see yourself increasing your score by 10 points, ideally.

Ldiazag - If you are currently doing RO research, you will hopefully be able to piece together at least an abstract for ASTRO by February. Work hard for the next two months. I think having Ophtho research won't HURT you, but it likely won't help. However, I am speculating here pretty broadly; I'd ask a PD at your home program or closest geographical location for better info. This is out of your control, but I think the lack of Honors as a 3rd year is going to be detrimental for anyone who doesn't read your MSPE very closely (and they think you just passed all your clinical rotations).

I think your Step 1 is fine for a USMD student, and would only take Step 2 if you can get that 10 point bump I mentioned previously.

MedicineMan07 - I think you have a good baseline of research for the field. Focus on getting that ASTRO abstract and first-author manuscript at least submitted by the time ERAS rolls around. I would take Step 2 early if you feel like you could crack 250 on it.
Regarding aways: I'd recommend you apply broadly (even for aways) in the geographical locations you're interested in. California and NYC is hard unless you have very strong personal connections, so be wary of putting your eggs in those two baskets (unless you go to med school in the NE). Maybe pick 2-3 places in each geographical distribution you're shooting for and apply to those.

To all: I cannot understate the importance (at least IMO) of having all your LoRs (go for 4 if you can) 1) be from Attending Rad Oncs, preferably from academic institutions or residency programs, 2) Be from the biggest names possible, 3) Be as positive as possible. Sometimes you need to compromise between 2 and 3. I skipped a letter from a Chairman at my 'home' institution because I saw him maybe 3 times, and everytime he seemed to have forgotten that I was planning to apply to Rad Onc (as a MS4 doing a Rad Onc rotation in July). I went with the PD and an attending who point-blank offered to write me a letter (apparently a rare occurence).

Also, I would highly recommend you all apply to every program. There are some programs that I applied to that I am surprised I got interviews at, but you never know when a PD will recognize one of your LoR writers, or connect with your research, or any other multitude of events.

I know this is a lot and not very personalized information. I also know that I will be a more valuable source of information in 3 months come match day, but if any of you have further questions, feel free to PM me.
 
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