DO's who matched ACGME ophtho in 2017

[ShahRukhKhan]

Hi,

I went through all the ophthalmology programs on FREIDA and compiled a list of what programs have DO residents. According to the SF match report, 5 DO's matched acgme this year (to start in 2018). I was wondering if anyone knew where they matched and/or if the people that matched could pm me that would be greatly appreciated! 1 of these 5 matched at U-Oklahoma, but not sure about the rest.

If are a DO student who applied this past year and also don't mind telling me where you interviewed, that would also be helpful.

I'm applying this upcoming cycle so all of this will help planning. Thanks in advance!

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[pasquals]

I think it is incredible that a DO matched at Oklahoma. Really would like to know his/her story. I wouldn't be surprised if he/she did undergrad at a top 10 school or had a personal connection to a program. I don't remember Oklahoma even considering DOs for interview.


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[sab3156]

I think it is incredible that a DO matched at Oklahoma. Really would like to know his/her story. I wouldn't be surprised if he/she did undergrad at a top 10 school or had a personal connection to a program. I don't remember Oklahoma even considering DOs for interview.

Don't be shocked anymore, because it seems that the match lists for DOs overall are improving every year as more competitive programs take DOs. There were many great matches this year and the past several years for DOs, including Neurosurgery at Mayo and Plastics at USF. I think things are only looking up for DOs.

 

[sab3156]

N = 1? I agree that some programs may feel like that, which is unfortunate, but it is not very useful to use one school as evidence to suggest that my previous post is wrong.

 

[EyeDR_oo]

@sab3156 I disagree with your statement. I have heard from three residency program directors (pediatrics, ophthalmology, surgery) from my school (mid-tier) stating that this year we will not be interviewing any more DOs/IMGs. Residency program directors have in the back of their mind that the more IMGs/DOs there are in the resident class profile, the less prestigious the program 'looks.'

In a world where everything is getting so competitive and students are becoming so accomplished, simply screening by school ranking/DO/IMGs is the best way to limit the interview pool. That is why going to a top 10 US MD school is more advantageous than a bottom 10 US MD.

Advantages, yes. Exclusionary, no. Sounds like your school is about to become a low-tier. You know, unless Cornell ophtho isn't prestigious enough either (yes they too have a DO).

 

[long]

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[CarpetWindow7]

I agree with all your sentiments. I myself am from a mid-tier medical school, and have been told by people in the ophtho world that the top 10 residencies will basically be almost impossible to break into simply because of my school rank (even though my profile checks off all the boxes). Fingers crossed that they are wrong.

I'm graduating from a low mid-tier medical school received interviews from top 10 programs. They did mention that I was the first applicant from my medical school they had interviewed in some time.

 

[DrZeke]

I'm graduating from a low mid-tier medical school received interviews from top 10 programs. They did mention that I was the first applicant from my medical school they had interviewed in some time.

In my experience this is the exception unless you are top 10 in your class with AOA, very high board scores and usually some level of research. Also a letter from a known person in the world of big wigs goes a long way if you have these credentials.


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[Anti-PD1]

I think it is incredible that a DO matched at Oklahoma. Really would like to know his/her story. I wouldn't be surprised if he/she did undergrad at a top 10 school or had a personal connection to a program. I don't remember Oklahoma even considering DOs for interview.


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You could Google this very easily.

I just did. UG: UT Tyler. 1 research paper.

He probably has great stats and made a good impression on the program.

Also, eventually, every program will have it's first DO. I won't be surprised in 10 years when MEEI etc will match its first DO.

 

[sab3156]

Also my wife just told me that two DOs matched this year into MEEI fellowships (Glaucoma and Medical Retina). Things are only looking up, even at MEEI.

Here is the link:
Fellowship matches

 

[Anti-PD1]

Also my wife just told me that two DOs matched into MEEI fellowships (Glaucoma and Medical Retina). Things are only looking up, even at MEEI.

Here is the link:
Fellowship matches

Exactly. It's the law of diffusion.

Eventually, the old guard dies or retires. One day, the PD at MEEI, Will's Eye, etc etc will have a relative who is a DO, and will give them an equal footing in the application process.

 

[ophthapp1]

Exactly. It's the law of diffusion.

Eventually, the old guard dies or retires. One day, the PD at MEEI, Will's Eye, etc etc will have a relative who is a DO, and will give them an equal footing in the application process.

Translated: "We can collectively look forward to that one day, someday, when a DO might happen to be related to someone in a position of decision-making power, and their priviledged parlay based on circumstance rather than merit will be a shining beacon of hope for DO's everywhere."

This post made me sad. I feel for you guys, I really do. Keep up the good fight.

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[Anti-PD1]

Translated: "We can collectively look forward to that one day, someday, when a DO might happen to be related to someone in a position of decision-making power, and their priviledged parlay based on circumstance rather than merit will be a shining beacon of hope for DO's everywhere."

This post made me sad. I feel for you guys, I really do. Keep up the good fight.

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Someone has to break the mold. I see nepotism everywhere. All a DO needs, a good DO, is a chance to show they aren't alien. That first break might occur because of nepotism, but it will eventually open everyone's mind to the inanity of all this.

I'm in MD school. I like to stick my neck out for the other guy, once in a while.

 

[pasquals]

Advantages, yes. Exclusionary, no. Sounds like your school is about to become a low-tier. You know, unless Cornell ophtho isn't prestigious enough either (yes they too have a DO).

Cornell ophtho is not prestigious lol


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[pasquals]

Also my wife just told me that two DOs matched this year into MEEI fellowships (Glaucoma and Medical Retina). Things are only looking up, even at MEEI.

Here is the link:
Fellowship matches

Medical retina and glaucoma are not competitive specialties. These fellowships may be more competitive at meei (but the meei name here has no correlation with how good the fellowship is - there are much better med retina and glaucoma fellowships). Also, i don't think meei pays using the pgy scale...

The 2 DOs that matched went to md residencies. They were probably exceptional to begin with and continued to be that way in residency. But this cannot generalize to mean that DOs are making tremendous progress. In general, people are DOs because they are below average to begin with/or messed up in highschool (hard to swallow but the truth)



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[pasquals]

You could Google this very easily.

I just did. UG: UT Tyler. 1 research paper.

He probably has great stats and made a good impression on the program.

Also, eventually, every program will have it's first DO. I won't be surprised in 10 years when MEEI etc will match its first DO.

Meei will never match its first DO unless it's a faculty member's kid. And most residency programs work as a collective so one faculty will need to convince 20 others to take the DO. Meei will always have a smarter/equally smart MD to take a spot.


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[sab3156]

Meei will never match its first DO unless it's a faculty member's kid. And most residency programs work as a collective so one faculty will need to convince 20 others to take the DO. Meei will always have a smarter/equally smart MD to take a spot.

Your pessimism in the past few posts is extreme. Are you telling me MEEI didn't have ultra-competitive MDs from BPEI/Wilmer/Wills competing for these fellowship spots? MEEI has shown, at least in their fellowship programs, that it's willing to take anyone who is excellent, regardless of their degree. You can argue that the residency program is run by a different set of people than the fellowship programs, but you can't just say MEEI will "never match its first DO unless it's a faculty member's kid"...

What you are saying is what people were saying (and are still saying) years ago about DOs entering competitive programs ("it will never be done"). But DOs are entering these fields, and the past few years have shown MANY "glass ceilings" breaking. And guess what? Mayo has matched DOs in Ortho, a DO this year in Neurosurgery, and a DO in Derm. Cleveland Clinic has taken multiple DOs into Ortho. MGH has taken a DO in its Anesthesiology program two years in a row starting last year. MGH also has a renowned cardiologist in their faculty who is a DO (Dr. Jaff). Come to think of it, PD of Tuft's Hematology/Oncology residency program is a DO. So the "only MDs can be faculty at academic centers" myth is similarly an incorrect generalization. There are many, many other examples (this is just off my limited knowledge of who is where). So don't be narrow minded, please. Times are changing, whether you want to believe it or not.

And of course, no one is generalizing and saying that all DOs will be amazing applicants to residency programs. You're right in one sense, because a lot of DO students will not be doing exceptionally well on the Step 1, and they won't be doing research, and whatnot. But there is quite a handful of DOs every year that are breaking through the barriers and making it to very good programs in many specialties. Once these barriers are broken, it becomes easier and easier for future DOs.

Also... Ophtho departments seem to be pretty small, and to say 20 people are selecting the residents together seems to be a huge stretch. I thought that PDs really hold the power for selection? Correct me if I'm wrong, I dont' know much about this.

 

[Lazyeye9]

Oh vl0913, you always like to pontificate on the ophtho forums with your anti-DO-rhetoric. I am impressed as a PGY1 you know what MEEI faculty will do. You seem to have it all figured out but either way, I wish you the best of luck in your future career as an ophthalmologist as you have not even started your training in this amazing profession. I would state that you do find a touch of humility and hopefully if you see a DO ophtho someday giving a talk or maybe, God forbid, teaching you, you don't snub them but actually listen to what they have to say, as there may be a very small possibility that they may know something that you do not .

 

[EyeDR_oo]

The 2 DOs that matched went to md residencies. They were probably exceptional to begin with and continued to be that way in residency. But this cannot generalize to mean that DOs are making tremendous progress. In general, people are DOs because they are below average to begin with/or messed up in highschool (hard to swallow but the truth)
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You probably meant to say college, but given that you are generally correct on all previous comments, I'll keep my below average DO comments to myself. Thanks for your input -- highly valued and always appreciated.

 

[pasquals]

You probably meant to say college, but given that you are generally correct on all previous comments, I'll keep my below average DO comments to myself. Thanks for your input -- highly valued and always appreciated.

Why did you delete your comment about upenn? It's surprising with your #1 class rank that you didn't match MD, which I assume you tried for first (especially given your obsession with the Ivys). You've been trying to defend your lackluster performance since college on sdn since 2008- when you were actually waitlisted at a DO school and obviously not accepted to an MD school. Something seems fishy. You just got to take the truth- you'll be a doctor some day but it won't likely be a specialty you love nor will it be at a top 10 program. If that's all you care about, you shouldn't have tried for med school in the first place.



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[pasquals]

Oh vl0913, you always like to pontificate on the ophtho forums with your anti-DO-rhetoric. I am impressed as a PGY1 you know what MEEI faculty will do. You seem to have it all figured out but either way, I wish you the best of luck in your future career as an ophthalmologist as you have not even started your training in this amazing profession. I would state that you do find a touch of humility and hopefully if you see a DO ophtho someday giving a talk or maybe, God forbid, teaching you, you don't snub them but actually listen to what they have to say, as there may be a very small possibility that they may know something that you do not .

I have nothing against DOs and actually have a number of good friends who are DOs. I respect them and they are intelligent. They are at fine residencies and fellowships in places like uchicago and ucsf. But they are also humble. I just hate how DOs on sdn always act and talk about "taking over" a competitive specialty like it's a freakin' battle ground. Obviously as an MD (who happens to be in ophtho residency) I'm going to defend my turf. We can work together and DOs who are exceptional are going to sneak by but in general, this specialty will not be DO friendly because there will always be an MD to take the spot.

Btw, I know what meei faculty and fellowships are like because I talk to residents and faculty with first hand experience...


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[EyeDR_oo]

Why did you delete your comment about upenn? It's surprising with your #1 class rank that you didn't match MD, which I assume you tried for first (especially given your obsession with the Ivys). You've been trying to defend your lackluster performance since college on sdn since 2008- when you were actually waitlisted at a DO school and obviously not accepted to an MD school. Something seems fishy. You just got to take the truth- you'll be a doctor some day but it won't likely be a specialty you love nor will it be at a top 10 program. If that's all you care about, you shouldn't have tried for med school in the first place.

Yet again you are on top of your game; my truth hmm -- I'm in an MD ophtho spot already. But thanks for your concern. Keep going strong buddy. Just remember the DO sitting next to you probably had 5x the stats you did. Hope you are enjoying intern life and speculating!

 

[pasquals]

Yet again you are on top of your game; my truth hmm -- I'm in an MD ophtho spot already. But thanks for your concern. Keep going strong buddy. Just remember the DO sitting next to you probably had 5x the stats you did. Hope you are enjoying intern life and speculating!

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[EyeDR_oo]

I have nothing against DOs and actually have a number of good friends who are DOs. I respect them and they are intelligent. They are at fine residencies and fellowships in places like uchicago and ucsf. But they are also humble. I just hate how DOs on sdn always act and talk about "taking over" a competitive specialty like it's a freakin' battle ground. Obviously as an MD (who happens to be in ophtho residency) I'm going to defend my turf. We can work together and DOs who are exceptional are going to sneak by but in general, this specialty will not be DO friendly because there will always be an MD to take the spot.

Btw, I know what meei faculty and fellowships are like because I talk to residents and faculty with first hand experience...


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Thank you, you are correct I did not get into medical school the first time around but also had other factors in my life. But I am however in one of your territorial md ophtho spots. Guess I "snuck" by.

You are definitely the kind of person who says: I'm not a racist some of my best friends are "insert color here" but......

Thank you for being the guardian of the ophtho world lol, it is always appreciated to have one of those especially as an intern, not even in residency yet. I'll continue to build up my collegues, but again thanks for your concern. Good luck to you and whatever hole you crawled out from under.

 

[pasquals]

Thank you, you are correct I did not get into medical school the first time around but also had other factors in my life. But I am however in one of your territorial md ophtho spots. Guess I "snuck" by.

You are definitely the kind of person who says: I'm not a racist some of my best friends are "insert color here" but......

Thank you for being the guardian of the ophtho world lol, it is always appreciated to have one of those especially as an intern, not even in residency yet. I'll continue to build up my collegues, but again thanks for your concern. Good luck to you and whatever hole you crawled out from under.

No reason to bring race into this even if it is just an example.

A lot of people don't get into med school first time around. That's not my point here and I don't care. I had struggles too. You just told me to keep speculating so I just wanted to prove it. And who ever said I was an intern?


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[AlteredScale]

Please keep the conversation civil and professional. If someone is annoying/bothering you please use the ignore feature. It is not okay to stray away from the main discussion of the thread in order to have a singular argument against another member.

 

[Feugmed]

If I may add to this post,

I met some of the most wonderful DO applicants on the interview trailer during the 2016-2017 application cycle, except one who I think is just arrogant by personality. One of them I still keep in contact! I was fortunate (I'm from a "top" MD school, per US News ranking) to meet many of the DO applicants. These applicants are rotating 3-9+ away rotations. I did one and thought it was rough. I can't imagine doing more than 2. I'd recommend the osteopathic community to work hard, be humble, and keep trying to match into these "competitive" specialities. I was told that once DDS vs. DMD was a big thing by my community dentist (as to whether that is true I am not sure). I'm sure several decades from now the line will disappear even with MD vs. DO. Best of luck!

 

[DrWhozits]

DO matched University of Kentucky optho this year

 

[sab3156]

If I may add to this post,

I met some of the most wonderful DO applicants on the interview trailer during the 2016-2017 application cycle, except one who I think is just arrogant by personality. One of them I still keep in contact! I was fortunate (I'm from a "top" MD school, per US News ranking) to meet many of the DO applicants. These applicants are rotating 3-9+ away rotations. I did one and thought it was rough. I can't imagine doing more than 2. I'd recommend the osteopathic community to work hard, be humble, and keep trying to match into these "competitive" specialities. I was told that once DDS vs. DMD was a big thing by my community dentist (as to whether that is true I am not sure). I'm sure several decades from now the line will disappear even with MD vs. DO. Best of luck!

Thanks for the info. Do you mind letting us know which places you saw interviewing DOs? It would be some good information for DO students. Thanks again.

 

[russiandoc]

I agree with almost all of you. Everyone is saying the same thing.
1) If you went to DO school, there is no secret that you didn't get into an MD school. Either you're a crappy test taker, weren't focused enough in high school/college, or maybe some other blemish on your transcript. Most people who have gone through the process know that getting into an MD school is among the most competitive things for a college student to do. If you didn't get in. It's ok. You still really wanted to be a physician.
2) Getting into MD ophtho will always be highly competitive for a DO. If I was a program director I would be hard pressed to take a DO when looking at a pool of superstar students. Some of them have to be fun enough to hang out with and know how to talk to people. So Bravo to the DO's that made it through that process. It will get better, a little. The same reasons that kept DO's out of MD school's will keep them out of MD ophtho residency.
3) What you will find most important at the end of the day is how well you take care of patients, how capable you are as a surgeon, and what you contribute to our fantastic specialty. I'm a DO who went to an MD residency, a top fellowship, and will continue to help my fellow DO's out in any way that I can, while teaching MD's and maybe some DO's, at some of the top programs in the country.

 

[estes8000]

Hi,

I went through all the ophthalmology programs on FREIDA and compiled a list of what programs have DO residents. According to the SF match report, 5 DO's matched acgme this year (to start in 2018). I was wondering if anyone knew where they matched and/or if the people that matched could pm me that would be greatly appreciated! 1 of these 5 matched at U-Oklahoma, but not sure about the rest.

If are a DO student who applied this past year and also don't mind telling me where you interviewed, that would also be helpful.

I'm applying this upcoming cycle so all of this will help planning. Thanks in advance!

I've been interested in DO ophthalmologists since becoming an MD ophthalmologist many years ago. A friend obtained a DO degree and completed an allopathic ophthalmology residency. I practice in a state where there are a few DO ophthalmologist, all having trained at DO programs. They are all at or above average when compared to the community. DO programs are very small and very difficult to get into, and many may fall by the wayside in the near future. Here's a probably incomplete list of MD residencies that have taken DO graduates (now or in the past): Albany, Buffalo, Cornell, Bronx Lebanon, Pitt, Penn State, Drexel, U of South Carolina, Georgia, Wake Forest, Louisville, Case Western, Henry Ford, Michigan, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Geisinger, LIJ-Hofstra, West Virginia, Cook County.

 

[estes8000]

also... U of Chicago, U of Missouri

 

[sab3156]

also... U of Chicago, U of Missouri

Do you think ophtho at CCF and Mayo (considering that both have a lot of DOs in various specialties) is attainable for DOs?

 

[estes8000]

The Mayo Clinic has interviewed DO students for ophthalmic residencies. The Mayo Clinic employs a DO who did osteopathic ophthalmology residency and allopathic fellowship at one of their satellite clinics. I presume that CCF stands for Cleveland Clinic... I have no information about their program and this particular issue.

 

[sab3156]

The Mayo Clinic has interviewed DO students for ophthalmic residencies. The Mayo Clinic employs a DO who did osteopathic ophthalmology residency and allopathic fellowship at one of their satellite clinics. I presume that CCF stands for Cleveland Clinic... I have no information about their program and this particular issue.

Really appreciate your help. Thanks!

 

[hello lady!]

Really appreciate your help. Thanks!

Honestly I'd be cautious of worrying about what programs have or had DOs training. You have no idea what connections he/she had to get into the program that you don't have. I'm sure theres a handful of DOs that would never have gotten the position had it not been for family members pulling strings in the background. It may give you a false sense of security and you might be wasting your time.

I went to a smallish MD school and everyone was excited about a student matching into a top program, it was the first time someone had gotten into this program from our school. It turned out they had family on faculty there. It didnt mean the top program was suddenly friendly to our program, she had a special circumstance.

Just apply broadly and give it your all.

 

[estes8000]

also...New York Medical College, Howard University, George Washington University

 

[DrZeke]

Add Geisinger to the list in PA


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[estes8000]

Also...U of Kentucky...

 

[estes8000]

also: UWisconsin, Tufts

 

[sab3156]

It was another tough year for DOs (unsurprisingly). 28 applied, 10 matched.