"Help me decide" mega thread

[psych.meout]

I am pursuing a career in clinical neuropsychology. I recently gained acceptance into two clinical psychology PhD programs. The first is a joint-degree PhD program in behavioral neuroscience and clinical psychology. The second is a general PhD program in clinical psychology, but with a module in neuropsychology. The research between the two programs is very similar, so now I am perplexed as to which program I should attend. How necessary is the neuropsychology module for getting an internship in neuropsychology? Would receiving dual training in behavioral neuroscience and clinical psychology provide the same prestige (or more? less?) than a neuropsychology module?

You need to look at more than just what is in the branding of these programs.

What neuropsychology-related coursework do they offer, e.g. functional neuroanatomy, psychopharmacology, behavioral genetics, etc?

What are the opportunities like to produce neuropsych-related research? Is your mentor a productive researcher in neuropsychology or related field? If not, is there a way to collaborate with other faculty who do this kind of research and to incorporate your mentor's interests in with neuropsychology? E.g. Your mentor is a health psychology/behavioral medicine researcher and you can research neuropsychological sequelae of obesity, CVD, etc.?

What are the clinical opportunities like for practica? is there an in-house clinic for training and does it offer opportunities for neuropsych assessment? Are there neuropsych-focused external practica associated with the programs? If so, what kind are they (e.g. private practice vs. AMC vs. VA vs. forensic hospital OR rehab vs. inpatient vs. outpatient vs.), what populations do they serve (e.g. peds/adults vs. community vs. vets vs. forensic populations), and what kinds of issues would you gain experience in (e.g. TBI vs. dementia vs. neurological disease/degeneration vs. epilepsy and surgical evals)?

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[PsychFL91]

I just received my 3rd admissions offers a couple hours ago, so obviously I would like to get rid of one of them as soon as possible. I just would really appreciate everyone's input first.

The three programs I have offers from are Palo Alto University (PhD), Widener University (PsyD) and Florida Institute of Technology (PsyD).

I'm interested in neuropsychology and all three have neuro opportunities through tracks/coursework, research and practicums. I'd say right now FIT is the program I'm leaning towards the most, but I'd love to hear more about how everyone feels about the programs in regards to neuro training. Widener also has a captive internship, which I was originally excited about, but I've heard mixed things about captive internships in general recently.

I know cost always comes up when talking about unfunded/semi-funded programs (for good reason), but I am incredibly fortunate that I will not have to take out loans to afford school, so I am mostly concerned about quality of training.


Also to save everyone some googling, here are the outcomes for all of the programs:

https://www.paloaltou.edu/graduate-...gy/student-admissions-outcomes-and-other-data

http://www.widener.edu/academics/schools/shsp/psyd/studentadmissionsandotherdata.aspx

http://cpla.fit.edu/clinical/outcomes.php

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Just a reminder...tracks/modules/ concentrations....that's mostly marketing jargon. You need a program that provides solid foundational knowledge as a clinical/counseling psychologist and also have access to classroom, practica, and direct mentorship in the speciality area. Board certified mentors and a track record of placing students into quality fellowships and then having grads get boarded...that should be the bar.

 

[lightwater]

Hi everyone, I would appreciate advice on a couple things. I'm interested in neuropsych. I was accepted into a clinical psych PhD program that does not have a neuropsych track (which I realize through reading many SDN threads is not a deal breaker!). For anonymity I'd rather not say the school.

• So I looked at the specific courses to see whether I would have the "foundation" at least to prepare me to apply to neuropsych externships and internships down the line. These seem to be the relevant courses at the school: Biological Bases of Behavior, Cognitive Testing, Behavioral Pharmacology & Psychopharmacology, Behavioral Medicine, Neuropsych Assessment. Does this seem sufficient, or lacking? There is no "functional neuroanatomy" which seems to be needed? I have taken Neurobiology in the past, though I'm not sure that would be enough.
• I have had experience with neuropsych assessments in the past, as well as fMRI, but again, I don't know if pre-doctoral RA work would seriously be considered for internship apps? (Though I do have a few 1st author posters/pubs from this work) I will most likely be able to have my masters/disseration include neuropsych/cog testing, but not fMRI, with my POI.
• There are no outcomes data for this school yet-- the program is only a few years old and is in the process of becoming APA accredited. During interview days, they emphasized they were active in the APA accred process, and one of the main faculty works for the APA and his job is to survey other schools for accreditation. He has gone through this with another school before. School has a decent number of FT faculty (around 10 or more) who have all come from APA accred institutions, and many have externally funded grants including NIH.

My boss is a director of several divisions at an R1 university, and she advised me to accept the offer if I do not hear positive news from other programs. She assumes the school will be accredited by the time I apply for internship. In case it's relevant, said school is a medium-sized, public university that has seen a lot of growth in the past decade or so. I'm seriously considering this because, for a variety of reasons, I am not excited about the other schools. Well, I am anxious about just one other school, but I have been waitlisted there and am not hopeful about it (when I followed up for status, adcom encouraged me to take my other offer given long waitlist... I reiterated my strong interest and said I'd wait).

If the mentioned program is my only choice, does it seem like it could be a decent/good fit for a neuropsych career? Or should I apply for a 2nd cycle and take the risk? (not preferred) Thank you in advance!!

 

[psych.meout]

Hi everyone, I would appreciate advice on a couple things. I'm interested in neuropsych. I was accepted into a clinical psych PhD program that does not have a neuropsych track (which I realize through reading many SDN threads is not a deal breaker!). For anonymity I'd rather not say the school.

• So I looked at the specific courses to see whether I would have the "foundation" at least to prepare me to apply to neuropsych externships and internships down the line. These seem to be the relevant courses at the school: Biological Bases of Behavior, Cognitive Testing, Behavioral Pharmacology & Psychopharmacology, Behavioral Medicine, Neuropsych Assessment. Does this seem sufficient, or lacking? There is no "functional neuroanatomy" which seems to be needed? I have taken Neurobiology in the past, though I'm not sure that would be enough.
• I have had experience with neuropsych assessments in the past, as well as fMRI, but again, I don't know if pre-doctoral RA work would seriously be considered for internship apps? (Though I do have a few 1st author posters/pubs from this work) I will most likely be able to have my masters/disseration include neuropsych/cog testing, but not fMRI, with my POI.
• There are no outcomes data for this school yet-- the program is only a few years old and is in the process of becoming APA accredited. During interview days, they emphasized they were active in the APA accred process, and one of the main faculty works for the APA and his job is to survey other schools for accreditation. He has gone through this with another school before. School has a decent number of FT faculty (around 10 or more) who have all come from APA accred institutions, and many have externally funded grants including NIH.

My boss is a director of several divisions at an R1 university, and she advised me to accept the offer if I do not hear positive news from other programs. She assumes the school will be accredited by the time I apply for internship. In case it's relevant, said school is a medium-sized, public university that has seen a lot of growth in the past decade or so. I'm seriously considering this because, for a variety of reasons, I am not excited about the other schools. Well, I am anxious about just one other school, but I have been waitlisted there and am not hopeful about it (when I followed up for status, adcom encouraged me to take my other offer given long waitlist... I reiterated my strong interest and said I'd wait).

If the mentioned program is my only choice, does it seem like it could be a decent/good fit for a neuropsych career? Or should I apply for a 2nd cycle and take the risk? (not preferred) Thank you in advance!!

1. Are you talking about counting your RA work before grad school on your hours for internship applications? If so, that's a no-go. If you're talking about it in terms of research, then it will only help if the they are quality pubs in good journals (e.g. no vanity press).

2. What's the funding like? I'd be pretty wary about attending any programs that aren't fully funded, let alone ones that aren't yet accredited.

3. The coursework sounds good, but what kinds of clinical practica do they offer? Are there any good neuropsych assessment sites?

 

[lightwater]

1. Are you talking about counting your RA work before grad school on your hours for internship applications? If so, that's a no-go. If you're talking about it in terms of research, then it will only help if the they are quality pubs in good journals (e.g. no vanity press).

2. What's the funding like? I'd be pretty wary about attending any programs that aren't fully funded, let alone ones that aren't yet accredited.

3. The coursework sounds good, but what kinds of clinical practica do they offer? Are there any good neuropsych assessment sites?

Thanks for the response!
1. In terms of research experience, not hours. The pubs are in peer-reviewed journals that I have been told are moderately competitive to competitive. (I was lucky to work at an academic medical center that had way more existing data than they knew what to do with, so they were happy to have someone do something with it.)

2. It's not fully funded. I agree it's definitely not ideal, but it's also not my biggest concern as there are guaranteed fellowships and potential grants. I have money saved, have never taken out loans/had debt, so I'm okay with very minimal loans if need be. Cost of living is not high in the area. I also have an amazing partner whose career is financially (much) more attractive than what mine will be for the next five years!

3. They have an on-campus clinic and they are affiliated with a couple hospitals. Students will start seeing people Year 2. I don't know much other than that. I suppose I should ask the DCT more specifically about neuropsych sites.. I googled its nearby city and there are definitely neuropsych externships available for doctoral students, if I'm fortunate enough to get one.

 

[psych.meout]

Thanks for the response!
1. In terms of research experience, not hours. The pubs are in peer-reviewed journals that I have been told are moderately competitive to competitive. (I was lucky to work at an academic medical center that had way more existing data than they knew what to do with, so they were happy to have someone do something with it.)

Sounds good to me!

2. It's not fully funded. I agree it's definitely not ideal, but it's also not my biggest concern as there are guaranteed fellowships and potential grants. I have money saved, have never taken out loans/had debt, so I'm okay with very minimal loans if need be. Cost of living is not high in the area. I also have an amazing partner whose career is financially (much) more attractive than what mine will be for the next five years!

Ok, but I personally would find the lack of full-funding plus a pending accreditation to be untenable for a program.

3. They have an on-campus clinic and they are affiliated with a couple hospitals. Students will start seeing people Year 2. I don't know much other than that. I suppose I should ask the DCT more specifically about neuropsych sites.. I googled its nearby city and there are definitely neuropsych externships available for doctoral students, if I'm fortunate enough to get one.

But there's a difference between externships being available to grad students in general and you being able to get them in that specific program. It's difficult to tell with you playing coy about which exact program you're alluding to, but being such a new program means that it likely doesn't have the long-term established relationships and history to demonstrate with much certainty where exactly students will go for externships.

We also don't know what the situation in that area is like. In some places, there are not many grad programs available, so there isn't much inter-program competition for these spots. In those cases, there often isn't much of an application, interviewing, and/or matching process. For others, there are multiple programs in the area, which makes competition much fiercer. This latter case might put you at somewhat of a disadvantage being in the program so early in its development and before it's fully accredited.

This is not to say that the program is bad one, just that it's somewhat of a gamble at this point. Yes, every program goes through this as it's getting its initial accreditation, but it's just not a position I would put myself in when there are so many other programs out there with established track records. I guess I'm just more risk averse and don't want to bet my money and future on anything but a sure thing.

 

[psy young]

Hi Everyone! At the moment I'm torn between two PsyD programs and would love your input!

The two programs are the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium and Loyola University Maryland.

I'm well aware of the financial benefits of going to Loyola over PGSP-Stanford, so I'm looking for more information about clinical training, how happy students and alum are, reputation of the program in terms of the likelihood of being competitive in the job market after post doc, any big red flags I missed on interview day (minus high costs of tuition and living) etc.

Thank you!

 

[WisNeuro]

Also, I see various comments about the Psy.D.'s reputation, but was curious as to whether anyone knows about the Ph.D.'s current reputation. From what I've gathered, it has a better rep than the Psy.D. program, but I want to know if attending the Ph.D. program at NSU will hurt my chances of obtaining an APA accredited internship and my likelihood of being employed in the future. There are several well-known professors at NSU and I am wondering why it is continuously bashed online.

It's not terrible, but it's not great. Biggest problem really is, in certain areas, all of the students apply to the same places for internship. We get those apps, and the letter writers essentially write form letters that are almost the exact same for every student, hence, we really have no way of differentiating them out at times since the letters and curriculum are essentially identical. I've been out of the region for a few years, so I'm not sure if it's still the case, but it used to be.

 

[psych.meout]

Hi all,

I was recently admitted to Nova Southeastern University's Ph.D. program which I was very excited about as my mentor's research is a perfect match to my own, and the program's curriculum and clinical focus directly align with my career goals. However, after reading forums on this website I am a bit disheartened.

The financial burden that comes along with this program isn't a major concern for me, but I am worried about the internship match rate. This year and last year, NSU's Ph.D. students have had 100% APA-accredited match rate- however 2015 was 89%, 2014 57%, 2013 53%, and 2012 70%. Should I be worried about these numbers?

Well, you might want to find out about these specific years. Obviously, 100% match is great and 89% is not terrible at all, so it would behoove you to ask them what between those years and the previous ones where the match wasn't significantly lower. Did they bring online a captive internship program? Did they substantially change something about their program, e.g. courses, practica, what student are admitted, etc?

It would be good to see whether the recent good stats for the past two years are part of a trend that will continue for the future or if they were flukes and the match rate will regress to the mean match rate of 50-60% that they had for four of the reported seven years.

Also, I see various comments about the Psy.D.'s reputation, but was curious as to whether anyone knows about the Ph.D.'s current reputation. From what I've gathered, it has a better rep than the Psy.D. program, but I want to know if attending the Ph.D. program at NSU will hurt my chances of obtaining an APA accredited internship and my likelihood of being employed in the future. There are several well-known professors at NSU and I am wondering why it is continuously bashed online.

Having well-known faculty isn't necessarily indicate of a great program. Sure, they are often indicative of the quality of a program, but when other, more quantitative data is not commensurate with the qualitative aspect of having famous faculty, it should make you curious about why this discrepancy exists. Is this a mentor model program or is it more of a general admission-style program like some PsyD programs with large cohorts tend to be? Are these famous professors actually taking students as advisees or are they more like emeritus faculty that are being paid to be on staff to bring in that cache from their name recognition? Are these famous faculty actually productive and have substantial ongoing research projects or are they more established and tenured, possibly at the end of their careers where they don't care all that much about producing the kinds of research any advisees might need to be competitive for internship and post-doc?

Overall, I've been told that "fit" with a program is the most important factor in making a decision- and if that's the case, NSU is the perfect fit and is the school for me. I know every program has its pros and cons, but do you think these red flags can be overshadowed by my great fit with the program and opportunity to work alongside mentors with my exact research interests? Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated- I want to be confident in my decision before making this 5-6 year commitment.

Again, ask questions about the possible trending of the match rates and any recent changes that have been made to the program. Ask for more hard data, like how many publications and posters students are getting before applying to internship. Ask about the practica opportunities and how successful students are at getting the better sites, especially compared to competing programs in the area. Ask about the outcomes for your particular POI to see whether the outcomes are heterogeneous and vary more between faculty members.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

You have to take the good with the bad when considering NSU. Solid training is available, but it is far from guaranteed. Some of the classes are great, others are meh. The well known professors are active and take students, but you still need to fight over resources and time. Practica placement is a crapshoot. They have a good Uni-based clinic (one of the largest providers of affordable mental health in S Fl), but some of the off-site placements are a crapshoot. If you land at Jackson Memorial you can get great training, but you can also land at a meh clinic. Generally the top students do well and the bottom students probably should have been cut. I typically tell students it isn't worth the high cost unless the funding has drastically improved.

 

[psych.meout]

You have to take the good with the bad when considering NSU. Solid training is available, but it is far from guaranteed. Some of the classes are great, others are meh. The well known professors are active and take students, but you still need to fight over resources and time. Practica placement is a crapshoot. They have a good Uni-based clinic (one of the largest providers of affordable mental health in S Fl), but some of the off-site placements are a crapshoot. If you land at Jackson Memorial you can get great training, but you can also land at a meh clinic. Generally the top students do well and the bottom students probably should have been cut. I typically tell students it isn't worth the high cost unless the funding has drastically improved.

This seems to be a pattern with these unfunded or partially funded accredited programs. It's not that they never produce great graduates or that good training is impossible. The issue is that it's wholly inconsistent, so you can't really rely on simply being a graduate of the program to establish that you received quality training. You'll basically have to prove that you were well-trained, whereas the quality is more assumed of grads from quality programs that are well-respected and consistently produce great psychologists.

 

[psych.meout]

Thank you for the advice! These are definitely important factors to consider... I did ask several of these questions during my interview day, but I am worried that I got a biased opinion by asking the faculty and students themselves.

Would you recommend that I contact the admissions office or my POI (or both) to answer these questions?

I don't know if the admissions office would really know those program details. You could maybe ask again or ask someone different, but be a bit more direct or "forceful" about it now that you actually received an offer from them, though I don't know if you'd receive any different answers from what you already received from anyone in the department.

Pay attention to the way they answered or will answer these questions as well. If they are at all evasive, hedging, deflect with other program strengths, or otherwise don't give you straight answers to your questions, I would probably take that as a warning sign.

E.g. I've mentioned this elsewhere on the forums, but a person I know interviewed for a clinical program several years ago and the response from the DCT to questions about funding was to hem and haw about it evasively and ultimately ending the topic by saying, "Well, no one has ever had to drop out because they couldn't pay." Look for similar, though less absurd, versions of this kind of thing.

Understandable. I definitely do not have the mindset of relying on this (or any) program to produce me into a well-trained clinician and researcher- I know that the work that I put in is what I will get out, and I am ready for that commitment. I'm happy to hear that there is possibility for great graduates and good training even if it is inconsistent.

But see, it's kind of like the lottery. Is it possible that you could receive good training in this program and be competitive for the future? Sure, and it's possible to win the lottery, but what is the probability of this actually happening? If the recent good match rates, 89% and 100%, are flukes and the more typical outcome is 50-60% match, then I would not really take for granted that I would definitely receive the training necessary to match me with an internship. At that point, a 50-60% match rate is an unacceptable crapshoot and I'm risk averse enough and skeptical enough to avoid this, especially as there are so many other variables that would be out of my control regardless fo how hard I worked or how talented I was, e.g. the program's reputation, the availability of quality external practica, etc.

 

[thedoobz]

Hi everyone!

I just had a hell of a day and got 2 over the phone acceptances; one for University of Denver PsyD, and the other from PGSP-Stanford PsyD. Hopefully somebody can help me out in terms of deciding the best fit for me. I applied exclusively to PsyD programs and am confident it is the correct degree for me. I am blessed financially and paying for either program will not be a problem. What is a problem is that I loved both programs for different reasons. Both have really good APA internship match rates, good attrition, and a good reputation in my opinion. Here are some differences...

PGSP-Stanford:
Comes with the Stanford name, swanky area, full year to focus on classes before placement. Beautiful weather and nice/very smart people. When they called they said they voted unanimously to let me in so that was flattering. Felt like a more relaxed pace, sort of coddling in that way?

Denver:
LOVED the area, more affordable due to cost of living and program cost itself, felt better "vibes" from students and professors. Worried accelerated pace and immediate placement is going to stress me out.

Has anyone had to choose between these schools? I'm a residential counselor living in Boston right now working at McLean hospital and if I'm gonna make the move, I really want it to be to the school that's the best fit for me.

Thanks!

 

[psych.meout]

Hi everyone!

I just had a hell of a day and got 2 over the phone acceptances; one for University of Denver PsyD, and the other from PGSP-Stanford PsyD. Hopefully somebody can help me out in terms of deciding the best fit for me. I applied exclusively to PsyD programs and am confident it is the correct degree for me. I am blessed financially and paying for either program will not be a problem. What is a problem is that I loved both programs for different reasons. Both have really good APA internship match rates, good attrition, and a good reputation in my opinion. Here are some differences...

PGSP-Stanford:
Comes with the Stanford name, swanky area, full year to focus on classes before placement. Beautiful weather and nice/very smart people. When they called they said they voted unanimously to let me in so that was flattering. Felt like a more relaxed pace, sort of coddling in that way?

Denver:
LOVED the area, more affordable due to cost of living and program cost itself, felt better "vibes" from students and professors. Worried accelerated pace and immediate placement is going to stress me out.

Has anyone had to choose between these schools? I'm a residential counselor living in Boston right now working at McLean hospital and if I'm gonna make the move, I really want it to be to the school that's the best fit for me.

Thanks!

Wasn't that the point? Didn't the PsyD program pay Stanford a huge chunk of money for the cache of being associated with Stanford, i.e. to convince (trick?) applicants and students that it had the rigor of Stanford?

 

[singasongofjoy]

Hi everyone!

I just had a hell of a day and got 2 over the phone acceptances; one for University of Denver PsyD, and the other from PGSP-Stanford PsyD. Hopefully somebody can help me out in terms of deciding the best fit for me. I applied exclusively to PsyD programs and am confident it is the correct degree for me. I am blessed financially and paying for either program will not be a problem. What is a problem is that I loved both programs for different reasons. Both have really good APA internship match rates, good attrition, and a good reputation in my opinion. Here are some differences...

PGSP-Stanford:
Comes with the Stanford name, swanky area, full year to focus on classes before placement. Beautiful weather and nice/very smart people. When they called they said they voted unanimously to let me in so that was flattering. Felt like a more relaxed pace, sort of coddling in that way?

Denver:
LOVED the area, more affordable due to cost of living and program cost itself, felt better "vibes" from students and professors. Worried accelerated pace and immediate placement is going to stress me out.

Has anyone had to choose between these schools? I'm a residential counselor living in Boston right now working at McLean hospital and if I'm gonna make the move, I really want it to be to the school that's the best fit for me.

Thanks!

Based solely on what you've said above, Denver would be an easy decision for me. You want to go to a program that is both rigorous and also where the people (students AND faculty) seem relatively happy and well-adjusted (that "good vibe" you referred to). Yes, seeing clients the first year will be stressful. But starting to see them in second year would probably be just as stressful too; you're always going to have that initial "omg, what am I doing?" feeling and the classes you take first year (at least in my program) are the general foundational ones (e.g., stats) that aren't as immediately clinically applicable (though idk, maybe it's different at that program at you take classes on cbt/therapy during first year). As long as you've got good supervision and appropriate cases, which you should if you go there, then you might as well just go ahead and jump in feet first. You'll find your footing and ultimately get more hours of clinical training. And I think the general vibe from current students and staff is huge. Plus, personally, flattery makes me suspicious, but maybe I'm just a cynical person

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Don't get swayed by a name, take a close look at the training programs, mentors, types of practica, and where their students land after training (including internship & post-doc, not just jobs).

 

[Honor20]

Hey guys, I am a first time user deciding between two schools. This can be summed up quickly: One school is a phd program at a private university, so it is roughly 1450 per credit hour with about half tuition remission. The other is a public university, with full funding. The problem is that the private school feels like a better overall fit, but would obviously require me to accumulate debt. Do people typically turn down a funded offer?

 

[WisNeuro]

Hey guys, I am a first time user deciding between two schools. This can be summed up quickly: One school is a phd program at a private university, so it is roughly 1450 per credit hour with about half tuition remission. The other is a public university, with full funding. The problem is that the private school feels like a better overall fit, but would obviously require me to accumulate debt. Do people typically turn down a funded offer?

I'd want to see the stats of the two schools (APA-accredited match rate, EPPP pass rate, etc) before making a decision. But, I'd personally lean towards the full funding.

 

[HMarie]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

 

[singasongofjoy]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

I'm not familiar w the stats for those programs but you said they're pretty equivalent. So assuming they are decent stats / outcomes data and all else being equal ( including how happy the current students seem there overall) I'd go with the option that incurs the least amount of debt (don't forget to count cost of living).

 

[wtfook]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

Xavier is near Cincinnati and La Salle is near Philly. It looks like tuition is about the same so it might come down to cost of living. I don't know what cost of living is like in Cincinnati but Philly is a relatively affordable city compared to NYC and DC but can still be expensive compared to the midwest. The midwest gets a lot more snow than the east coast. As someone who has gone to school in both regions, I prefer the east coast. There's more to do, weather is generally nicer, and there are overall more opportunities both personally and professionally. HOWEVER, that is me. The midwest has a vibe that can be very appealing to other people. It's more laid back. People might be more personable up front. Some people freakin' love winter so they'll prefer Ohio. Xavier's class sizes appear to be slightly smaller, which could be a plus. Philly is also a saturated region so it might be harder to get a good practicum and externship compared to Cincinnati. Those are just some factors that come to mind. Let me know if you have more questions about Philly.

 

[WisNeuro]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

Cost would be part of my consideration. But other than that, if neuropsych is your goal, I'd be looking for a place that I could do a high quality original data dissertation in neuropsychology, and a place that has external practicum for neuropsych at high quality sites. That's what will make you competitive for neuro focused internships and postdocs that adhere to HCG.

 

[jmiah717]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

If CBT is one of your goals and you have the chance to live and study in Philly, I'd take it. The Beck Institute is in Philly and you can't get much better training opportunities than learning CBT from the creators of the therapy. I can vouch for the learning experience there. Philly also has a plethora of hospitals, universities, and other opportunities for internships, etc. So while it may be saturated, it also has a lot of opportunity in general. I'm not sure I agree with it being affordable though. It really depends on where you live in the area. Nicer/safer area usually means more expensive, as it does in most places. I would guess Cincinnati would not be much different though. Congrats on the acceptance.

 

[wtfook]

If CBT is one of your goals and you have the chance to live and study in Philly, I'd take it. The Beck Institute is in Philly and you can't get much better training opportunities than learning CBT from the creators of the therapy. I can vouch for the learning experience there. Philly also has a plethora of hospitals, universities, and other opportunities for internships, etc. So while it may be saturated, it also has a lot of opportunity in general. I'm not sure I agree with it being affordable though. It really depends on where you live in the area. Nicer/safer area usually means more expensive, as it does in most places. I would guess Cincinnati would not be much different though. Congrats on the acceptance.

Well I said it's "affordable compared to NYC or DC but still expensive compared to the mid west." You can get rent at around 900 a month if you have a roommate. I got less in Center City (without utilities) from rooming with someone. That's WAY better than NYC where anywhere you go you'll be paying at least 1200 a month. But I'm guessing might still be expensive for Cincinnati? Dunno. You made a good point about the Beck Institute though. If CBT is the goal, you can't get better than Beck.

 

[jmiah717]

Well I said it's "affordable compared to NYC or DC but still expensive compared to the mid west." You can get rent at around 900 a month if you have a roommate. I got less in Center City (without utilities) from rooming with someone. That's WAY better than NYC where anywhere you go you'll be paying at least 1200 a month. But I'm guessing might still be expensive for Cincinnati? Dunno. You made a good point about the Beck Institute though. If CBT is the goal, you can't get better than Beck.

Even going to Cincinnati, Beck isn't too far away for training conferences and they take a lot of them on the road now too. I'd just keep an eye out for those if CBT is your interest. I've found them invaluable and motivating.

 

[WisNeuro]

If they want to do neuropsych, I'd focus on that instead. It's a lot easier to get foundational training in CBT most places than to get in depth neuro training. And, in the vast majority of careers, neuro will be the bulk of your workload, not the other way around. If you want to do neuro assessment anyway.

 

[_Sunny]

Hey, I'm in a similar boat as HMarie, only it's La Salle vs. Widener. The schools are comparable in terms of location (both in the Philly area) and are similar in price (although Widener is a bit more expensive). Would love to hear advice, particularly from folks who have experience with either program. I'm aware of the outcomes/stats of each school, so I would prefer advise that's beyond what's on the website.

 

[WisNeuro]

Depends on what your career goals are.

 

[_Sunny]

Depends on what your career goals are.

I'm interested in child psych, and would like to eventually work in a clinic or integrated hospital setting. I know that may be a little vague - let me know if there's anything specific that'd be helpful for you to know about my goals.

 

[1101psych]

I'm deciding between University of Denver and Roosevelt for my PsyD. While I know there is a big difference in price, I am trying to make my decision based on all other factors.

Any initial thoughts on which program to choose? From the interview day, Roosevelt seems like a more rigorous program, but I love the city of Denver so much. Other thoughts: Roosevelt's program is small, which is nice for faculty/student relationships, but perhaps not the best in terms of making new friends. Thoughts?

 

[pediatric_psydoc]

I'm deciding between University of Denver and Roosevelt for my PsyD. While I know there is a big difference in price, I am trying to make my decision based on all other factors.

Any initial thoughts on which program to choose? From the interview day, Roosevelt seems like a more rigorous program, but I love the city of Denver so much. Other thoughts: Roosevelt's program is small, which is nice for faculty/student relationships, but perhaps not the best in terms of making new friends. Thoughts?

Check on APA match rates for the two programs. Find out if they have the type of practicum experiences you're looking for that are congruent with your goals.

I personally wouldn't rely much on what city I like better. It's grad school and you will be busy. Look at cost of living though as a factor.


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[singasongofjoy]

I'm deciding between University of Denver and Roosevelt for my PsyD. While I know there is a big difference in price, I am trying to make my decision based on all other factors.

Any initial thoughts on which program to choose? From the interview day, Roosevelt seems like a more rigorous program, but I love the city of Denver so much. Other thoughts: Roosevelt's program is small, which is nice for faculty/student relationships, but perhaps not the best in terms of making new friends. Thoughts?

I second the above poster re: don't think about city. You'll be so busy it doesn't matter one bit (I mean, unless you're going to Alaska and then the whole not seeing the sun for months thing...) I went to school in a city that really does NOT suit me, but still didn't matter because I had such little free time that there was always something fun to do (and the low cost of living was a bonus). Spent all my time on campus/practicum or holed up in coffee shops with other grad students writing papers. You can do that in any city. Go for quality of training / experience. Shoot for cities you like to live in for postdoc.

 

[singasongofjoy]

.

 

[LMA882]

Hello everyone,

It may already be evident by the title of the thread, but I need help deciding between two PhD programs - Yeshiva & Adelphi.

I'm not really sure if one is better than the other, and after factoring in the scholarships I was offered, the cost isn't much different either. According to one member here, out of all the New York schools, only Fordham produces good psychologists anyway.

I heard Yeshiva students potentially fair better on externships and internships because they are taught CBT and have exposure to other modalities while Adelphi students are mainly limited to the psychodynamic approach.

Anyway, what do you guys think?

 

[singasongofjoy]

Hello everyone,

It may already be evident by the title of the thread, but I need help deciding between two PhD programs - Yeshiva & Adelphi.

I'm not really sure if one is better than the other, and after factoring in the scholarships I was offered, the cost isn't much different either. According to one member here, out of all the New York schools, only Fordham produces good psychologists anyway.

I heard Yeshiva students potentially fair better on externships and internships because they are taught CBT and have exposure to other modalities while Adelphi students are mainly limited to the psychodynamic approach.

Anyway, what do you guys think?

I can't speak much to either of these programs but I think a program that gives you exposure to a broader array of modalities as well as CBT training may allow you more flexibility in the future, especially geographically. Consider also the population you think you might be most interested in working with. For example, you won't be doing any serious psychodynamic sessions with someone with developmental disability, but CBT is v. applicable. That'd be my choice if I were deciding between the two based on those factors but I'm decidedly not psychodynamic in orientation.

 

[LMA882]

So a quick background:
Standing: 5th year undergrad
Double Major: Psychology and Child & Adolescent Development
GPA: 3.9 psych; 3.6 overall (expect to have up to a 3.7 if I continue to get straight A's for the next two semesters)
Research experience: I'm currently in two research labs (a clinical child lab focused on parenting and at-risk populations, and a 30-year longitudinal study lab), each with multiple faculty directors. I have incurred 5 months in each lab as of now, and am currently working on my own scholarly project to submit to multiple upcoming conferences.
Clinical experience: I've worked as a clinical associate at a children's hospital for a year and a half, a semester-long internship at a non-profit organization working with at-risk children and families, and have additional experience working with children in an educational setting as a preschool teacher for 2 years. I'll also complete a 120-hour internship next semester in a yet-to-be-determined location, but closely related to my interests. (which brings me to...)
Interests: Clinical child, child maltreatment, child trauma
Goal: Ph.D. Clinical Child in a balanced program

Whew. Mouthfull.

Now onto my question.

As I mentioned, I'm an RA in two different research labs. One is run by 4 research psychologists who have been researching for their entire careers, and are not clinically oriented (one is clinical but has only ever done research). The other is run by two clinical psychologists, one licensed, and is completely clinically oriented. We do neuropsychological assessments and collect physiological data, etc. The latter is definitely more my style, but the former is really great experience because they consistently get published.

When I talk to my advisers in each lab, they tell me I should be doing different things. One (research guy) strongly urges me to get my masters degree in order to obtain more research experience and says that I will not be accepted to any doctoral programs unless I do so. The other (clinical guy) says that I can take a year off after I finish my bachelors to continue researching without having to worry about the coursework of a masters program. He also says that some phd programs may look at a masters as a negative point on my application because they want to train their students the way they want to train them without having to undo someone else's training.

The year-off option sounds most appealing to me for many reasons, but I also feel that my interests more closely align with the professor who gave me that advice. On the other hand, the research guy has produced many students who were accepted to phd programs so I don't feel that his advice should be understated. However, when I told him that I was thinking of going the year-off route he told me I was making a HUGE mistake and that I will be throwing my chances away (yikes!) But the year-off option just sounds so nice! I'll be able to focus on researching and hopefully getting a couple co-authorships, and I'll be able to apply to phd programs without the stress of class. I'm also nowhere near ready for the GRE which is required for application to the masters program, and in addition, most of the phd programs I'm interested in report masters-holding students as the vast minority of accepted applicants.

But again, I don't think research guy's advice should be completely overlooked.

halp.

I did a Masters before getting into a PhD program and I kind of wish I didn't. I think taking a year in between to study for the GRE and do more research is just as valuable as doing all that while in a Masters program, but WAY cheaper. Besides, you would probably get in with your current stats.

 

[Thinkin ahead]

Hofstra PhD or PGSP-Stanford PsyD?

 

[pediatric_psydoc]

Hofstra PhD or PGSP-Stanford PsyD?

http://www.appic.org/Portals/0/downloads/APPIC Match Rates 2011-16 by Univ.pdf

Data on internship match rates (be sure to look at the column for match to APA accredited sites when considering programs). Not sure if you've checked this out yet.


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[redhead223344]

Hello,

I have been accepted to Xavier's PsyD program and I am on the waiting list for La Salle's PsyD. Based off of past years it looks like I may hear back from La Salle very close to April 15th, and I would like to have an idea of which program I would choose if I do receive an acceptance. I am hoping for opinions on both programs - especially from any previous or current students.

My ultimate goal is to provide CBT therapy as well as neuropsych assessments. The schools have nearly identical outcomes in terms of internship match and licensure, and seem to be ranked very similarly. I was impressed with both schools on the interview days but I can only have so much insight from one day! Any thoughts on which school you would choose?

Thanks for your advice!

What is your funding situation?? Xavier provides a first year graduate assistantship with partial tuition and $8.10 an hour (8 hrs/wk). You will still need to come up with a significant amount of $$ per month to cover your expenses that are not covered by federal loans. They do not care about your financial situation and are extremely unhelpful/rude in this regard. The program itself is good, but it is geared to rich, white kids. If you do not fit this description, I would suggest looking elsewhere. Multiple students have brought this to the faculty's attention and it has become very obvious that they do not care.

Further, you will not be exposed to any CBT-focused courses until later in your training and the prof who teaches this is said to be horrible. The first and second years are primarily psychodynamic focused. Kind of irritated with this program after my first year (can you tell??). REALLY wish I had accepted my offer to IUP. They do have a good practicum program where they match you to various sites in the area, and the program has a great reputation in the Cincinnati area. Hope this helps!

 

[atroposlachesis]

Hi all! I don't know if anyone else has covered this exact topic before, so here goes my strange disjointed question.

I minored in Psych in college, but didn't do too well thanks to an untreated medical condition. After treatment, I then received my Master's in Counseling, which I did very well in. Halfway through, I realized I actually had a passion for research, and starting volunteering at a community action research institute. I was actually published as a co-author in an APA textbook.

I would like to go more in-depth into research, as well as expand my toolbox as I've always felt very limited by classic counseling talk therapy modalities. This started my interest in Occupational Therapy. I'm lucky enough to have been accepted to the top OT program in the country and will be participating in research there. But I still have my doubts. As I read through my textbooks for next year, I find myself coming back to the brain and topics in neuropsychology every single time. I am so profoundly fascinated by the myenteric "gut brain" connection and its role in mental health disorders. I think there is so much ripe opportunity for research in this area and I would love to be a part of it.

Sooo...that takes me to my big question. If you were me, what would you do? Would you go into OT, with relative job security? Or go into neuropsychology with all of its hassles, competition, but access to fascinating research?

Thank you in advance for any thoughts!

 

[pediatric_psydoc]

Hi all! I don't know if anyone else has covered this exact topic before, so here goes my strange disjointed question.

I minored in Psych in college, but didn't do too well thanks to an untreated medical condition. After treatment, I then received my Master's in Counseling, which I did very well in. Halfway through, I realized I actually had a passion for research, and starting volunteering at a community action research institute. I was actually published as a co-author in an APA textbook.

I would like to go more in-depth into research, as well as expand my toolbox as I've always felt very limited by classic counseling talk therapy modalities. This started my interest in Occupational Therapy. I'm lucky enough to have been accepted to the top OT program in the country and will be participating in research there. But I still have my doubts. As I read through my textbooks for next year, I find myself coming back to the brain and topics in neuropsychology every single time. I am so profoundly fascinated by the myenteric "gut brain" connection and its role in mental health disorders. I think there is so much ripe opportunity for research in this area and I would love to be a part of it.

Sooo...that takes me to my big question. If you were me, what would you do? Would you go into OT, with relative job security? Or go into neuropsychology with all of its hassles, competition, but access to fascinating research?

Thank you in advance for any thoughts!

I am not familiar with OT, so I can't address that specifically. I think that it is important to do some self reflection and through that process differentiate your passions, your interests, and what is a reasonable and feasible career goal. I hope this response isn't too generic, and it is based on my own experiences trying to figure out if clinical psychology was the best career goal for me. In college I had to decide among psychology, pharmacy, and medicine. I found that psychology worked best for me because I wanted to focus on assessment and intervention, and believed that for me psychology had more of a focus on the human condition as opposed to my two other aforementioned interests. I also wanted to have time to devote to my child, and psychology permits that more than medicine.

It is definitely important to think of the pros and cons of your two career options. I think it is definitely important to consider that you have been accepted into the top OT program. Congrats!! That is an amazing accomplishment, and that would likely open up amazing opportunities for job placement into excellent institutions. An accomplishment like that, along with the career opportunities that would lead to, should not be given up without serious self reflection and time.


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[deleted343839]

As I read through my textbooks for next year, I find myself coming back to the brain and topics in neuropsychology every single time. I am so profoundly fascinated by the myenteric "gut brain" connection and its role in mental health disorders. I think there is so much ripe opportunity for research in this area and I would love to be a part of it.

Sooo...that takes me to my big question. If you were me, what would you do? Would you go into OT, with relative job security? Or go into neuropsychology with all of its hassles, competition, but access to fascinating research?

These are not closely related career choices, so I think it comes down to what you value most. Research careers are difficult to enter and sustain but some people have the drive and risk tolerance for it. There are a lot of OTs working in quasi-mental health roles, and a small number doing research, but there really isn't much of a role for OT in gut-brain disorders. You might consider clinical health psychology programs as an alternative.

 

[pandapanda]

I have not applied, but I am in the process of deciding which of the three PsyD programs to eliminate from my list: LaSalle, Widener, and Denver (I am for sure applying to PGSP & Rutgers).

Does anyone have any thoughts, perhaps even regarding the location? I would like to gain information that's not on their websites already.

Are there research assistantships opportunities at all? What is the atmosphere like? Do students maintain a positive relationship with the faculty? Is the internship matching process competitive?

P.S. If it matters my GPA is 3.8, GRE Verbal 94%, Quant 81%, AW 60%.

 

[psych.meout]

I have not applied, but I am in the process of deciding which of the three PsyD programs to eliminate from my list: LaSalle, Widener, and Denver (I am for sure applying to PGSP & Rutgers).

Does anyone have any thoughts, perhaps even regarding the location? I would like to gain information that's not on their websites already.

Are there research assistantships opportunities at all? What is the atmosphere like? Do students maintain a positive relationship with the faculty? Is the internship matching process competitive?

P.S. If it matters my GPA is 3.8, GRE Verbal 94%, Quant 81%, AW 60%.

Why aren't you applying to any PhD programs?

 

[pandapanda]

Why aren't you applying to any PhD programs?

I am applying to 4 PhD programs. But those are easier to narrow down due to the need to match research interests with the faculty.

 

[chicandtoughness]

I have not applied, but I am in the process of deciding which of the three PsyD programs to eliminate from my list: LaSalle, Widener, and Denver (I am for sure applying to PGSP & Rutgers).

Not sure if it matters, but Widener has a captive internship. That may be a pro or a con, depending on whether you'd like to do all your training at the local facilities or not.

 

[WisNeuro]

Not sure if it matters, but Widener has a captive internship. That may be a pro or a con, depending on whether you'd like to do all your training at the local facilities or not.

Con

 

[psych.meout]

Not sure if it matters, but Widener has a captive internship. That may be a pro or a con, depending on whether you'd like to do all your training at the local facilities or not.

I'm pretty gaming the internship match system with a (2-year half-time!) captive internship site, because their applicants aren't good enough to compete with applicants from other programs is big 'ol con.

 

[pandapanda]

Not sure if it matters, but Widener has a captive internship. That may be a pro or a con, depending on whether you'd like to do all your training at the local facilities or not.

Yeah, I actually decided to take Widener off my list. I felt that the curriculum wasn't too challenging and I had mixed feelings about the captive internship system.