Gunning for Orthopedic Surgery Inquiry (as an DO)

[Hawkxxx]

Hello SDN members,

I will started as a first year DO student class of 2021 in August 2017. I have set my mind pursuing orthopedic surgery as my medical career. I have a strong passions for that field because a lot of my medical and service experiences has involved with orthopedic medicine (my mentor who changed my mind to pursue medical school is also an orthopedic surgeon at my undergrad university). This determination sounds very crazy because a lot of people told me to wait until rotation to decide, but personally I would like to decide now so I can see and plan the path that I would take on for the next 4 years before residency. Therefore, my question is that can students that have successfully been through the residency application process and got accepted to orthopedic residency (MD/DO programs) give some tips/advice on what should a medical student like me do in order to improve competitiveness for the field? Also is there any popular thread in this forums that provide a rough guidance for gunning to be an orthopedic surgeon? Last but not least, I understand research is one of the big factors for a successful candidate, so is there a list of research programs (such as summer programs or on-going programs) that DO student like me can participate in order to further my knowledge in the specialty? If anyone want to personally message me as well, I will greatly appreciate.

Thanks in advances,
Hawkxxx

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[TheOther]

Study hard to be at the top of your class, destroy both boards, do research, get stellar clinical grades, secure away rotations at solid DO programs, get awesome letters, and rock your interviews.

As for research, see if there are opportunities at your school. If not, look for them. Find a place to research during your summer between M1 and M2. Do a research rotation 3rd year. There is no magical directory where everything is handed to you on a silver platter. If you can't do that kind of research on your own, you ain't gunnin hard enough.

 

[feathr]

In a nutshell:

M1/M2: Get started with research, shadow some orthopods, study hard and crush step 1

M3/M4: Wrap up research/get published, Crush clinical clerkships, crush away rotations and home sub I, apply broadly, crush interviews and don't be weird

Sent from my HTC One M9 using SDN mobile

 

[Hawkxxx]

In a nutshell:

M1/M2: Get started with research, shadow some orthopods, study hard and crush step 1

M3/M4: Wrap up research/get published, Crush clinical clerkships, crush away rotations and home sub I, apply broadly, crush interviews and don't be weird

Sent from my HTC One M9 using SDN mobile

I am sorry for my inexperience, but you might be the expert on this subject. How would you go on to attain a such position? Should I simply email whoever the directors are? Is there any post on the forum that have some info about this?

Thanks in advance,
Hawkxxx

 

[frappalino16]

I am sorry for my inexperience, but you might be the expert on this subject. How would you go on to attain a such position? Should I simply email whoever the directors are? Is there any post on the forum that have some info about this?

Thanks in advance,
Hawkxxx

For research, contact orthopedic surgery faculty and ask if there are any ongoing projects that you can lend a hand with. It's not as easy coming from a DO school due to the lack of emphasis on research relative to MD schools and also a lack of orthopedic surgery faculty (at least from my experience).

 

[Hawkxxx]

For research, contact orthopedic surgery faculty and ask if there are any ongoing projects that you can lend a hand with. It's not as easy coming from a DO school due to the lack of emphasis on research relative to MD schools and also a lack of orthopedic surgery faculty (at least from my experience).

Thank you for your answer! I really appreciate it. I also have some more questions about shadowing a director of a residency program. Is it more important than getting a research project going? Or Should I do both at the same time? I currently have options to do research with a hospital that have an orthopedic fellowship program (not residency) because of my connection with my mentor who is a orthopedic researching physician (MD Phd DPM) for the hospital. But I have not looked into shadowing a program director yet.

 

[frappalino16]

I would keep it simple. For now, focus on getting on board a research project and focus on doing well in school/prepping for the boards. There's no point in spending time impressing a PD if your numbers aren't up to snuff.

 

[orthobrat]

I agree with all of the above. Research will be even more important now with programs moving forward with the ACGME merger. My school happened to have a list of "research mentors" and I chose to email a few that were orthopods. Most students didn't even know that list existed, I just happened to scour the school website my first year because I was gunning for ortho early as well.

Make sure you choose your audition sites wisely. Do some research as to who puts higher emphasis on board scores (if you kill your boards this is more of a non issue). I did not happen to kill mine....so I just made sure I chose programs that were rumored to care more about other aspects. If you take one piece of advice from anyone...just one...Don't be weird. Seriously. Work hard and show people that you are someone they would like to spend 5 years with. Audition rotations (at DO programs) matter more than anything.


Good luck!

 

[Pre-Medguy1995]

Does this mean that DOs are now going to have a lower chance of getting now that MDs can also apply for those spots? Are DOs going to be pushed out or....?

 

[DNC127]

Does this mean that DOs are now going to have a lower chance of getting now that MDs can also apply for those spots? Are DOs going to be pushed out or....?

Depends. I have talked to some PDs who say the are only taking DO students still, and some who simply want the best candidate whether MD or DO...

 

[TheOther]

Does this mean that DOs are now going to have a lower chance of getting now that MDs can also apply for those spots? Are DOs going to be pushed out or....?

Depends. I have talked to some PDs who say the are only taking DO students still, and some who simply want the best candidate whether MD or DO...

Also compounding the fact that there are some programs shutting down, so less spots overall.

 

[DNC127]

Also compounding the fact that there are some programs shutting down, so less spots overall.

Basically, be a baller applicant and you wont have to worry as much.

 

[TheOther]

Basically, be a baller applicant and you wont have to worry as much.

It's the only way I know how to live.

 

[heraclez]

Everything said already is pretty spot on. I just recently matched into Ortho and I can say with relative confidence that by 2021, it's going to be more competitive. Basically, focus on doing really well in classes and killing your boards, which really complement each other. If you do well enough in classes, understand and learn HOW to take tests, and develop a good time management skills, you'll be able to succeed really in any specialty!

And the best part is, if you gun really hard for Ortho, destroy your boards, rank in the top 5-10% of your class, and have SOME research, you'll have a SOLID shot at almost any specialty (minus ACGME plastics, ENT, in my opinion). So by focusing on those things, you're basically maximizing your opportunities and you can figure out if you really love Ortho during third year rotations (Which I recommend rotating at a place with a tough residency- so you know what to expect. It's never what you think).

I personally had WEAK research, like REALLY weak. So if I had to go back and do it all over again, I'd focus on the setting up a research mentor or anything research based during my first year of medical school. And honestly, it doesn't HAVE to be in Ortho research, although that is ideal. But so is scoring 800+ on the COMLEX and being ranked number 1 among your classmates. So just get ANY kind of research and make sure to be ready to talk about it in the interview, e.g. "Yeah I loved the process of research, but quickly realized that the particular topic of gastric microbiology compared between obese and underweight individuals was not what I was interested in, but I continued with my research experience because the pursuit of knowledge and the process of acquiring it was one of my strongest passions, second only to being in the OR working as a team with skilled ortho surgeons." (or whatever)

Good luck!

 

[Pre-Medguy1995]

Everything said already is pretty spot on. I just recently matched into Ortho and I can say with relative confidence that by 2021, it's going to be more competitive. Basically, focus on doing really well in classes and killing your boards, which really complement each other. If you do well enough in classes, understand and learn HOW to take tests, and develop a good time management skills, you'll be able to succeed really in any specialty!

And the best part is, if you gun really hard for Ortho, destroy your boards, rank in the top 5-10% of your class, and have SOME research, you'll have a SOLID shot at almost any specialty (minus ACGME plastics, ENT, in my opinion). So by focusing on those things, you're basically maximizing your opportunities and you can figure out if you really love Ortho during third year rotations (Which I recommend rotating at a place with a tough residency- so you know what to expect. It's never what you think).

I personally had WEAK research, like REALLY weak. So if I had to go back and do it all over again, I'd focus on the setting up a research mentor or anything research based during my first year of medical school. And honestly, it doesn't HAVE to be in Ortho research, although that is ideal. But so is scoring 800+ on the COMLEX and being ranked number 1 among your classmates. So just get ANY kind of research and make sure to be ready to talk about it in the interview, e.g. "Yeah I loved the process of research, but quickly realized that the particular topic of gastric microbiology compared between obese and underweight individuals was not what I was interested in, but I continued with my research experience because the pursuit of knowledge and the process of acquiring it was one of my strongest passions, second only to being in the OR working as a team with skilled ortho surgeons." (or whatever)

Good luck!

Where did you match and what were your stats? (If you don't mind sharing of course)

And what did you really prioritize in a program outside of academics? How much did this factor in your decision? Does the area or research matter? (i.e does it HAVE to be ortho research?)

 

[heraclez]

Where did you match and what were your stats? (If you don't mind sharing of course)

And what did you really prioritize in a program outside of academics? How much did this factor in your decision? Does the area or research matter? (i.e does it HAVE to be ortho research?)

I matched at one of the California programs, my top choice, which I chose because of the people, location, experience during auditions. Comlex: 735 and 770. USMLE: 255 and 272.

My main concern with program was simply the fit. I wanted to balance my experience with the people I'd be working with.

And research, I think its best for it to be something that can show you know what you're doing during research and can show dedication to getting something published eventually.

 

[Spectreman]

AOA Ortho residency near my school is on its 2nd year in the NRMP, took 3 MDs and 1 DO this year, one of those MDs was an IMG... so that’s fun.

 

[TheOther]

AOA Ortho residency near my school is on its 2nd year in the NRMP, took 3 MDs and 1 DO this year, one of those MDs was an IMG... so that’s fun.

Yikes...

 

[hbslax4]

AOA Ortho residency near my school is on its 2nd year in the NRMP, took 3 MDs and 1 DO this year, one of those MDs was an IMG... so that’s fun.

Which program was this? Broward?

 

[Spectreman]

Which program was this? Broward?

Yes Broward, I need to make a new profile and stop screwing up my anonymity here.

 

[hbslax4]

Yes Broward, I need to make a new profile and stop screwing up my anonymity here.

Haha I like to think people have better things to do then try to keep track of people’s possible SDN identities. Broward was an easy guess since there were only 2 DO programs in the MD match.

Anyway, I know Broward was only in the MD match this year. So I imagine they had a very hard time convincing DO students to forgo the DO match even if they gave them their “word” that they would rank them to match. I’m sure once it’s all one unified then they will return to a DO preference or 50/50 split.

 

[TheOther]

Yes Broward, I need to make a new profile and stop screwing up my anonymity here.

Honestly, it’s the first program that came to mind for me too.

 

[Spectreman]

Haha I like to think people have better things to do then try to keep track of people’s possible SDN identities. Broward was an easy guess since there were only 2 DO programs in the MD match.

Anyway, I know Broward was only in the MD match this year. So I imagine they had a very hard time convincing DO students to forgo the DO match even if they gave them their “word” that they would rank them to match. I’m sure once it’s all one unified then they will return to a DO preference or 50/50 split.

This makes sense. Also, word on the street is the IMG is the daughter of an attending. So that should explain things a bit on that end.

 

[TheOther]

This makes sense. Also, word on the street is the IMG is the daughter of an attending. So that should explain things a bit on that end.

Nepotism is life.

 

[hbslax4]

Also, is Broward now taking 4 residents a year? I thought they only had 3 spots.

 

[Spectreman]

Also, is Broward now taking 4 residents a year? I thought they only had 3 spots.

Yes and they’re pushing for 5 starting next year.

 

[hbslax4]

Yes and they’re pushing for 5 starting next year.

Oh okay cool. Sounds like the volume there is pretty high so I’m sure they could support the extra residents.

 

[DNC127]

AOA Ortho residency near my school is on its 2nd year in the NRMP, took 3 MDs and 1 DO this year, one of those MDs was an IMG... so that’s fun.

I heard from some pretty reliable sources that broward's hospital admin require them to take MD's. I can't confirm, but trust the people that told me this.

 

[hbslax4]

I heard from some pretty reliable sources that broward's hospital admin require them to take MD's. I can't confirm, but trust the people that told me this.

Interesting. Dr. Rush gave a good interview on whitecoatcoaching.com a year or two ago. Thought it gave good insight into his perspective on the merger and how Broward will approach it.

 

[Spectreman]

I heard from some pretty reliable sources that broward's hospital admin require them to take MD's. I can't confirm, but trust the people that told me this.

I haven’t heard that from Dr Rush, I spend quite a bit of time with that group so I can ask. He gave a talk to us a couple months ago and said they’re getting heat because Broward doesn’t have a GS program, but that’s all he mentioned regarding uppers giving him a hard time.