Anyone ever had an attending push them?

[IM2GI]

Ugh what a pain. Your division sounds like amateur hour with how they are handling this situation. Where is your program director?

I know it is easy to just say "lawyer up," but I might wait and see what HRs first move is before going nuclear. I'm not a lawyer but I'm pretty sure it was dumb on their part to send you home for no other reason. You also need to make sure you get the right representation if you go that way. You want an employment lawyer with preferably experience working with house officers.

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[Asteroid Body]

Ugh what a pain. Your division sounds like amateur hour with how they are handling this situation. Where is your program director?

I know it is easy to just say "lawyer up," but I might wait and see what HRs first move is before going nuclear. I'm not a lawyer but I'm pretty sure it was dumb on their part to send you home for no other reason. You also need to make sure you get the right representation if you go that way. You want an employment lawyer with preferably experience working with house officers.

PD is the one who dismissed me from service for talking to another resident about it. I think he acted somewhat impulsively and did not run it by his superiors in the department. Typical of physician administrators.... they have no formal training in administration and most hate doing it. I am definitely an amateur employment attorney at this point but after doing some research into employment law and EEOC complaints I expected HR to at least give them some coaching about how they might be screwing up. Even if HR is for the hospital, they are not emotionally involved and would not have any interest in retaliation against me, per se, especially if I only have a few months left.

I actually have a few good references for attorneys that specialize in that area already (employment lawyer with experience working with residents and medical licensing). I know from my friends' experience that lawyers generally give you a free hour or so as consultation, after which point you pay $1000s for retainer if you need engage more with their advice. I'm holding out on getting that free advice for when I really need someone to tell me exactly what to say, or if things get complex with an HR investigation. In the meantime, I have the police report, I have ALL relevant emails backed up, even the ones that are used to arrange the in person meetings, and then I have my notes from meetings documented.

 

[anonperson]

Ugh what a pain. Your division sounds like amateur hour with how they are handling this situation. Where is your program director?

I know it is easy to just say "lawyer up," but I might wait and see what HRs first move is before going nuclear. I'm not a lawyer but I'm pretty sure it was dumb on their part to send you home for no other reason. You also need to make sure you get the right representation if you go that way. You want an employment lawyer with preferably experience working with house officers.

This program has it out for the OP.

This is her career on the line. I would strongly recommend lawyering up. I know it feels like a nuclear option but the program forced the issue with their tone deaf way they've handled things. Coupled with the fact that are going out of their way to try to bury the OP shows me they are rotten to the core.

Don't forget they have a team of lawyers and deep pockets. An overworked and underpaid resident stands no chance without legal representation.

 

[IM2GI]

This program has it out for the OP.

This is her career on the line. I would strongly recommend lawyering up. I know it feels like a nuclear option but the program forced the issue with their tone deaf way they've handled things. Coupled with the fact that are going out of their way to try to bury the OP shows me they are rotten to the core.

Don't forget they have a team of lawyers and deep pockets. An overworked and underpaid resident stands no chance without legal representation.

This person has a few weeks of residency left, and likely just wants to get out of there and start their job on time, not start a war. If they really "had it out for her" they would not have let her get weeks away from graduation.

This seems more like an isolated dingus attending that the program doesn't want to deal with.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

PD is the one who dismissed me from service for talking to another resident about it. I think he acted somewhat impulsively and did not run it by his superiors in the department. Typical of physician administrators.... they have no formal training in administration and most hate doing it. I am definitely an amateur employment attorney at this point but after doing some research into employment law and EEOC complaints I expected HR to at least give them some coaching about how they might be screwing up. Even if HR is for the hospital, they are not emotionally involved and would not have any interest in retaliation against me, per se, especially if I only have a few months left.

I actually have a few good references for attorneys that specialize in that area already (employment lawyer with experience working with residents and medical licensing). I know from my friends' experience that lawyers generally give you a free hour or so as consultation, after which point you pay $1000s for retainer if you need engage more with their advice. I'm holding out on getting that free advice for when I really need someone to tell me exactly what to say, or if things get complex with an HR investigation. In the meantime, I have the police report, I have ALL relevant emails backed up, even the ones that are used to arrange the in person meetings, and then I have my notes from meetings documented.

I'm gonna be frank for a second: I worry that you think you have it all figured out. All you have done is managed to dig yourself a deeper grave.

OP, the writing is on the wall. I don't think you really know what you are up against.

Good luck to you.

 

[Asteroid Body]

This program has it out for the OP.

This is her career on the line. I would strongly recommend lawyering up. I know it feels like a nuclear option but the program forced the issue with their tone deaf way they've handled things. Coupled with the fact that are going out of their way to try to bury the OP shows me they are rotten to the core.

Don't forget they have a team of lawyers and deep pockets. An overworked and underpaid resident stands no chance without legal representation.

I hear ya. I'll wait for a response from them, and come up with a series of questions for the lawyer, when it becomes clear the ball is in my court. No one has to know I have a lawyer, though.

I have to disagree with you though that the program has it out to get me and that they're going out of their way to bury me. Call me naive, but I think so far I've been dealing with a disorganized group of impulsive people who are annoyed by my complaint and have a lack of respect for employee rights that are normally respected in other workplaces.

 

[DokterMom]

I'm going to suggest that you hire that lawyer @Asteroid Body -- You do not need to reveal that you have one, and you certainly don't need to file suit or threaten to. But you DO need legal advice and may indeed need someone legal to negotiate a 'no negative evaluation' agreement on your behalf.

Yeah, "gossiping" was a bad idea -- unless it turns up a pattern, which it probably won't without critical mass. I can only imagine the courage it must have taken to be the first to publicly accuse Bill Cosby! All of the other residents will be similarly vulnerable, so you'll probably need a substantial number of similar experiences to get any official support from your colleagues. Are there any nurses or other staff who are willing to support your version of events? You know of the one, at least, who said something. Others?...

You may be able to get by with just the free one-hour consult and some good advice, but now is NOT the time to be cheap and take your chances...

 

[Asteroid Body]

I'm gonna be frank for a second: I worry that you think you have it all figured out. All you have done is managed to dig yourself a deeper grave.

OP, the writing is on the wall. I don't think you really know what you are up against.

Good luck to you.

I'm gonna be frank: Don't judge. I'm an anonymous person on the internet.

 

[MSTP18]

Their excuse is of course going to be that patients come first and they couldn't arrange alternate coverage on short notice. I was warned it would look bad for me if I didn't show up.

There's no such thing as sick call at your hospital?

 

[carlosc1dbz]

I stumbled on this post, wow, I don't know what I would have done as a resident in that situation. Seems so inappropriate what that attending did. I also hate how the system allows people like this to keep working, they are at fault as well if they are ignoring her behavior. I think I would talk to the lawyer and get a police report for starters.

 

[candbgirl]

OP does HR know you filed a police report? How many days are you off? Are you being paid? Was this put in writing? I mean could the PD say you have abandoned your duties when you don't show up?


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[gutonc]

I'm gonna be frank for a second: I worry that you think you have it all figured out. All you have done is managed to dig yourself a deeper grave.

OP, the writing is on the wall. I don't think you really know what you are up against.

Good luck to you.

So...wait a minute...let me get this straight. 3 hours ago you were the OP's biggest fanboy/girl. And now, for no obvious reason, you're throwing him/her to the wolves?

Nice. Keep up the good work.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

So...wait a minute...let me get this straight. 3 hours ago you were the OP's biggest fanboy/girl. And now, for no obvious reason, you're throwing him/her to the wolves?

Nice. Keep up the good work.

That's what you got from that post?

 

[Mad Jack]

If someone had done this at either of the hospitals I've spent a good amount of time at, they'd be (and have been, in fact) shown the door immediately.

 

[gutonc]

That's what you got from that post?

From all of your posts "MD/PhD Student".

Keep rollin' wit yo trollin' tho bae.

 

[Asteroid Body]

OP does HR know you filed a police report? How many days are you off? Are you being paid? Was this put in writing? I mean could the PD say you have abandoned your duties when you don't show up?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile app

I told HR about the police report but didn't give them the copy (they didn't ask). I'm being paid. It wasn't put in writing to me.

I actually consulted with HR what was the appropriate thing to do in case my PD says I abandoned my duties. I explained to this non-physician that I had some 'active cases' and I wasn't afforded time to do appropriate handoff (the truth). She advised me to address it with an email back to the PD explaining exactly the situation and what I could estimate should be done, and confirm that he would be able to address it with the trainees himself. The PD did sent me back an email confirming that he would take care of all the patients.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

This is all horribly unfortunate.

At this point, I agree I'd wait to see what their next move is. Getting a lawyer today/tomorrow isn't going to change anything. One of two things happens next.

Mentioned above is that HR will look out for the hospital. That is 100% true. So it depends what they do next.

One option is that HR contacts you, apologizes profusely, gets you back to work, tells everyone to cut it out, and disciplines the chair involved in some way (which might be private, so you might not see it at all). They also guarantee you that your record will be clean of any of this. They would do this because they realize that you could probably sue them for lots of money and negative press. Hence, it's in the hospital's best interest to fix this quickly and quietly. In that case, you GET IT IN WRITING, signed by the chair and your PD. And then you move on.

The other option HR might choose is: anything else. If anything else happens, if they want you to come in for meetings, or they want you to meet with a psychiatrist or occ med, or they tell you there's going to be some sort of a hearing -- anything at all other than a complete apology -- then you need a lawyer. And then you need to decide what you want -- do you just want a clean record, or do you want a financial payment. In all cases, they should reimburse you for your legal fees. But do not expect this road to be quick and clean -- it will be long and painful and ugly.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

OP, you may also want to consider that posting as much detail as you have may make it easier for your program to identify you here. I'd be careful.

I didn't mean to be judgemental, I actually worry for you and hope for the best.

 

[Asteroid Body]

OP, you may also want to consider that posting as much detail as you have may make it easier for your program to identify you here. I'd be careful.

I didn't mean to be judgemental, I actually worry for you and hope for the best.

All good - although I do appreciate everyone's good intentions, and support/advice is appreciated, I started this thread mostly to hear other people's stories and to let people know how it ended up working out for me, for better or for worse. I figured it would be resolved by now but unfortunately it seems not.

 

[Chelsea FC]

All good - although I do appreciate everyone's good intentions, and support/advice is appreciated, I started this thread mostly to hear other people's stories and to let people know how it ended up working out for me, for better or for worse. I figured it would be resolved by now but unfortunately it seems not.

OP I love how you been handling the situation and taking both the negative and positive criticism, hope all works out for you!

 

[xffan624]

All good - although I do appreciate everyone's good intentions, and support/advice is appreciated, I started this thread mostly to hear other people's stories and to let people know how it ended up working out for me, for better or for worse. I figured it would be resolved by now but unfortunately it seems not.

I'm sorry that my initial impressions were confirmed. I hope everything works out for you. It's an impossible and unfair situation for you to be in. I haven't been in your exact situation but I have been in one where I knew that some of my senior leaders had it out for me and it's extremely stressful. I ultimately didn't fight and just kept my head down and focused on my job until things got better. Unfortunately, I don't think that option will be available for you. Do what you need to do with HR and seeking out legal counsel, but as you've already learned don't give them any ammunition to attack your reputation.

 

[rokshana]

I told HR about the police report but didn't give them the copy (they didn't ask). I'm being paid. It wasn't put in writing to me.

I actually consulted with HR what was the appropriate thing to do in case my PD says I abandoned my duties. I explained to this non-physician that I had some 'active cases' and I wasn't afforded time to do appropriate handoff (the truth). She advised me to address it with an email back to the PD explaining exactly the situation and what I could estimate should be done, and confirm that he would be able to address it with the trainees himself. The PD did sent me back an email confirming that he would take care of all the patients.

make sure you bcc or forward that email to HR as well as bcc to another email that the program does not have access to anything and everything you have discussed, emailed, etc. That way if you "lose" access to your email at work you have a copy.

personally, i think it was a good move to get HR involved..yes, they have the hospital as their interest...and that does not necessarily mean protecting an attending (even if they are chief) if they ultimately will impact the hospitals rep.

 

[Gastrapathy]

No more admissions of any partial responsibility. You aren't responsible.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

All good - although I do appreciate everyone's good intentions, and support/advice is appreciated, I started this thread mostly to hear other people's stories and to let people know how it ended up working out for me, for better or for worse. I figured it would be resolved by now but unfortunately it seems not.

It sure seems like it should be an open-and-shut case, right? If nothing else, this unfortunate situation illustrates just how much of a David v. Goliath there is in med ed.

Hang in there, OP.

 

[sohsie]

I'm not going to pretend that I know what the OP should do. However, one thing I would caution against is being defensive or apologetic about telling your co-resident what happened. Yes, it turned out to have been a bad move because of the PDs response. However, the OP did not do anything wrong in a moral or legal sense. There is no law against telling a colleague what happened to you and no one filed a restraining order forcing the OP to keep their mouth shut. If the OP is made to apologize or feel defensive about that action by anyone in the hospital, the only purpose is to use that defensiveness against the OP as an admission of guilt and to deligitamize their complaint. I would advise the OP not to give them that weapon.

 

[Asteroid Body]

So it looks like I am transferring service but am suspended until mid next week, when I have to have a meeting with both of them again. Not sure if HR has looped into them yet. In the meantime I am making sure I am prepared.

 

[Perrotfish]

So it looks like I am transferring service but am suspended until mid next week, when I have to have a meeting with both of them again. Not sure if HR has looped into them yet. In the meantime I am making sure I am prepared.

Is their official position still that you are suspended for talking to another resident about this? Or are they now saying this is about your performance as a resident on the service?

 

[Asteroid Body]

Is their official position still that you are suspended for talking to another resident about this? Or are they now saying this is about your performance as a resident on the service?

Unclear. I figured it would not be wise to press them by email for an official position, which will most likely describe the latter, whereas my personal notes, emails, and timeline strongly suggest the former.

 

[sohsie]

Unclear. I figured it would not be wise to press them by email for an official position, which will most likely describe the latter, whereas my personal notes, emails, and timeline strongly suggest the former.

Again I don't pretend to know what the best course of action is but ...

This is bad. They have retaliated against you. If you just sit out the suspension, you have essentially accepted their punishment and now you are on record as having been suspended for doing something wrong. You didn't do anything wrong. Telling another resident you were battered when you were in fact battered is not a crime or an ethics violation or a violation of any sort. They didn't suspend the attending for battering you but they suspended you for reporting a true incident to a colleague?

Keep in mind that even if you are allowed to graduate and move on, you may have to report that you were suspended every time you try to get a license or a hospital privilege. You don't want that.

I would seriously consider going back to HR right now and tell them you were suspended in retaliation which is probably at least against explicit hospital policy and that you don't accept the suspension. You expect them to cancel it and any record of it immediately and retroactively. If you wait until the suspension period ends, you have in essence accepted guilt and now you are the one at fault.

Also you unfortunately may have to consider actually pressing charges soon. The longer you wait I imagine the lower the likelihood that the police will follow through.

 

[2010houston]

I'm going to agree with above.... HR absolutely needs to know that you have now been suspended. I'm so sorry you're going through this OP. You have not done anything wrong. Don't forget that! It sounds like you're handling an incredibly bad situation quite admirably.

 

[Asteroid Body]

They didn't suspend the attending for battering you but they suspended you for reporting a true incident to a colleague?

Yes. Incredible, isn't it?

Again, no official action documented yet. Before that comes, possibly on my return, I'm definitely preparing for the worst case scenario. I don't want to discuss the details of that in public, though.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

Yes. Incredible, isn't it?

Again, no official action documented yet. Before that comes, possibly on my return, I'm definitely preparing for the worst case scenario. I don't want to discuss the details of that in public, though.

Best of luck next week. Also wise to prepare for the worst, and hope for the better outcome.

 

[Etorphine]

I would be upfront with them at this point that it has become a retaliation issue given a penalty (suspension) has been levvied against you, and if it cannot be amicably resolved it will be referred to a lawyer. Look up rulebook and see if there is a rule in place against speaking with colleagues, OR are they making up the rules as they go along. Also all emails backed up to a secondary email. Look up 2 party consent laws in your state, and I would DEFINITELY be recording conversations if legally allowed

Above all, give them an easy out to fix this. If my grey hairs have taught me anything, it is that people are lazy and take the path of least resistance. Make it easy for them, whether HR or admin, to do what you want...and have them put it in writing

 

[IM2GI]

I would be upfront with them at this point that it has become a retaliation issue given a penalty (suspension) has been levvied against you, and if it cannot be amicably resolved it will be referred to a lawyer. Look up rulebook and see if there is a rule in place against speaking with colleagues, OR are they making up the rules as they go along. Also all emails backed up to a secondary email. Look up 2 party consent laws in your state, and I would DEFINITELY be recording conversations if legally allowed

Above all, give them an easy out to fix this. If my grey hairs have taught me anything, it is that people are lazy and take the path of least resistance. Make it easy for them, whether HR or admin, to do what you want...and have them put it in writing

Until she gets her suspension in writing and signs it, this is more like paid vacation while the hospital figures out where their ass is.

This program seems like amateur hour, so treating it like a highly functioning hospital that most of us are used to seems like a mistake.

Im not sure there is a move here until the hospital makes their next play.

 

[Asteroid Body]

I would be upfront with them at this point that it has become a retaliation issue given a penalty (suspension) has been levvied against you, and if it cannot be amicably resolved it will be referred to a lawyer. Look up rulebook and see if there is a rule in place against speaking with colleagues, OR are they making up the rules as they go along. Also all emails backed up to a secondary email. Look up 2 party consent laws in your state, and I would DEFINITELY be recording conversations if legally allowed

Above all, give them an easy out to fix this. If my grey hairs have taught me anything, it is that people are lazy and take the path of least resistance. Make it easy for them, whether HR or admin, to do what you want...and have them put it in writing

Thanks for your suggestion but I am certain that throwing the L word around with any physician colleagues/superiors is a terrible idea. Recording is also a bad idea and I know it's illegal in my state anyway. The way it works, you hire a lawyer and have them initiate contact with the hospital lawyer, and they negotiate. Chances are the two lawyers already know each other assuming you are hiring a lawyer with the appropriate level of experience. Also this lifts some of the pressure off of the physician administrators, which makes them happy.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

Until she gets her suspension in writing and signs it, this is more like paid vacation while the hospital figures out where their ass is.

This program seems like amateur hour, so treating it like a highly functioning hospital that most of us are used to seems like a mistake.

Im not sure there is a move here until the hospital makes their next play.

I think the earlier they have to take you seriously, the better your overall chances. I hear your point, but waiting may only give the "amateurs" time to solidify their story one way or another.

I feel that an ounce of prevention here may be worth more than any treatment after the fact, if that makes sense.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Sounds like you have a reasonable plan going forward. There is no "right" choice -- everything has pluses and minuses. Some thoughts:

1. You could ask them whether this suspension is considered an "adverse action". If possible, you'd want to review your HR/GME policies to see exactly what specific language they use. This would clarify whether this is, in fact, punishment for some perceived wrongdoing, or a cooling off period so they can investigate and sort things out. If you want to be less confrontational about it, you can ask if the suspension is paid or unpaid -- if paid, it's likely non-adverse. If unpaid it certainly is.

2. You might want to request that someone from HR attend your upcoming meeting. This is a completely reasonable request, and it puts a (potentially independent) 3rd party in the room.

3. If they do try to place blame on you for all of this, what they might do is say: 1) This didn't happen the way you said it did; 2) You talked to others and told them what happened, which wasn't "true"; 3) This amounts to slander / a violation of the code of professional conduct. I'm not suggesting this is what actually happened, just point it out so that it doesn't take you by surprise. Your response to this line of inquiry would simply be that you didn't feel safe bringing it to the attention of your PD/Chair. Their response is that you should have, privately, brought it to HR's or someone else's attention. In any case, I think you're best off focusing on the fact that you told someone else because you were scared, didn't know what to do, and was looking for advice. Not to "spread the word". Also probably best to stay away from "I was asking around to see if this is common practice, so I'd know whether to report it or not" -- they will argue that's HR's job and not yours.

Like others, I wish you the best. Hopefully they will simply sort this out. Perhaps it will change future behavior.

I don't think that pursuing legal charges through the court system will be very fruitful, unless you have a clear witness. Else it will be your word against theirs. So I'd focus on the retaliatatory issues here -- that's easier to prove, and a much deeper legal hole for them to fall into.

 

[rokshana]

Sounds like you have a reasonable plan going forward. There is no "right" choice -- everything has pluses and minuses. Some thoughts:

1. You could ask them whether this suspension is considered an "adverse action". If possible, you'd want to review your HR/GME policies to see exactly what specific language they use. This would clarify whether this is, in fact, punishment for some perceived wrongdoing, or a cooling off period so they can investigate and sort things out. If you want to be less confrontational about it, you can ask if the suspension is paid or unpaid -- if paid, it's likely non-adverse. If unpaid it certainly is.

2. You might want to request that someone from HR attend your upcoming meeting. This is a completely reasonable request, and it puts a (potentially independent) 3rd party in the room.

3. If they do try to place blame on you for all of this, what they might do is say: 1) This didn't happen the way you said it did; 2) You talked to others and told them what happened, which wasn't "true"; 3) This amounts to slander / a violation of the code of professional conduct. I'm not suggesting this is what actually happened, just point it out so that it doesn't take you by surprise. Your response to this line of inquiry would simply be that you didn't feel safe bringing it to the attention of your PD/Chair. Their response is that you should have, privately, brought it to HR's or someone else's attention. In any case, I think you're best off focusing on the fact that you told someone else because you were scared, didn't know what to do, and was looking for advice. Not to "spread the word". Also probably best to stay away from "I was asking around to see if this is common practice, so I'd know whether to report it or not" -- they will argue that's HR's job and not yours.

Like others, I wish you the best. Hopefully they will simply sort this out. Perhaps it will change future behavior.

I don't think that pursuing legal charges through the court system will be very fruitful, unless you have a clear witness. Else it will be your word against theirs. So I'd focus on the retaliatatory issues here -- that's easier to prove, and a much deeper legal hole for them to fall into.

number 2 is a a great idea OP (the rest are too )

 

[Apollyon]

number is a a great idea OP (the rest are too )

Yeah, number is a great idea! (I think you need to edit to say to which one you refer!)

 

[MSTP18]

I think it's pretty much a necessity that you clarify whether or not this suspension is paid because if you have been placed on an unpaid leave this has become a very different situation than it was before.

 

[anonperson]

Would a suspension like this cause the OP to have a delayed graduation date?
Since it is at the end of the year, I would assume they have used their PTO. If not, shouldn't be an issue, but a thought that came to my mind.

Would something like this have to be disclosed for licensing or credentialing purposes?

Again, don't know the answer myself but just some questions I had.

 

[rokshana]

Yeah, number is a great idea! (I think you need to edit to say to which one you refer!)

what i get for posting form my phone...

 

[Asteroid Body]

Sounds like you have a reasonable plan going forward. There is no "right" choice -- everything has pluses and minuses. Some thoughts:

1. You could ask them whether this suspension is considered an "adverse action". If possible, you'd want to review your HR/GME policies to see exactly what specific language they use. This would clarify whether this is, in fact, punishment for some perceived wrongdoing, or a cooling off period so they can investigate and sort things out. If you want to be less confrontational about it, you can ask if the suspension is paid or unpaid -- if paid, it's likely non-adverse. If unpaid it certainly is.

2. You might want to request that someone from HR attend your upcoming meeting. This is a completely reasonable request, and it puts a (potentially independent) 3rd party in the room.

3. If they do try to place blame on you for all of this, what they might do is say: 1) This didn't happen the way you said it did; 2) You talked to others and told them what happened, which wasn't "true"; 3) This amounts to slander / a violation of the code of professional conduct. I'm not suggesting this is what actually happened, just point it out so that it doesn't take you by surprise. Your response to this line of inquiry would simply be that you didn't feel safe bringing it to the attention of your PD/Chair. Their response is that you should have, privately, brought it to HR's or someone else's attention. In any case, I think you're best off focusing on the fact that you told someone else because you were scared, didn't know what to do, and was looking for advice. Not to "spread the word". Also probably best to stay away from "I was asking around to see if this is common practice, so I'd know whether to report it or not" -- they will argue that's HR's job and not yours.

Like others, I wish you the best. Hopefully they will simply sort this out. Perhaps it will change future behavior.

I don't think that pursuing legal charges through the court system will be very fruitful, unless you have a clear witness. Else it will be your word against theirs. So I'd focus on the retaliatatory issues here -- that's easier to prove, and a much deeper legal hole for them to fall into.

All good points. To recap the events until now... I got pushed by an attending, told my PD/chair immediately and requested to change services, filed a police report, met with PD/chair again to be told I could not have time off and could not be transferred, returned to her service for a few days and told another resident on the service, then was dismissed home (first for a few days, now a week) because my PD heard that I was talking about it. I contacted HR only once I was sure that this was being entirely mishandled by my PD and chair and that I would potentially be disciplined. Because as someone mentioned, it is ridiculous that an attending can be physically aggressive with a resident and not be suspended, while the resident gets suspended for talking about it.

Amongst the other things I am preparing for in my return meeting are that they will force me to sign something like a confidentiality agreement, or some other disciplinary document that retrospectively constructs a pattern of unprofessional behavior prior to the incident that would justify disciplinary action such as probation. If you haven't heard of something called a "peer review" and possible abuse of this legal process in hospital settings, I suggest you look it up.

So if I fall off the radar at some point, you can assume that confidentiality agreement has been signed but at least I have kept my job...

 

[rokshana]

All good points. To recap the events until now... I got pushed by an attending, told my PD/chair immediately and requested to change services, filed a police report, met with PD/chair again to be told I could not have time off and could not be transferred, returned to her service for a few days and told another resident on the service, then was dismissed home (first for a few days, now a week) because my PD heard that I was talking about it. I contacted HR only once I was sure that this was being entirely mishandled by my PD and chair and that I would potentially be disciplined. Because as someone mentioned, it is ridiculous that an attending can be physically aggressive with a resident and not be suspended, while the resident gets suspended for talking about it.

Amongst the other things I am preparing for in my return meeting are that they will force me to sign something like a confidentiality agreement, or some other disciplinary document that retrospectively constructs a pattern of unprofessional behavior prior to the incident that would justify disciplinary action such as probation. If you haven't heard of something called a "peer review" and possible abuse of this legal process in hospital settings, I suggest you look it up.

So if I fall off the radar at some point, you can assume that confidentiality agreement has been signed but at least I have kept my job...

you need to make sure that it doesn't preclude you from reporting to the police if it were to happen again...which in any event would not be enforceable anyway, but would be a pain to fight.

but NO unprofessional behavior from a resident would condone physical action from any one...period.

good luck.

 

[sohsie]

All good points. To recap the events until now... I got pushed by an attending, told my PD/chair immediately and requested to change services, filed a police report, met with PD/chair again to be told I could not have time off and could not be transferred, returned to her service for a few days and told another resident on the service, then was dismissed home (first for a few days, now a week) because my PD heard that I was talking about it. I contacted HR only once I was sure that this was being entirely mishandled by my PD and chair and that I would potentially be disciplined. Because as someone mentioned, it is ridiculous that an attending can be physically aggressive with a resident and not be suspended, while the resident gets suspended for talking about it.

Amongst the other things I am preparing for in my return meeting are that they will force me to sign something like a confidentiality agreement, or some other disciplinary document that retrospectively constructs a pattern of unprofessional behavior prior to the incident that would justify disciplinary action such as probation. If you haven't heard of something called a "peer review" and possible abuse of this legal process in hospital settings, I suggest you look it up.

So if I fall off the radar at some point, you can assume that confidentiality agreement has been signed but at least I have kept my job...

Didn't you say in a previous post that there were witnesses who approached your supervisors about the incident?

I think you need to stress to everyone you interact with that this is not a she said / she said but rather there are independent witnesses who already came forward to report what happened. Independent witnesses don't make it their business to report a "routine" dressing down by an attending.

You should not be accepting any punishment. The hospital should be the ones thanking their stars that you haven't pressed charges.

 

[Light at end of tunnel]

Didn't you say in a previous post that there were witnesses who approached your supervisors about the incident?

I think you need to stress to everyone you interact with that this is not a she said / she said but rather there are independent witnesses who already came forward to report what happened. Independent witnesses don't make it their business to report a "routine" dressing down by an attending.

You should not be accepting any punishment. The hospital should be the ones thanking their stars that you haven't pressed charges.

I worry that OP hesitated a bit much earlier on when perhaps more definite action would have been appropriate. We overlook how easily a paper trail can be created to support just about any action taken by a program or a hospital.

The program has spun the situation such that the OP is somehow at fault (on paper at least, which is all that matters), and that is terrifying.

 

[Asteroid Body]

I worry that OP hesitated a bit much earlier on when perhaps more definite action would have been appropriate. We overlook how easily a paper trail can be created to support just about any action taken by a program or a hospital.

The program has spun the situation such that the OP is somehow at fault (on paper at least, which is all that matters), and that is terrifying.

Agreed. Although I might not have immediately pressed charges, I probably should have called HR sooner, they probably would have at least had me transfer services away from the abusive attending while everything was sorted out.

However, I think as long as I stick with my story and there are witnesses, even if it is too late for the witnesses to come forward, that will need to be one hell of a paper trail to generate prospectively that would discredit my story and justify any adverse action. Like, Adolf Hitler-tier colossal lies. Because I've been in the program for awhile now without issues. They will need to put together something that makes it sounds like I was making this all up because I was about to get a bad grade or something...

 

[NotAProgDirector]

You should not sign anything in the meeting if possible. If they ask you to sign something, you should request 48 hours to review it. Even if it looks benign, request 24-48 hours to review it. You should not sign away your right to grieve whatever decision they are making, speak to anyone, etc. If they threaten you -- i.e. "if you don't sign this, you're fired", you'll need to decide what to do. I'd still push for 24 hours to review it. It they threaten you like that, they are probably in the wrong and trying to make you make a bad decision. But if they follow through with their threat, although you'd be "right", you'll have a long legal battle ahead of you.

 

[sohsie]

You should not sign anything in the meeting if possible. If they ask you to sign something, you should request 48 hours to review it. Even if it looks benign, request 24-48 hours to review it. You should not sign away your right to grieve whatever decision they are making, speak to anyone, etc. If they threaten you -- i.e. "if you don't sign this, you're fired", you'll need to decide what to do. I'd still push for 24 hours to review it. It they threaten you like that, they are probably in the wrong and trying to make you make a bad decision. But if they follow through with their threat, although you'd be "right", you'll have a long legal battle ahead of you.

Don't ask for 24-48 hours because then you are starting your negotiation at 24 hours. Ask for 48 hours (or better yet 72) and decide for yourself what amount of time you will settle for if they don't agree.

 

[hello1234!]

One thing I find maddening is that when you reported a battery, they didn't immediately remove you from the perpetrator, but they can somehow magically spare you from service when it's a disciplinary action ... ...

Also, you did not deserve this and this is not your fault.