Donald Trump's Presidency

Discussion in 'Anesthesiology' started by BLADEMDA, Nov 21, 2016.

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  1. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    You kidding? The media fawned over Obama so much that his Press Secretary essentially said they used them as an echo chamber to support his legislative agenda. Do you really believe the treatment is the same?
     
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  3. GravelRider

    GravelRider ASA Member 2+ Year Member

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    I'm just repeating what you said.
     
  4. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    This study out of Harvard says it all:

    Harvard Study Reveals Huge Extent of Anti-Trump Media Bias
     
  5. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    Actually, the media was more biased in favor of that failure Barry than any recent President by far.

    The felt he was their liberal great hope.

    Harvard Study Reveals Huge Extent of Anti-Trump Media Bias
     
  6. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    It ain't just the media that's "unfair" in the minds of the Trump base. Educators, "historians", pollsters, democrats, republicans, judges, European politicians and press, city-folk, coastal-folk, intelligence agencies, past administrations... Apparently an education and experience predispose people to biases against Trump.

    The established (and growing) acceptance of the aggressive and unapologetic ignorance of this administration can only be ignored by believing that the entire world is responsible for making up Donald Trump's problems.
     
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  7. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    Yeah the mainstream people who benefit from a corrupt system that helps the business/academic/media class at the expense of the average middle class/working class person.

    Makes sense to me.
     
  8. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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  9. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    It doesn't bother you in the least that Trump makes blatant verifiably false statements on a regular basis? (ie millions of illegals voting, birtherism, inaguration crowd size etc). Before you say all politicians lie, at least they have some cover based on reality.

    I don't see why he wouldn't lie about legal matters if he's so willing to make up stuff that is completely in another universe of reality (ie his mind). I also don't see what the point is of criticizing the media for being biased when he is whole-sale making sh*t up?

    Btw I am solidly republican prior to Trump.


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  10. chessknt87

    chessknt87 ASA Member 7+ Year Member

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    That study didn't show bias. It showed a researchers interpretation of bias by attributing a positive or negative spin to every story.

    I will never understand how anyone could rationally defend this buffoon-his limited vocabulary, historical knowledge, and empathy clearly label him as ignorant, entitled, or demented (or a combination of all three). I have also yet to see him take responsibility for anything negative that has happened since taking office-how do you reconcile that with the belief of anti-welfare self responsibility?
     
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  11. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    To clarify, reporters fawned over Obama even though he went after reporters who didn't toe his line. We know this. There is documented evidence, personal accounts, and legal records of it. There is also a study linked above of anti-Trump bias. This stuff isn't conjecture.

    Can you imagine if the Trump administration labeled Don Lemon a co-conspirator and investigated his phone calls and went over his emails like Obama did to James Rosen? Can't even think of the backlash.

    Here is what the Harvard study of blatant and unprecedented anti-Trump bias concluded:

    "The nation’s watchdog has lost much of its bite and won’t regain it until the public perceives it as an impartial broker, applying the same reporting standards to both parties,” the study concludes."

    I couldn't agree more.
     
  12. facted

    facted ASA Member 7+ Year Member

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    Or it says that the vast majority of the news in the past few months related to Trump has been negative. What exactly has he done that's been great so far? Nominate a supreme Court Justice? Anything else?
     
  13. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    Read it's conclusion. It essentially says there are different reporting standards. For goodness' sake, Harvard isn't exactly a harbinger of conservative ideology. Democrats and liberals can continue to deny it, and they will continue to get slaughtered in Middle America. The study essentially concludes that and it is a reality for Dems right now. Dems are doing themselves no favors. They have lost the House, the Senate, the POTUS, governorships. They have to look inwards.

    That aside, let's not argue like Rachel Maddow. Present facts and we can discuss. In the face of politicians being known for being spineless liars, simple comments like "How can you defend this buffoon?" not only are subjective perceptions, but completely irrelevant to a factual discussion and just a testament of double standards. You still think Iran's secret cash shipment last summer was a "scheduled payment"?
     
  14. chessknt87

    chessknt87 ASA Member 7+ Year Member

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    You hold random internet people to a higher standard than your president it seems. How about those inauguration crowd sizes? Or his popular vote win? Or the tribes of illegals voting against him? Or any of his other flagrant unsupported "facts"?
     
  15. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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  16. vector2

    vector2 ASA Member 10+ Year Member

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    "After college, after Trump mostly gave up his personal athletic interests, he came to view time spent playing sports as time wasted. Trump believed the human body was like a battery, with a finite amount of energy, which exercise only depleted. So he didn’t work out. When he learned that John O’Donnell, one of his top casino executives, was training for an Ironman triathlon, he admonished him, “You are going to die young because of this.”"
     
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  17. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    What- politicians lie? Is that what you are saying?

    "No new taxes"? "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor"? "WMDs in Iraq"?

    There is a long road littered with egregious lies that Trump now walks down that was paved by prior presidents. I apologize- the whole "How can you deal with his lies?" angle surrounding him embellishing his inauguration attendance rings pretty damn hollow when I am paying 5G more annually in healthcare premiums since I was promised my healthcare costs wouldn't be going up.

    I care about policy and honesty surrounding that. Please come to me when you think Trump genuinely misled us about his policy intentions. I'll definitely engage that. Little ditzel comments about crowd size? Not so much.
     
  18. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    Please post more ancillary hack pieces from the New Yorker. It helps prove my cause. Would love to hear some conovos between Barack and Rev Wright too.

    As mentioned above, I care about policies. Not ancillary crud, with all due respect.
     
  19. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    Trump is correct about excessive exercise is bad for you:

    Is too much exercise BAD for the heart? | Daily Mail Online

    Have to agree with him on Ironman's as well.
     
  20. vector2

    vector2 ASA Member 10+ Year Member

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    Or you could just look at a recent picture of DJT's physique if you want to verify the article's veracity.

    But seriously, there's nothing that anyone could say or post that would dissuade you from your beliefs. You google stuff and find sources from far-right/deep state/breitbartian sources you think are accurate, and people who disagree with you will probably source quotes from left-leaning fact-based "hacks" like the New Yorker, nyt, wapo, etc. They're not gonna change your mind, and you're certainly not going to convince them that DJT isn't an illiterate, childish, unthinking moron. Maybe the truth is somewhere in the middle, but I would tend to side with the latter considering DJT's painful oratory and the fact he proudly admits he doesn't read books.
     
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  21. vector2

    vector2 ASA Member 10+ Year Member

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  22. facted

    facted ASA Member 7+ Year Member

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    Are you seriously defending Trump on this? He said that humans are a battery and you are born with all your energy. REALLY?!?!?
     
  23. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    You've now defended your position using "Russia Today" and "World Net Daily" articles. (Look WND up you guys. Seriously).

    This explains why you don't quite understand why everyday finds this moron closer to removal from office and potential prosecution.

    Good luck.
     
  24. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    :laugh: I honestly wonder if these posts are actually coming from some Russian internet cafe near the Kremlin
     
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  25. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    I would argue there's a difference between making promises or predictions about the future that turn out false, versus just making absolute sh*t up.

    The former shows at best miscalculation, at worst manipulation.

    Trump's statements are made-up stories about stuff that already happened, often with direct video contradicting him. That is different than any other politician I know of, and more than the typical "spin." He might as well be claiming that he funds the entire US government with his personal wealth. I'm guessing some would believe him....

    And tell me why I should care about media bias again when the president is making statements I would expect from a committed psych patient who's completely broken from reality?


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  26. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    So what did you think when the US secretly shipped 300 million dollars in cash in the middle of the night to Iran that led to the release of American prisoners that Obama after being busted claimed was a "scheduled payment"?

    I assume if you take issue with lies regarding crowd sizes that you took issue with a blatant lie regarding giving a 300 million dollar ransom payment to the largest world state-sponsor of terrorism?
     
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  27. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    Are any of the facts incorrect in that article or are you just attacking the source?

    Want other sources? No problem:

    How Apartheid Haunts a New Generation of South Africans

    Guess the Atlantic is conservative too huh?
     
  28. DrCommonSense

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    Funny how communist liberals now hate Russia since Putin threw their allies out of the country. Times have definitely changed lol
     
  29. acidbase1

    acidbase1 5+ Year Member

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    We will never know if trump could have done something decent. Guy never had a snowballs chance in hell. Scary if you think about it. The media runs this country

    But at this point I think it's too late, let's move on so we can actually get something accomplished
     
  30. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    It's a solid point. Maybe Trump's having a tougher time than Mandela's almost 30 years in prison for arguing for equality.
     
  31. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    Let's not. Let's let the guy who was elected through American democratic tradition get his four years. This is a democracy.
     
  32. DrCommonSense

    DrCommonSense

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    Cool strawman ignoring the argument

    But liberal gonna liberal
     
  33. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    The liberal "I gotcha" game here is a little silly. I think we all know Trump was referring to the press he has received, which according to the Harvard study is indeed in unchartered territory in how negative it is towards him. Whether that negative press is justified or not, it is simply a fact.
     
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  34. GravelRider

    GravelRider ASA Member 2+ Year Member

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    There was already precedent for that. Iran has had big league success in the past by taking American hostages. Remember when Reagan sold arms to the Iranians despite an arms embargo?
     
  35. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    Yep I take issue with that as well. Just because I think Trump is bat s-hit crazy doesnt mean I liked Obama.


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  36. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    So there is precedent for grotesque national security lies but not for ditzel minutiae lies about crowd sizes, so Trump must be treated as a pathological crazy person?
     
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  37. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    If you take issue with that, I hope you do t see these as on the same level. If you are a tad bit annoyed by an exaggeration about crowd size, lying about giving money to terrorists should have you lighting up a torch.
     
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  38. GravelRider

    GravelRider ASA Member 2+ Year Member

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    Hey, I'm no fan of politicians. You'll never catch me showing undying support or loyalty to any poltician.
     
  39. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    I do take major issue with this and also the way Obama handled Iran is about 50% of why I don't like him ( I agree with Trump it was one of the worst deals in history).

    I think lying about crowd size is minor. You picked the most minor of a whole dictionary of lies. Lying about millions of illegals voting and making up stories about where Obama was born (even if you don't like the guy) was more serious. And if he's lying about his conversations with Comey that would be even worse.


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  40. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    He has retracted his birther statements, and his "illegal comments", while highly unlikely, cannot be proven or disproven, in part because the US has tremendously lax screening procedures at the voting booth. For example, look at the case of Al Franken's Senate seat where it took a private watchdog group to notice 1100 felons voting that shouldn't have.

    In any event, none of those lies have anything to do with promises, security, or policy. That's what I care about.
     
  41. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    What argument? I put up a picture of Mandela in prison with Trump's quote that he's modern Jesus. What would you have me argue?
     
  42. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    How do you know he's only referring to the press? Have you not listened to the guy you hitched your cart to? The intelligence agencies, the dems, the repubs, Obama, etc... They're all out to get him. You can't honestly believe it's only the press he thinks he's being persecuted by.

    And yes, the press stories certainly aren't good. No question. Hard to spin it positive. Even Fox News, which I do watch in occasion, isn't spinning it positive. They're just changing the subject.
     
  43. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    Well yeah, there is no question that there are NeverTrumpers, government holdovers, and Establishment figures that have skins in the game for Trump's scalp. But, this is a common sense issue, I think any reasonable person understands what Trump was trying to say, and I highly doubt he would claim concretely to have been treated worse than guys who were assassinated or imprisoned. Regardless it isn't nearly as egregious as lying about soldiers dying in Benghazi or giving money to terrorists.
     
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  44. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    So you'd have no problem if the next democratic candidate running for president stated for years they had "proof" that Trump is a secretly gay muslim cleric? Of course this will be retracted eventually because who could claim that forever? And also, republicans are clearly sneaking all their children in to vote 3 times each?

    What- theres also no evidence that didn't happen. I see children at the polling stations all the time and as you said, monitoring is lax.


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  45. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    I think a proper analogy would be that they believed Trump colluded with Russia. Each theory has zero credible evidence other than hearsay and innuendo.

    To answer your question, no, I wouldn't want to take the guy's political scalp for getting swept into some silly hysteria that he later retracted before ever taking office. It could make me skeptical of him, perhaps even annoyed, but it would not approach a level to where I think unprecedented treatment of him in the news cycle is warranted (as the Harvard study shows).

    Think about this. We now have a special prosecutor to an investigation in which even the most fervent Democratic partisans like James Clapper have even admitted they have zero evidence of collusion between Russia and Trump. They are a mob in search of a crime. It's scary, scary stuff.

    Someone is bound to get Scooter Libby'ed. And that is exactly why Flynn is wisely taking his lawyers' advice and flipping the bird at the subpoenas of the Intelligence Committee. Show probable cause that a crime was committed before dishing out subpoenas and putting people under oath and dragging them into the horsesh*t. That's madness.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017 at 7:53 PM
  46. doctalaughs

    doctalaughs Member 10+ Year Member

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    You are more forgiving than I. I would (and do) think he's a clown unfit for office.

    And has nothing to do with Russia as I agree theres no direct connection yet. A lot of bungling and incompetence in handling image, but no evidence.

    I do think Trump likely did ask Comey to end the investigation of Flynn. At this point it's 1 person's word against another but Trump is a known liar and Comey seems pretty honest to a fault.


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  47. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    It's two people's word against no one's. Comey already testified under oath before Congress in May that he never felt pressure from the outside to influence any part of the investigation. He was quite clear.

    And IF he now thinks that then he has several questions to answer and credibility issues.

    And IF he were telling the truth and had an epiphany all of a sudden about the meeting in January then it likely matters little as he reports to the AG who is a Cabinet member within the Executive Branch beholden to what the Executive Branch's political agenda entails. If he disagrees with it then he can quit. He didn't quit. So the Prez didn't like him and he got canned. All legal. I would fire someone too if I had the power and I thought the person was doing me a political disservice. Any reasonable person would.

    So we can chase this down the rabbit hole. It is going nowhere just as this whole Russia thing has gone for the last 9 months.
     
  48. Pooh & Annie

    Pooh & Annie Member 10+ Year Member

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    The president. Calling the FBI director names behind closed doors. To the f&cking RUSSIANS.

    Unbelievable.
     
  49. Ignatius J

    Ignatius J 7+ Year Member

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    I think leaked conversations with foreign officials is more egregious than this. Hell, Obama was lauded this week for calling Trump a "bullsh*tter" behind closed doors. People cheered him. But wait, this is Trump. Get him!
     
  50. Hamhock

    Hamhock 7+ Year Member

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    Please tell me you read that article with even a wee bit of historical knowledge and perspective.

    Or please admit you're trolling.

    This trash is so offensive to my people, I'm not even sure where to start replying. Please re-consider your understanding of history, nearly unimaginable racial hate/violence, and the current state of SA.

    And if you are not familiar with the current state of SA relative to the 1980s, please retract your asinine post.

    (and then return to relatively insignificant posts about Trump and benign US politics)

    HH
     
  51. vm26

    vm26 Member 10+ Year Member

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    Both pretty bad and concerning. Which is worse? All depends whether one Dem/left or Rep/right...Trump got voted in (aside from collusions with Russian:eek:) partially bc people were sick of politics as usual and wanted an outsider...now things in DC are as bad as ever-partially bc of Trump's self-inflicted wounds/lack or discipline when speaking and tweeting and the left's/mainstream media's visceral hatred of him and desire to take him down, quite disheartening...2018 mid-terms should be interesting
     

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