Class of 2021 . . . how ya doin?

Veterinary Science Graduate Certificate from UofI
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SkiOtter said:
They might not have as many applicants? Or just like 0 that come on here?
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I imagine it's a combination of the fact that it's a private university in a state that has a state veterinary school (so it's likely applicants would be applying to Auburn as their IS) and a fairly small class size. They likely just don't have many SDNers represented in their classes/applicants.
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vetmedhead said:
I imagine it's a combination of the fact that it's a private university in a state that has a state veterinary school (so it's likely applicants would be applying to Auburn as their IS) and a fairly small class size. They likely just don't have many SDNers represented in their classes/applicants.
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Basically what I was saying:p
 
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SandstormDVM said:
There's been a handful of SDNers in the past who've gone to Tuskegee, but yeah not anyone really recent. I briefly considered applying there but their website is so poorly organized (or at least it was when I was applying) that it's difficult to glean ANY sort of useful information from it, so that may also have something to do with it. I'm sure it's a perfectly fine school, though.

I didn't even realize that there wasn't a c/o 2021 thread for Tuskegee; I just searched out of curiosity and the last one was for c/o 2020 and had only around 50 replies. Hrmm.
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Their website is still very poorly organized and there's hardly any information on class size or admissions statistics.

I haven't heard from any vets I know or faculty about Tuskegee's existence either, kind of amazed I managed to miss it
 
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Great Butts said:
Their website is still very poorly organized and there's hardly any information on class size or admissions statistics.

I haven't heard from any vets I know or faculty about Tuskegee's existence either, kind of amazed I managed to miss it
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I heard from one of the clinicians at K-State that Tuskegee is very poorly funded, and they're only 30 minutes from Auburn so most referral cases tend to go there, making their teaching hospital more like a regular clinic. Not that that makes them a bad school, but it may explain why they're less well-known.
 
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LyraGardenia said:
I heard from one of the clinicians at K-State that Tuskegee is very poorly funded, and they're only 30 minutes from Auburn so most referral cases tend to go there, making their teaching hospital more like a regular clinic. Not that that makes them a bad school, but it may explain why they're less well-known.
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Ah, that makes more sense. Yeah, I'm surprised that the there are two vet schools in such close proximity to each other.
 
pawtasticbananas said:
400,000 were promised student loan forgiveness. Now they are panicking

Anyone see this yet? :(


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Yeah this has been coming for a long time. I fully expect that program to be gone before we would ever get the chance to take advantage of it. Sucks for people who are already enrolled though. If it doesn't disappear before October, I imagine it will after they realize how much collective debt they'll be forgiving just with this first group of people.
 
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pawtasticbananas said:
400,000 were promised student loan forgiveness. Now they are panicking

Anyone see this yet? :(


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Yep. The vast majority of vets don't qualify for PSLF anyway, but it's nice for (some of) the ones in academia and non-profit work.

Changing income-based repayment is a lot scarier. The administration wants to increase IBR payments from 10% to 12.5% and forgive the rest after 30 years instead of 25 (with a big tax bill, of course): Trump and DeVos plan to reshape higher education finance. Here’s what it might mean for you.

But what actually happens is anyone's guess. Over 25 or 30 years, a lot could happen- good or bad.

SandstormDVM said:
I'm really hoping that the collective heart attack the government is going to have once they see the amount of money that would be forgiven to this first cohort eligible for that serves as a wakeup call and brings about some fundamental changes in the federal student loan system as a whole... but I doubt it.

I actually feel really awful for those who were enrolled in the program and were relying on it being there to be able to live a semi-normal life. I understand getting rid of PLSF for new borrowers, but it bites that it sounds like the government isn't going to make good on the promise of forgiveness made to those already enrolled. Though, from what I have heard through rumors (so take this with a grain of salt), the program really was meant for teachers and similarly generally poor paying public positions moreso than it was for professional school graduates like MDs, DVMs, and JDs because they expect us to be able to make enough to pay off our loans---clearly we can't, especially those vets working in such worklplaces that would actually qualify them for PLSF. It's really just a symptom of a much larger issue. And it's probably not going to get any better anytime soon. Ugh.
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Absolutely. The problem is the completely out of control cost of education, and repayment programs treat the symptom but not the cause.

Something like PSLF makes sense for social workers, public defenders, etc. but not for the majority of people who want to use it. I support alternative payment programs, but PSLF isn't a good one.

I hope people will be grandfathered in, but I also hope this is a wakeup call for people starting to take out loans. Minimize the amount. Expect to pay them in full (or at least have a plan for that).

Oh, and both direct unsubsidized and grad PLUS interest rates are going up in July. Yay.

@SandstormDVM (or anyone else with current grad school loans) does your master promissory note say anything about these programs? I've heard mixed things- some people are saying that the MPN mentions repayment programs so everyone will be grandfathered in, but I've also heard that it says those programs can be changed at any time so we're totally at the government's mercy.
 
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Coopah said:
Oh crap, to what 9%? I kid you not that was the interest rate on some of my undergrad loans :hurting:
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Not that bad! But still bad. I haven't seen anything about loan fees going up- I hope they're not.

Graduate students can also expect to pay higher financing costs after July 1.

They will pay 6 percent for a direct unsubsidized loan — which begins accruing interest as soon as the borrower takes out the loan — an increase from 5.31 percent this year.

Finally, rates on direct PLUS loans, which both graduate students and parents of undergrads can use, will rise to 7 percent from last year's 6.31 percent.
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Federal student loan rates to jump starting July 1
 
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dyachei said:
they were 6.8% when I went to vet school (for the staffords).
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Ouch :eek:. I doubt anything will change over the course of the next decade but I hold out some hope that someone progressive will realize that having such high tuition costs will eventually lead to only the rich getting education at this high of a level. Just like with college many years ago.
 
SandstormDVM said:
Finally got into the system, so I'll copy and paste the sections pertaining to repayment plans.

Keep in mind that this is for Direct Subsidized (which AFAIK no longer exists as an option for professional students) and Unsubsidized Loans. I don't have any Grad PLUS, so I can't access that MPN and don't know if/how it differs.




There is also a small snippet at the end about PSLF, though I doubt any of this information is new to anyone here:
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Thanks! Yeesh that is complicated. All I can find so far is that it's "unclear" what would happen to current borrowers and, uh, I agree. They want to replace the five different repayment plans with just one, and I can definitely see how simplifying could be a good thing!

It's just a proposed budget at this point, so I think it's too early to worry much about details but I am curious.
 
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SandstormDVM said:
Trump to propose scrapping beleaguered student loan forgiveness program — report

Since we're on the subject, apparently there are lawsuits in the wings re: the possible elimination of PSLF.
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Yeah, there's already a lawsuit even if PSLF sticks around. A lot of people are freaking out about it but it's a weird scenario that applies to very few people- if you work for a 501(c)3 non-profit (most non-profits) or the government, you're covered by PSLF. The issue is people who work for a non-profit that's not a 501(c)3. Some were told their work counts, but were later told it didn't. It wasn't their mistake so I think they should still qualify for PSLF, but we'll see.

No matter what happens, PSLF is going to be a huge legal mess for everyone.
 
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TrashPanda said:
Yep. The vast majority of vets don't qualify for PSLF anyway, but it's nice for (some of) the ones in academia and non-profit work.

Changing income-based repayment is a lot scarier. The administration wants to increase IBR payments from 10% to 12.5% and forgive the rest after 30 years instead of 25 (with a big tax bill, of course): Trump and DeVos plan to reshape higher education finance. Here’s what it might mean for you.

But what actually happens is anyone's guess. Over 25 or 30 years, a lot could happen- good or bad.



Absolutely. The problem is the completely out of control cost of education, and repayment programs treat the symptom but not the cause.

Something like PSLF makes sense for social workers, public defenders, etc. but not for the majority of people who want to use it. I support alternative payment programs, but PSLF isn't a good one.

I hope people will be grandfathered in, but I also hope this is a wakeup call for people starting to take out loans. Minimize the amount. Expect to pay them in full (or at least have a plan for that).

Oh, and both direct unsubsidized and grad PLUS interest rates are going up in July. Yay.

@SandstormDVM (or anyone else with current grad school loans) does your master promissory note say anything about these programs? I've heard mixed things- some people are saying that the MPN mentions repayment programs so everyone will be grandfathered in, but I've also heard that it says those programs can be changed at any time so we're totally at the government's mercy.
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Thats a good way of keeping it in perspective.
 
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I met with my vet/mentor/ LOR writer who supposedly wrote me a stunning LOR today! First time since getting accepted. He hugged me- twice. He's really proud. I couldn't stop smiling and neither could he! Idk his excitement makes me feel that I could actually get through this.
 
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cdoconn said:
I met with my vet/mentor/ LOR writer who supposedly wrote me a stunning LOR today! First time since getting accepted. He hugged me- twice. He's really proud. I couldn't stop smiling and neither could he! Idk his excitement makes me feel that I could actually get through this.
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That's a really great feeling, isn't it?? I have only gotten to meet with 2/4 of my letter writers but had a similar meeting and it felt so good to have them feel proud of me, even though only I got though step one (getting in) of this whole process. One of my writers moved to California (so I will likely not see him for a long time, maybe ever?) and the other I just haven't had a chance to make it back to his practice, though both I have communicated with via electronically. I'm so happy for you CDO. Are you finally feeling better??
 
wallydo said:
That's a really great feeling, isn't it?? I have only gotten to meet with 2/4 of my letter writers but had a similar meeting and it felt so good to have them feel proud of me, even though only I got though step one (getting in) of this whole process. One of my writers moved to California (so I will likely not see him for a long time, maybe ever?) and the other I just haven't had a chance to make it back to his practice, though both I have communicated with via electronically. I'm so happy for you CDO. Are you finally feeling better??
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it really is such a good feeling. I've been shadowing him since I was a Sophomore in high school (6 years now). He was the vet who made me serious about vet med. It just makes me happy that he's so proud.

When you say feeling better, do you mean physically? Lungs don't hurt as much. The pneumonia seems to have cleared, which is good! Asthma is still acting up, but it's a slow process!
 
I know this has been talked about ad nauseum, but does anyone have recommendations for a stethoscope? Someone wants to gift me one, but is looking for advice on which one to get me. Seems like the usual answer is the littmann cardiology. Is there any real big difference between the 3 and the 4?

it seems like on amazon right now I can get the 3 for around half the price of the 4.
 
oh nevermind. the half priced one is the classic III not the cardiology III. anyways, still interested in any opinions.
 
mht2k3 said:
oh nevermind. the half priced one is the classic III not the cardiology III. anyways, still interested in any opinions.
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@mht2k3 ... the Littmann Cardiology III is less expensive than the Littmann Cardiology IV. The weight of the bell on the Cardio IV is lighter than the weight of the bell on the Cardio III.

I currently have a Littmann Cardio III and a Littmann Classic III: both work well for me. I think the Littmann stethoscopes are louder than the other brands of stethoscopes.

FWIW ... there is a classic saying in medicine: it is what is "between the ears" that matters (experience versus brand of stethoscope).

In other words:

Listening for the sound of a graded heart murmur will require knowledge, practice and experience.

Whenever you learn that an animal has a heart murmur, practice listening for the sound of the heart murmur in that animal (and then practice "grading" the heart murmur). Heart murmurs are graded on a scale of 1-6 (with 1 being the faintest heart murmur: it is graded as 1/6, and is commonly known as a "soft" heart murmur).

If no animals are available, you can do the same thing with any human friends who have been diagnosed with a heart murmur. Feel free to practice and fine-tune your clinical skills by "listening for and grading" heart murmurs. [By the way, a soft 1/6 can be difficult to hear - even for some cardiologists.]
 
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Doctor-S said:
@mht2k3 ... the Littmann Cardiology III is less expensive than the Littmann Cardiology IV. The weight of the bell on the Cardio IV is lighter than the weight of the bell on the Cardio III.

I currently have a Littmann Cardio III and a Littmann Classic III: both work well for me. I think the Littmann stethoscopes are louder than the other brands of stethoscopes.

FWIW ... there is a classic saying in medicine: it is what is "between the ears" that matters (experience versus brand of stethoscope).

In other words:

Listening for the sound of a graded heart murmur will require knowledge, practice and experience.

Whenever you learn that an animal has a heart murmur, practice listening for the sound of the heart murmur in that animal (and then practice "grading" the heart murmur). Heart murmurs are graded on a scale of 1-6 (with 1 being the faintest heart murmur: it is graded as 1/6, and is commonly known as a "soft" heart murmur).

If no animals are available, you can do the same thing with any human friends who have been diagnosed with a heart murmur. Feel free to practice and fine-tune your clinical skills by "listening for and grading" heart murmurs. [By the way, a soft 1/6 can be difficult to hear - even for some cardiologists.]
Click to expand...

Thanks! Do you think the Cardio is overkill for a general practitioner/LA vet? I think the person is willing to spend the money for the cardio, but not sure if it would be a waste of their money and I should suggest them getting the classic III instead
 
Doctor-S said:
@mht2k3 ... the Littmann Cardiology III is less expensive than the Littmann Cardiology IV. The weight of the bell on the Cardio IV is lighter than the weight of the bell on the Cardio III.

I currently have a Littmann Cardio III and a Littmann Classic III: both work well for me. I think the Littmann stethoscopes are louder than the other brands of stethoscopes.

FWIW ... there is a classic saying in medicine: it is what is "between the ears" that matters (experience versus brand of stethoscope).

In other words:

Listening for the sound of a graded heart murmur will require knowledge, practice and experience.

Whenever you learn that an animal has a heart murmur, practice listening for the sound of the heart murmur in that animal (and then practice "grading" the heart murmur). Heart murmurs are graded on a scale of 1-6 (with 1 being the faintest heart murmur: it is graded as 1/6, and is commonly known as a "soft" heart murmur).

If no animals are available, you can do the same thing with any human friends who have been diagnosed with a heart murmur. Feel free to practice and fine-tune your clinical skills by "listening for and grading" heart murmurs. [By the way, a soft 1/6 can be difficult to hear - even for some cardiologists.]
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Ooooh! I have a friend with a stronger diagnosed heart murmur. Poor dudes gonna get examined a lot this summer now!
 
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mht2k3 said:
Thanks! Do you think the Cardio is overkill for a general practitioner/LA vet? I think the person is willing to spend the money for the cardio, but not sure if it would be a waste of their money and I should suggest them getting the classic III instead
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If you do some searching on here and over in the vet forum, you will find several threads on this subject. I am a big advocate for going the economic route during school and buying yourself (or having someone else buy you) a nice stethoscope at or after graduation once you actually know what you are listening for and can appreciate the subtleties a nicer stethoscope can offer. Plus stethoscopes get lost and damaged during school too. Like Doctor S said, it's your experience and knowledge that makes you able to hear what you need to, not the stethoscope itself. I had a Littman classic II all through vet school and my internship and it served me just as well as classmates with fancier cardio model stethoscopes. I actually prefer it to the more expensive models, if I'm being honest, but possibly because it's what I'm 'used' to. Now that I've had a chance to use several brands of stethoscopes, I have one I prefer and it isn't even a Littman, but I didn't know that or have the skill to realize that until right around graduation.
 
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Doctor-S said:
@mht2k3 ... the Littmann Cardiology III is less expensive than the Littmann Cardiology IV. The weight of the bell on the Cardio IV is lighter than the weight of the bell on the Cardio III.

I currently have a Littmann Cardio III and a Littmann Classic III: both work well for me. I think the Littmann stethoscopes are louder than the other brands of stethoscopes.

FWIW ... there is a classic saying in medicine: it is what is "between the ears" that matters (experience versus brand of stethoscope).

In other words:

Listening for the sound of a graded heart murmur will require knowledge, practice and experience.

Whenever you learn that an animal has a heart murmur, practice listening for the sound of the heart murmur in that animal (and then practice "grading" the heart murmur). Heart murmurs are graded on a scale of 1-6 (with 1 being the faintest heart murmur: it is graded as 1/6, and is commonly known as a "soft" heart murmur).

If no animals are available, you can do the same thing with any human friends who have been diagnosed with a heart murmur. Feel free to practice and fine-tune your clinical skills by "listening for and grading" heart murmurs. [By the way, a soft 1/6 can be difficult to hear - even for some cardiologists.]
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^this.

I have a basic classic (...somewhere...), a classic II infant, a classic III and a cardio III. I use the classic III most day to day (honestly... mostly because it's lime green and I like it), and the infant one for my very small exotics. I hear lots of murmurs and can't remember the last time I pulled out my cardio.
 
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Doctor-S said:
Listening for the sound of a graded heart murmur will require knowledge, practice and experience.
Click to expand...

I dunno why it is that people always focus on heart murmurs when they talk about stethoscopes.

Lung sounds are about 10x more important to me then some silly old murmur. All a murmur means is there might be heart disease, I should recommend an echo, and I have to think slightly more - but only very slightly more - about my fluid therapy and/or anesthetic protocol.

I guess that is just the nature of my niche.

But I wish people considered lung sounds more.
 
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mht2k3 said:
Thanks! Do you think the Cardio is overkill for a general practitioner/LA vet? I think the person is willing to spend the money for the cardio, but not sure if it would be a waste of their money and I should suggest them getting the classic III instead
Click to expand...
@mht2k3 ... I like my Classic III, probably more than the Cardio III. Some of my colleagues love their Cardios III and IV, and Classic II and Classic III.

Ultimately, it's your choice. Can you try different stethoscopes before you make a decision? Schools (reps and medical supply shops) should have different samples to try. When you try them, you can figure out if you like the weight, clarity of sound, feeling, etc.

As @JaynaAli mentioned, you can purchase one stethoscope as a student, and then upgrade to something else later (e.g., when you graduate). By then, your "ears" and "medical mind" will be more fine-tuned to detecting and discerning different sounds. It's also common for stethoscopes to become "lost" or damaged (or otherwise disappear) during your school years, as well as in hospitals/clinics (even if your ID is on them). It's no fun replacing an expensive stethoscope that has vanished or been damaged when you're still a student.

My friendly suggestion: try them out, before buying.
 
LetItSnow said:
I dunno why it is that people always focus on heart murmurs when they talk about stethoscopes.

Lung sounds are about 10x more important to me then some silly old murmur. All a murmur means is there might be heart disease, I should recommend an echo, and I have to think slightly more - but only very slightly more - about my fluid therapy and/or anesthetic protocol.

I guess that is just the nature of my niche.

But I wish people considered lung sounds more.
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I have noticed that most human medicine students are challenged by heart murmurs - especially soft 1/6 murmurs. They seem to be much more challenged by heart murmurs than with lungs/abdomen although they are trained to listen for different sounds in the human body. Many times, I also listen for arterial blood flow (e.g, PAD).

My Classic III and Cardio III work well for all of the above.
 
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I guess I should technically put this in the rant thread but whatevs. This whole week has been completely soul sucking. Today was a crappy and seriously depressing day at work without a happy ending in sight. So I'm sitting here cuddling my wonderfully healthy kitty, trying to not think about all the crap. Except it's only freaking Wednesday...
 
mmmdreamerz said:
I guess I should technically put this in the rant thread but whatevs. This whole week has been completely soul sucking. Today was a crappy and seriously depressing day at work without a happy ending in sight. So I'm sitting here cuddling my wonderfully healthy kitty, trying to not think about all the crap. Except it's only freaking Wednesday...
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Survive to weekend. Be with kitty. Hope it gets better M
 
Finished the rabies series today and shelled out $836 (thanks for nothing insurance!). I feel like I should go wrestle a raccoon to justify the expense...
 
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mmmdreamerz said:
I guess I should technically put this in the rant thread but whatevs. This whole week has been completely soul sucking. Today was a crappy and seriously depressing day at work without a happy ending in sight. So I'm sitting here cuddling my wonderfully healthy kitty, trying to not think about all the crap. Except it's only freaking Wednesday...
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@mmmdreamerz ... hope things get better and the rest of your week is brighter. Sending you and your kitty good thoughts.

kittenhugs.jpg
 
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One of you. One of you.

Apparently the readmission committee met on Monday and let me back in, no meeting necessary.
 
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Coopah said:
38 and counting, we're over halfway there already and we haven't even started school yet! ;) Clearly, we are the better class, numbers don't lie!
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I call shenanigans since your thread started in December, and everyone knows that people post more before school starts than after ;)
 
WildZoo said:
I call shenanigans since your thread started in December, and everyone knows that people post more before school starts than after ;)
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Gonna need a ton of peanut butter to go with all this jelly
 
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batsenecal said:
One of you. One of you.

Apparently the readmission committee met on Monday and let me back in, no meeting necessary.
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Sorry to hear about having to repeat the grade but I'm glad to hear you're still gonna keep at it! Not gonna make a '21>'20 joke ;) , but we're glad to have you!
 
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Coopah said:
Yay! I'm so happy for you! It sucks that it happened but let's be honest, we're the better class huh?
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Now that the uncertainty is gone, I am actually really excited to be '21!

SandstormDVM said:
hhn.gif

;)

I'm happy that you were able to be readmitted, @batsenecal! I've been thinking a lot about you lately... I guess, on the bright side, all the first year material should be review for you now so hopefully you'll have a bit of an easier time?
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I'm hoping it goes better! lol. We'll have a new anatomy professor, so that should make my struggles from 1st and 4th quarter better (hopefully).

SandstormDVM said:
Oh, also! Are you still planning to come to the Welfare Judging/Assessment consortium this year?
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YYYYYYEEEEEESSSSSS!!!!! I've already started getting articles together!!!

Bottle of Bear said:
Gonna need a ton of peanut butter to go with all this jelly
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Where is a love button for this comment?

cdoconn said:
Sorry to hear about having to repeat the grade but I'm glad to hear you're still gonna keep at it! Not gonna make a '21>'20 joke ;) , but we're glad to have you!
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I'm glad to be with you!!! :D
 
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